Infallible Authority Of The Church.

[Xeno.of.athens]

Ah so Catholocism is a lot more sabbitarian than I thought. Is there some sort of decree that if you don't you're anathema? Are Catholics allowed to work during the Catholic sabbath?

Sunday is not a sabbath, it is the Lord's day. And this thread is not about sabbaths, but it is about the authority of the Church.

 

[Fervent]

It's not about adopting a religion, it's a matter of being a member of the body of Christ and having a healthy amount of common ground with your fellow members of the body.

It's also a matter of humility. The Bible is a big, complicated book that no one person is capable of understanding on their own. Chances are, if you've got a novel interpretation of it you're reading into it. We live in a tradition, the Bible is born from the tradition, and can only be understood within the confines of that tradition.

 

[Servus]

Sunday is not a sabbath, it is the Lord's day. And this thread is not about sabbaths, but it is about the authority of the Church.

Yeah and I'm wondering how much authority the Catholic church exerts over members to attend a service every Sunday. Do you want to answer or should I look it up and probably get the usual "let him be anathema!"?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Yeah and I'm wondering how much authority the Catholic church exerts over members to attend a service every Sunday. Do you want to answer or should I look it up and probably get the usual "let him be anathema!"?

Deliberate refusal to attend Sunday mass is self-excommunication unless there is a sound reason for non-attendance. Health, or partner's health, or child's health, or a number of other reasons are sound.

By the way "let him be anathema" means "he is excommunicated".

 

[AlightSeeker]

Deliberate refusal to attend Sunday mass is self-excommunication unless there is a sound reason for non-attendance. Health, or partner's health, or child's health, or a number of other reasons are sound.

By the way "let him be anathema" means "he is excommunicated".

Jesus won't kick me out. I've built my house on a rock. He lives in me.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Jesus won't kick me out. I've built my house on a rock. He lives in me.

Do not presume on God's grace; not even Jesus did that when temped by the devil to jump off the pinnacle of the temple.

 

[AlightSeeker]

It's also a matter of humility. The Bible is a big, complicated book that no one person is capable of understanding on their own. Chances are, if you've got a novel interpretation of it you're reading into it. We live in a tradition, the Bible is born from the tradition, and can only be understood within the confines of that tradition.

I disagree. It's the word that we love. And then God loves us. That's what Jesus said. And we love the apostles too because they have the word. Their example and God's word is what I love. They teach me. The Lord is good to me. He loves me and I love him. I wished I had people like me to fellowship with. Not thinking a church building or physical contact s necessarily but seeking God who is a spirit and is carried in our heart. I can't attend church. But has God's arm been too short to save, love and help me? Surely not. I'm so blessed and want to boast in him. Because he is so good to me. He teaches me his ways. He puts a mystery in front of me. He's such a good teacher. I love his word. His word is my treasure and his spirit my friend.

 

[AlightSeeker]

And isn't that what the kingdom is about? Righteousness, peace and joy in the spirit?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

I disagree. It's the word that we love. And then God loves us. That's what Jesus said. And we love the apostles too because they have the word. Their example and God's word is what I love. They teach me. The Lord is good to me. He loves me and I love him. I wished I had people like me to fellowship with. Not thinking a church building or physical contact s necessarily but seeking God who is a spirit and is carried in our heart. I can't attend church. But has God's arm been too short to save, love and help me? Surely not. I'm so blessed and want to boast in him. Because he is so good to me. He teaches me his ways. He puts a mystery in front of me. He's such a good teacher. I love his word. His word is my treasure and his spirit my friend.

That's not right!

It is God who loved us first, after that love was manifested in the person of the Lord, Jesus Christ, we learned to love God because God's Spirit, the Holy Spirit, came into our hearts and we were given life in and from Christ. That is how it works, the scriptures are not the cause of the birth from above, nor are the scriptures the source of our life in Christ; what the scriptures are is a guide and lessons in the truth that help us to grow into the maturity that Christ calls us to.

 

[Fervent]

I disagree. It's the word that we love. And then God loves us. That's what Jesus said. And we love the apostles too because they have the word. Their example and God's word is what I love. They teach me. The Lord is good to me. He loves me and I love him. I wished I had people like me to fellowship with. Not thinking a church building or physical contact s necessarily but seeking God who is a spirit and is carried in our heart. I can't attend church. But has God's arm been too short to save, love and help me? Surely not. I'm so blessed and want to boast in him. Because he is so good to me. He teaches me his ways. He puts a mystery in front of me. He's such a good teacher. I love his word. His word is my treasure and his spirit my friend.

I'm not sure what it is you disagree with, exactly. The tradition serves as a control, because I know that in my own spirit I can easily be led astray. But in a community of faith, we will not all be led astray in the same fashion. So through humbly submitting to those who have come before me, I find the true meaning of what Christ has said. I don't know enough Greek or Hebrew to produce a translation on my own, and I do not have the time to piece together the manuscripts to determine what the most probably Greek or Hebrew is. So I must rely on my fellow Christians to produce for me a Bible that is sensible to me, that I may then read and understand. So I cannot divorce myself from the church, because I would not know Christ apart from her.

 

[AlightSeeker]

That's not right!

It is God who loved us first, after that love was manifested in the person of the Lord, Jesus Christ, we learned to love God because God's Spirit, the Holy Spirit, came into our hearts and we were given life in and from Christ. That is how it works, the scriptures are not the cause of the birth from above, nor are the scriptures the source of our life in Christ; what the scriptures are is a guide and lessons in the truth that help us to grow into the maturity that Christ calls us to.

Yes indeed. But In his love he said that he wants us to love him by keeping his words and the father will love us. It's his way.

 

[Servus]

.

 

[AlightSeeker]

That's not right!

It is God who loved us first, after that love was manifested in the person of the Lord, Jesus Christ, we learned to love God because God's Spirit, the Holy Spirit, came into our hearts and we were given life in and from Christ. That is how it works, the scriptures are not the cause of the birth from above, nor are the scriptures the source of our life in Christ; what the scriptures are is a guide and lessons in the truth that help us to grow into the maturity that Christ calls us to.

I noticed that Paul doesn't talk much about love for God. He always tell us to love though. His specific command is to love each other. So where is love for God? Dont we love him too? We see love for God in things like idolatry and adultery that we are warned against. But it's not love they teach but wrath. Don't disobey or you will face judgment. But they teach the chast virgin of the church too. Thats love for God. Dont do it just to avoid wrath but to love God. I suppose Grace itself teaches us to love God. As you said we love him because he loved us. But unfaithfulness is not love. Look at Hosea who married an unfaithful wife to show God's heart. We must grieve him like an unfaithful wife. He showed love for us by buyng us out of our bondage like Hosea did his unfaithful wife. We of course see this through Christ's Work

 

[AlightSeeker]

I'm not sure what it is you disagree with, exactly. The tradition serves as a control, because I know that in my own spirit I can easily be led astray. But in a community of faith, we will not all be led astray in the same fashion. So through humbly submitting to those who have come before me, I find the true meaning of what Christ has said. I don't know enough Greek or Hebrew to produce a translation on my own, and I do not have the time to piece together the manuscripts to determine what the most probably Greek or Hebrew is. So I must rely on my fellow Christians to produce for me a Bible that is sensible to me, that I may then read and understand. So I cannot divorce myself from the church, because I would not know Christ apart from her.

But some are lead astray. They are not faithful to God. I am. God knows that I am. He knows my tears and my struggles. He knows my heart. He is in me and i will not stray. I show his great love. Even me he saves and loves.

 

[Fervent]

But some are lead astray. They are not faithful to God. I am. God knows that I am. He knows my tears and my struggles. He knows my heart. He is in me and i will not stray. I show his great love. Even me he saves and loves.

You, but not the majority of Christendom?

 

[AlightSeeker]

I'm not sure what it is you disagree with, exactly. The tradition serves as a control, because I know that in my own spirit I can easily be led astray. But in a community of faith, we will not all be led astray in the same fashion. So through humbly submitting to those who have come before me, I find the true meaning of what Christ has said. I don't know enough Greek or Hebrew to produce a translation on my own, and I do not have the time to piece together the manuscripts to determine what the most probably Greek or Hebrew is. So I must rely on my fellow Christians to produce for me a Bible that is sensible to me, that I may then read and understand. So I cannot divorce myself from the church, because I would not know Christ apart from her.

Paul said our faith should not be in the wisdom of man, .not religion but God's power. The power of his spirit. You have no faith in that it seems. I dont blame you. I believe only because I see it.

 

[Fervent]

Paul said our faith should not be in the wisdom of man, .not religion but God's power. The power of his spirit. You have no faith in that it seems. I dont blame you. I believe only because I see it.

You presume too much when you deem yourself fit to judge another's servant.

 

[AlightSeeker]

You, but not the majority of Christendom?

I dont know what the majority does other than their politics that I know is wrong. It leads us astray in every way. I know only what God has done for me.

 

[AlightSeeker]

You presume too much when you deem yourself fit to judge another's servant.

OK then. I stand corrected but I didn't judge you. I said it seems that way. I said thats how it looks. But if have experienced it too then why doubt it in me?

 

[Fervent]

OK then. I stand corrected but I didn't judge you. I said it seems that way. I said thats how it looks. But if have experienced it too then why doubt it in me?

You appear to put far too much faith in your own person, as if no one else has had personal encounters with God.