Without mentioning Trump or Democracy, why do you support Joe Biden for President.

[YorkieGal]

I am not a Trump supporter, but to say that Biden is in better shape than him is manifestly wrong

Biden trips, gets lost on stage, avoids press conferences and public appearances, forgets things, and makes silly statements. He appears glassy-eyed

We can laugh about the silly things he says, but some of it has consequences. He was told not to call Xi Xinping a dictator after their latest summit, and went ahead and called the guy a dictator anyway. Last year he came right out and said the US would send in troops to defend Taiwan--which was not official policy. Dumb comments like this can cause WWIII

Even Obama viewed Joe as basically incompetent and corrupt

I don't like Gavin Newsom at all, but I would be a lot more comfortable with him in the Whitehouse than Joe. We can't have the US run by a guy who isn't physically or mentally fit for office. It is irresponsible and cynical for Democrats to continue to support him

In some ways, I'm glad Biden is in office.

He has shown to the world that the US is not run by the public leadership put on display. They are all mouth pieces dancing to the true leaders agenda.

Now, we have to decide what to do with that information.

It just sucks to have been born in what most see as the downfall of the US.

Now I understand how the Romans, passionate about their own republic, must have felt.

 

[probinson]

Yeah, World News Daily and whatshisname... um.. Tucker Carlson. There's a difference, although it's probably lost on some on the far right...

This is what the real thing looks like...
Some social media users pointed out what they interpreted as an awkward moment between former President Donald Trump and swimmer Riley Gaines at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) on Saturday in Dallas.
...
Trump tried to kiss her on the cheek when she approached the podium, but she appeared in the eyes of many observers to experience some discomfort with it. Political commentator and attorney Ron Filipkowski described her as flinching and pulling away from the ex-president on Twitter on Sunday.

Trump's Kiss Attempt on Swimmer Riley Gaines Creates Awkward CPAC Moment

The ex-president tried to kiss the swimmer on the cheek as she approached the podium, who appeared by some observers to be uncomfortable.

www.newsweek.com

Now, that's creepy. And no one had to put up an edited fake; the real thing is creepy enough.

Whatbouttrump seems to be your retort for every awkward, weird, bizarre, concerning thing Biden does.

Sniffing people's hair is creepy. Even our friends down under in Australia know it.

 

[probinson]

It used to be amazing that you can't present an argument without misrepresenting what other say. But now, we pretty much expect that from you.

We? Do you have a mouse in your pocket?

You implied that "anyone" who has ridden a bike has fallen at some point when dismounting a stationary bike. This is patently false.

It is concerning to watch the President of the United States inability to get off a bike without falling down. And to watch him trip multiple times while trying to board a plane. And to watch him wander aimlessly wondering how to get off a platform after a speech.

 

[The Barbarian]

Whatbouttrump seems to be your retort for every awkward, weird, bizarre, concerning thing Biden does.

Just showing you what "creepy" actually is. Trump attempted yet again to force a kiss on a woman who didn't want it. It's not a surprise; as you know, Trump has been found to have committed sexual assault and has bragged about how he gets away with it. If you don't want it discussed, it's probably a bad idea to bring up the issue.

You implied that "anyone" who has ridden a bike has fallen at some point when dismounting a stationary bike.

Let's see how you misrepresented what I said...

It's amazing that you don't believe it's possible for someone to dismount a bike without falling on their face.

I think sometimes you get overexcited and type out things like this without thinking. More reflexive than deliberately dishonest, I think.

 

[The Barbarian]

In some ways, I'm glad Biden is in office.

He has shown to the world that the US is not run by the public leadership put on display. They are all mouth pieces dancing to the true leaders agenda.

Now, we have to decide what to do with that information.

It just sucks to have been born in what most see as the downfall of the US.

Now I understand how the Romans, passionate about their own republic, must have felt.

Ironically, the end of the Roman republic came about by mobs, while the mob failed in their attempt to take down the American republic. Biden is hated by some of them precisely because he has repeatedly outsmarted them.

 

[YorkieGal]

Ironically, the end of the Roman republic came about by mobs, while the mob failed in their attempt to take down the American republic. Biden is hated by some of them precisely because he has repeatedly outsmarted them.

Interesting perspective.

 

[The Barbarian]

I am not a Trump supporter, but to say that Biden is in better shape than him is manifestly wrong

Biden is visibly trim. Trump is increasingly overweight and clumsy.
Biden rides bicycles. Trump needs assistance going down a ramp.
Biden beat Trump soundly in a series of debates.
Biden stutters. Trump walks out of a bill signing, having forgotten what he was there for and Pence had to go find him and bring him back.
Biden once got unemployment number wrong. Trump thinks windmills cause cancer, and that George Washington seized airports at Yorktown

We can laugh about the silly things he says, but some of it has consequences. He was told not to call Xi Xinping a dictator after their latest summit, and went ahead and called the guy a dictator anyway.

You didn't know? Xi is a dictator. That's not silly; it's calling it as it is. Yes, I know Trump kowtowed to Xi and Kim, but it isn't a good idea.

Even Obama viewed Joe as basically incompetent and corrupt

And yet Biden has rather effectively countered republican attempts to derail his agenda. McCarthy got tossed out by the far right precisely because Biden so easily out smarted him.

 

[The Barbarian]

Ironically, the end of the Roman republic came about by mobs, while the mob failed in their attempt to take down the American republic. Biden is hated by some of them precisely because he has repeatedly outsmarted them.

Interesting perspective.

MAGA incompetently attempted the insurrection. They were even planning it on social media, and many of the mob were taking and posting video, incriminating themselves and others. Next time, they could do a better job.

 

[YorkieGal]

Ironically, the end of the Roman republic came about by mobs, while the mob failed in their attempt to take down the American republic. Biden is hated by some of them precisely because he has repeatedly outsmarted them.


MAGA incompetently attempted the insurrection. They were even planning it on social media, and many of the mob were taking and posting video, incriminating themselves and others. Next time, they could do a better job.

Ok. But, I don't think the fall of Rome was as a result of a singular situation.

Did you start a new thread yet so we can discuss Trump or are we just ignoring the OP request?

 

[probinson]

Just showing you what "creepy" actually is. Trump attempted yet again to force a kiss on a woman who didn't want it. It's not a surprise; as you know, Trump has been found to have committed sexual assault and has bragged about how he gets away with it. If you don't want it discussed, it's probably a bad idea to bring up the issue.

But you're ignoring all of Biden's creepiness. Why? Just because Trump is creepy doesn't preclude Biden from also being creepy. So what say you about Biden's clear and obvious creepiness?

 

[Merrill]

Biden is visibly trim. Trump is increasingly overweight and clumsy.
Biden rides bicycles. Trump needs assistance going down a ramp.
Biden beat Trump soundly in a series of debates.
Biden stutters. Trump walks out of a bill signing, having forgotten what he was there for and Pence had to go find him and bring him back.
Biden once got unemployment number wrong. Trump thinks windmills cause cancer, and that George Washington seized airports at Yorktown


You didn't know? Xi is a dictator. That's not silly; it's calling it as it is. Yes, I know Trump kowtowed to Xi and Kim, but it isn't a good idea.


And yet Biden has rather effectively countered republican attempts to derail his agenda. McCarthy got tossed out by the far right precisely because Biden so easily out smarted him.

Biden falls off his bike
Biden thinks Queen Elizabeth is still on the throne
Biden makes up stories about his life and academic record
Biden gets lost on stage and in the Whitehouse, forgets to shake hands with foreign leaders, etc.

Joe has the second lowest approval rating of any president at this point in his term in the last 80 years (38.9%--lower than Trump)

ABC News – Breaking News, Latest News and Videos

ABC News is your trusted source on political news stories and videos. Get the latest coverage and analysis on everything from the Trump presidency, Senate, House and Supreme Court.

projects.fivethirtyeight.com

The economic damage that Biden presided over, with 2 trillion dollar deficits, 34 trillion in federal debt, a debt-to-gdp ratio at 120% (which puts us in the company of 3rd world countries), soaring inflation, and incoming recession (or worse) puts him in the company of Herbert Hoover.

The median household income has declined every year Joe has been in office, as people have faced soaring food, energy, and housing costs.

It will take decades to fix all this,, and it will involved austerity measures, tax increases on all Americans, entitlement program cuts, etc. The alternative is government debt downgrades, double-digit inflation, tens of millions of jobs lost

Is Joe the only guy responsible for all this? Of course not --this is our government, and the GOP spent like drunken-sailors as well. But no president was more irresponsible with the country's finances than this guy, with the CARES act, the IRA, student-debt payment moratoriums, etc.

and then we have the catastrophic foreign policy failures of Afghanistan, Ukraine, Israel, etc.

and all of this is so bad, his family's corruption with the bribes, influence peddling, and other issues is just a side show

Biden is an international embarrassment, and unquestionably the worst president this country has ever had. Absolutely zero leadership, corrupt, incompetent

but if Trump goes up against him in 2024, he is likely to get another term (Trump is literally the only politician in the country Biden could beat in the next election). So we will get four more years of disasters, and maybe even WWIII and the extinction of the human species.

And no, you don't flippantly call a leader of a major power a "dictator" even if it is true.

 

[The Barbarian]

Biden falls off his bike

Well, that puts him in with a few tens of millions of other Americans.

Biden thinks Queen Elizabeth is still on the throne

Queen Elizabeth II “Defined An Era,” President Biden Says After UK Monarch’s Death; Expected To Attend Funeral​

Queen Elizabeth II “Defined An Era,” President Biden Says After UK Monarch’s Death; Expected To Attend Funeral

The 13th US POTUS to meet the UK's longest serving monarch calls her "a stateswoman of unmatched dignity and constancy" after her death

deadline.com

Nope.

Joe has the second lowest approval rating of any president at this point in his term in the last 80 years (38.9%--lower than Trump)

Biden's lowest approval rating was 37. Three points higher than Trump's . Granted that's a rather low bar to set, but Biden has him beat there.

Presidential Approval Ratings -- Joe Biden

Do you approve or disapprove of the way Joe Biden is handling his job as president?

news.gallup.com

The economic damage that Biden presided over, with 2 trillion dollar deficits, 34 trillion in federal debt, a debt-to-gdp ratio at 120% (which puts us in the company of 3rd world countries), soaring inflation, and incoming recession (or worse) puts him in the company of Herbert Hoover.

Well, let's look at that...
Amid the partisan standoff, a growing number of senators from both parties have also been discussing the possibility of Biden invoking a clause in the 14th Amendment that some legal scholars say allows the president to raise the debt ceiling without congressional approval.

The national debt has increased by around $3.5 trillion under the Biden administration, as data from Statista shows, currently standing at $31.46 trillion. Year-on-year the debt has never decreased since 1957, according to Treasury data.

The $1.7 trillion figure, in fact, refers to a reduction in the national deficit between fiscal years 2020 to 2022.

Fact Check: Did Joe Biden bring down national debt by $1.7 Trillion?

President Joe Biden's clash with House Republicans over the debt ceiling could lead to a default.

www.newsweek.com

While Biden lowered the federal deficit by about 1.7 trillion dollars, he's done virtually nothing about the huge deficits Trump produced.

The median household income has declined every year Joe has been in office, as people have faced soaring food, energy, and housing costs.

Hmmm.... let's take a look at that....

Real Median Household Income in the United States was 74580.00000 2015 CPI-U-RS Adjusted $ in January of 2022, according to the United States Federal Reserve. Historically, Real Median Household Income in the United States reached a record high of 74580.00000 in January of 2022 and a record low of 55828.00000 in January of 1984. Trading Economics provides the current actual value, an historical data chart and related indicators for Real Median Household Income in the United States - last updated from the United States Federal Reserve on November of 2023.​

Real Median Household Income in the United States - 2025 Data 2026 Forecast 1984-2023 Historical

Real Median Household Income in the United States was 80610.00000 2015 CPI-U-RS Adjusted $ in January of 2023, according to the United States Federal Reserve. Historically, Real Median Household Income in the United States reached a record high of 81210.00000 in January of 2019 and a record low...

tradingeconomics.com

​

You got that wrong.

It will take decades to fix all this

Well, I'm sure if Trump gets elected, he'll bring income back down.

Is Joe the only guy responsible for all this?

I'm sure he'd like to take credit for it. But the marked rise in median household income also has to do with a labor shortage. Aggravated, it is true by Biden's infrastructure bill, which put more people to work.

Biden is an international embarrassment, and unquestionably the worst president this country has ever had.

At least our allies don't laugh at Biden, as they laughed at Trump. The greatest embarrassment was Trump being laughed down when he addressed the United Nations and made such absurd claims about his accomplishments that the assembly broke up in laughter. The whole world was literally laughing at us.

unquestionably the worst president this country has ever had.

Coming after a president found by courts to have committed fraud and sexual assault, that would take some doing.

And no, you don't flippantly call a leader of a major power a "dictator" even if it is true.

I doubt if Biden or Xi thought it was flippant. It was a message. And a needed one, after Trump's fawning praise to Xi for becoming a dictator. Trump envies guys like Putin, Xi, and Kim, and wants to be like them.

 

[The Barbarian]

But you're ignoring all of Biden's creepiness.

I'm looking at your examples, and it all looks like a desperate attempt to say "well, Biden does it too." The giveaway was the fact that Trump people Photoshopped a picture to make it look like he was being creepy. If there's evidence for something, nobody would bother faking it.

 

[The Barbarian]

Ok. But, I don't think the fall of Rome was as a result of a singular situation.

The rot set in a long time before someone stepped up to take advantage of it. Caesar was the Donald Trump of his day. A very competent politician, but a mediocre administrator. Problem is, his successor, Augustus, was a lot more competent and effectively destroyed the republic. If Trump manages to overturn our Constitution, the next guy will likely be competent at exploiting that disaster.

 

[Merrill]

Well, that puts him in with a few tens of millions of other Americans.

Queen Elizabeth II “Defined An Era,” President Biden Says After UK Monarch’s Death; Expected To Attend Funeral​

Queen Elizabeth II “Defined An Era,” President Biden Says After UK Monarch’s Death; Expected To Attend Funeral

The 13th US POTUS to meet the UK's longest serving monarch calls her "a stateswoman of unmatched dignity and constancy" after her death

deadline.com

Nope.



View attachment 339369


Biden's lowest approval rating was 37. Three points higher than Trump's . Granted that's a rather low bar to set, but Biden has him beat there.

Presidential Approval Ratings -- Joe Biden

Do you approve or disapprove of the way Joe Biden is handling his job as president?

news.gallup.com

Well, let's look at that...
Amid the partisan standoff, a growing number of senators from both parties have also been discussing the possibility of Biden invoking a clause in the 14th Amendment that some legal scholars say allows the president to raise the debt ceiling without congressional approval.

The national debt has increased by around $3.5 trillion under the Biden administration, as data from Statista shows, currently standing at $31.46 trillion. Year-on-year the debt has never decreased since 1957, according to Treasury data.

The $1.7 trillion figure, in fact, refers to a reduction in the national deficit between fiscal years 2020 to 2022.

Fact Check: Did Joe Biden bring down national debt by $1.7 Trillion?

President Joe Biden's clash with House Republicans over the debt ceiling could lead to a default.

www.newsweek.com

While Biden lowered the federal deficit by about 1.7 trillion dollars, he's done virtually nothing about the huge deficits Trump produced.


Hmmm.... let's take a look at that....

Real Median Household Income in the United States was 74580.00000 2015 CPI-U-RS Adjusted $ in January of 2022, according to the United States Federal Reserve. Historically, Real Median Household Income in the United States reached a record high of 74580.00000 in January of 2022 and a record low of 55828.00000 in January of 1984. Trading Economics provides the current actual value, an historical data chart and related indicators for Real Median Household Income in the United States - last updated from the United States Federal Reserve on November of 2023.​

Real Median Household Income in the United States - 2025 Data 2026 Forecast 1984-2023 Historical

Real Median Household Income in the United States was 80610.00000 2015 CPI-U-RS Adjusted $ in January of 2023, according to the United States Federal Reserve. Historically, Real Median Household Income in the United States reached a record high of 81210.00000 in January of 2019 and a record low...

tradingeconomics.com

​

You got that wrong.


Well, I'm sure if Trump gets elected, he'll bring income back down.

I'm sure he'd like to take credit for it. But the marked rise in median household income also has to do with a labor shortage. Aggravated, it is true by Biden's infrastructure bill, which put more people to work.


At least our allies don't laugh at Biden, as they laughed at Trump. The greatest embarrassment was Trump being laughed down when he addressed the United Nations and made such absurd claims about his accomplishments that the assembly broke up in laughter. The whole world was literally laughing at us.


Coming after a president found by courts to have committed fraud and sexual assault, that would take some doing.

I doubt if Biden or Xi thought it was flippant. It was a message. And a needed one, after Trump's fawning praise to Xi for becoming a dictator. Trump envies guys like Putin, Xi, and Kim, and wants to be like them.

The US Census says the median household income dropped: "Real median household income after taxes fell 8.8% to $64,240 from 2021 to 2022 and the poverty rate after taxes as measured by the Supplemental Poverty Measure (SPM) increased 59% to 12.4%."

Income in the United States: 2022

This report presents data on income, earnings, & income inequality in the United States based on information collected in the 2023 and earlier CPS ASEC.

www.census.gov

End of Pandemic-Era Expanded Federal Tax Programs Results in Lower Income, Higher Poverty

The expiration of expansions to federal programs during COVID-19 resulted in lower post-tax household income and higher poverty rates.

www.census.gov

some of this was due to COVID-era measures ending, but most of it was due to inflation. this carried into this year

U.S. Incomes Fall for Third Straight Year

Rapid price increases hit household finances in 2022, cutting inflation-adjusted median income to $74,580.

www.wsj.com

The US Census Bureau is the official record keeper of this. So no, I didn't get it wrong--you did.

Now let's look at the federal deficits. Your 1.7 trillion deficit reduction claim is misleading and total gaslighting, because the highest deficits we reached were at the height of the COVID-19 lockdowns and stock market crash. Joe Biden is running deficits that are almost double what Trump was running at the end of 2019, before the pandemic.

Federal Surplus or Deficit [-]

Graph and download economic data for Federal Surplus or Deficit [-] (FYFSD) from 1901 to 2024 about budget, federal, and USA.

fred.stlouisfed.org

The federal deficit has increased over 300 billion just in the last few months, and are 400% higher than when Obama left office. Both Trump and Biden deserve blame for this, but to suggest Biden is doing a good job with the budget, or has reduced expenditures, is complete nonsense. Our debt-to-GDP ratio is 120% --basically WWII levels.

you can criticize presidents for being fiscally reckless, especially Trump (he was). What you cannot do is try to say Joe Biden is fiscally responsible. Trump and Obama at least had the excuses that they were dealing with national emergencies which required QE, stimulus, etc. Joe Biden just printed money and ran up deficits / debt.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Here is my opinion. Politics are mostly idolatry and not faithful to God, if not all politics, but I'm unsure if all Politics are idolatry. I know economics are idolatry in my humbled opinion. These politicians don't follow the light, even if they think that they do. If they did follow the light then they would preach God and his kingdom instead of their nation and themselves.

See here in my thread. Thank you.

Come out of her my people.

I'm just a humbled man, humbled by God, I believe. I'm not a teacher or prophet. I know nothing but what God shows me in scripture, but I dont know everything, so we need each other. I would like to share what I see. I see a church not following God. They follow politicians who lead them astray...

www.christianforums.com

 

[The Barbarian]

Now let's look at the federal deficits. Your 1.7 trillion deficit reduction claim is misleading and total gaslighting, because the highest deficits we reached were at the height of the COVID-19 lockdowns and stock market crash.

Turns out the deficits count even if there was a pandemic. Particularly since Donald Trump brought the severe consequences of the pandemic on himself. And you probably should learn what "gaslighting" means.

Gaslighting is an insidious form of manipulation and psychological control. Victims are fed false information that leads them to question their identity, memory, and sanity.

Gaslighting

Gaslighting is an insidious form of manipulation and psychological control. Victims of gaslighting are deliberately and systematically fed false information that leads them to question what they know to be true, often about themselves. They may end up doubting their memory, their perception, and...

www.psychologytoday.com

It's not your sanity that is questionable. At least not for me.

What you cannot do is try to say Joe Biden is fiscally responsible.

But we can say that Biden managed to bring the deficit down by $1.7 trillion. Whether or not you think that he was fiscally responsible to do it, it's a fact that he did it.

He did not bring the debt down. No president since Bill Clinton has managed that.

Joe Biden just printed money and ran up deficits / debt.

Just less than Donald Trump. Hence the deficit reduction. Do you understand the difference between the deficit and the debt? The graph you posted is for debt, not deficit.

 

[The Barbarian]

Here is my opinion. Politics are mostly idolatry and not faithful to God, if not all politics,

Pretty much as of late. There was a time not long ago when presidential candidates would describe their opponents as "a good man with whom I have important differences." But this is the age of political cults.

 

[AlightSeeker]

Pretty much as of late. There was a time not long ago when presidential candidates would describe their opponents as "a good man with whom I have important differences." But this is the age of political cults.

They lead us astray

 

[The Barbarian]

They lead us astray

Recognizing the good in someone you oppose is a Godly thing to do.