What is pulling America Apart?

[timothyu]

The reason our society is like the way it is is because of the behaviour of Boomers.

No, the Boomers were just at the earlier end (midpoint) of Corporatism as it gobbled up the universe and they watched their world change around them as it shrunk and became a concentrate. Those of this latest generation have no idea how many freedoms have been lost since Boomer times and not compliments of the Boomers themselves but those of all generations who have made themselves part of Corporatism. Blame the sin/system, not the sinner/generation.

 

[timothyu]

Ray Dalio's Changing World Order shows what happens to countries who spend themselves into oblivion.

Perhaps but no need to rely on books when history is all around us as a teacher.

 

[timothyu]

This idea of shipping jobs to China never set well with me in my 30s.

Ironically it was for the most part the result of environmental conditions being put on industry back in the 60's-70's. They of course got their revenge a decade or two later by making environmental issues their own in order to profit. Now the people pay for the upgrades rather than the owners.

 

[timothyu]

History is a terrible, horrible teacher, resulting in evil more and more.

Depends which side of the fence one is on. While perpetrators of evil look to find harder ways to quell dissent as we see today, those dissenters plainly see how the system has always worked and know it will eventually cave in on itself and the cycle will repeat. There has been and always will be the evil people among us who take self interest to the extremes while a miniscule population keeps God's will alive.

 

[timothyu]

Do you really believe this ?!

Absolutely. Was there listening to the whining by industry about industry having to clean up their acts while having to pay anything but child labour wages. Remember when we went from using paper bags to plastic in order to save the trees? lol Ridiculous cycles.

 

[RDKirk]

Ironically it was for the most part the result of environmental conditions being put on industry back in the 60's-70's. They of course got their revenge a decade or two later by making environmental issues their own in order to profit. Now the people pay for the upgrades rather than the owners.

Nah. Industry had already recovered their profit margins from those requirements.

It was the cost of labor, it's always been the cost of labor. Reduce labor, increase profits. That's why industry made the big shift from the Northeast to the south in the 80s...even though the federal environmental requirements were the same. They were escaping the cost of labor in the Northeast to the non-unionized South. Then, in the 90s it became possible to export labor to where it was even cheaper.

 

[Laodicean60]

Perhaps but no need to rely on books when history is all around us as a teacher.

That is a video on YouTube. I think it goes back to the Roman Empire and I was disheartened that we dummies today haven't learned from history or all the countries before us who held the reserve currency status. While studying end-time prophecy I always wondered why America's not mentioned in helping Israel. Maybe we went broke and we became a third-world country. lol The longer I live the more I see the book Revaltion unfold. Peace

 

[RoBo1988]

Well, to be fair, the framers were divided on the issue.

People will often cite quotes like the on you have above to make a claim that it was intended to be a religious nation (and we can get into the problems and pitfalls of that if you'd like) ...or the slight variation of that same sentiment which is what you expressed, which is "this limited government stuff only works if everyone believes in God"

But then neglect to mention that other framers/founders made statements like these (all made by different framers)
The Bible is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalise mankind.

The United States of America should have a foundation free from the influence of clergy.

Christianity neither is, nor ever was a part of the common law.

The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries.

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.

Lighthouses are more helpful than churches.

It's important to note that what's considered an atheist or agnostic today, would've often been referred to as a "deist" in those times. And a substantial portion of the the gentlemen who helped set up our country fit that mold.

For every John Adams and John Jay, there was a Ben Franklin and Thomas Paine.

I grew up in the late 60's early 70s. I remember friends and their families, who wouldn't tolerate fighting, foul language, etc. but never attended church, some even said they didn't believe in God.
I believe that Adams' quote means that the constitution is incompatible with anyone who cannot or will not govern themselves. I also believe his statement is coming to fruition as I write.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I grew up in the late 60's early 70s. I remember friends and their families, who wouldn't tolerate fighting, foul language, etc. but never attended church, some even said they didn't believe in God.
I believe that Adams' quote means that the constitution is incompatible with anyone who cannot or will not govern themselves. I also believe his statement is coming to fruition as I write.

...but the self-governance you're referring to also requires one to acknowledge that governance standards change over time and requires one to acknowledge that change in standards and govern themselves accordingly.

And while you're correct that those standards don't necessarily have to be religiously-rooted (although there is some overlap in a lot of case)... when the Overton Window shifts, a person who was adhering to the standard of self-governance of 30 years ago may not be anymore by not tolerating certain things, thus running afoul of the principle despite their viewpoints remaining static.

 

[RoBo1988]

..but the self-governance you're referring to also requires one to acknowledge that governance standards change over time and requires one to acknowledge that change in standards and govern themselves accordingly.

What standard changed, that we no longer respect existing laws, each other, and mind our own business? These are the essentials of self-government.

 

[mark46]

FIRST
I am a liberal Democrat in the line of Johnson, Humphrey, Clinton, Obama and Newsome. And, I would be most happy to see Haily defeat Biden.
======================================================
I am an institutionalist who believes that the divide is a recent one. In 2009, Bush met with Obama for the transition of power. There was NO animosity, only respect. Both have often spoken of the meetings. Both are friends. Their families are friends and friends with Clintons. (and with the McCains, the Doles, and with others). Working across the aisle was part of our system until January 2017.
==================
I was not really pessimistic until after January 6th (or perhaps January 13th) when it became clear that the change from Reagan conservatism to Trumpism became more that 4-year nightmare which could have EASILY been put aside by the Republicans who instead chose to double down on populism and its attack on institutions.
===================
SURE, THERE ARE ISSUES, THERE ALWAYS ARE
Democrats and the old Republicans disagree on how to deal with

border security
immigration
drug interdiction
drug use
city crime
city homelessness
healthcare
the effects of climate change
the safety net for the poor
censorship on campus and in public schools
federal regulation of abortion (I had thought that the Republicans won this debate, and moved the issue to the states; similar to capital punishment0.
federal rights for several groups

The New Republicans are not issue-based. What matters is their candidate and whether he is one of you.

 

[timothyu]

Both are friends.

Of course they are. Both know how to play the game and that game is to convince the people they actually have a say in government, however false that may be. They are all replaceable and interchangeable but still work for the same powers.

The more they convince the people they are being torn apart, the more likely it is the people will support their system which falsely claims to hold them together. It's like polluters staring industry to clean up their own pollution at someone else's expense.. Ever notice it is only the masses that are pulled apart and not the powers that be.

Not much wonder the trend is always to get people to stop thinking for themselves, be it secular or religion.

 

[Laodicean60]

Wow, I just watched the video by Gregg Braden, and he talks about the use of technology and its use to manipulate us. He mentions that they use technology for Information, Economic, Psychological, Political, Cyber, Kinetic, and Hybrid Warfare. I know a few of these. A couple of things that are scary is the use of AI to create photos that look real of wartime atrocities. Another is that there are 33 wars going on 3 of which the US has boots on the ground (Middle East?) and some 20 others in an advisory role. ( I'm going to have to do some research) It's an interesting watch.

'THE BIG SIX' & 5th Generational Warfare Who Shape Our Perspective on World Events​

 

[stevil]

Do you seriously believe that? Every Democrat in Congress, every single one, voted to repeal the Glass–Steagall Act, which led to the crisis of the early 2000s. Democrats were right there with Republicans voting for the globalization of labor, and were just as jubilant to see industry shipped to China. The Democratic Party pulled away from workers and handed them to the Republicans 20 years ago.

Democrats aren't going to change the relationship of government to corporations...that's their source of wealth as well.

Oh, I don't know, I don't live there.

From what I've seen recently (over the last 10 years) the Democratic Party have been supportive of Environmental protections, minimum wage, unions etc.

Whereas D Trump put as head of the EPA a guy that was an Oil lobbiest who just wanted to remove protection regulations.
Removed USA from the Paris agreement. It seems the Republican and Democrat parties are at opposite ends of this scale.

 

[Pommer]

Are you watching the whole world ? It is doomed. re Corrie Ten Boom in line with Scripture - "The world is under a death sentence".

So we’ve been told since forever.

Millions of babies are slaughtered every year.

Most fertilized eggs don’t become viable.

Millions of Christians are slaughtered most decades, worldwide.

Weren’t you told to expect this?

Voting has not accomplished any protection against sin in the usa,

That’s not what voting is for.

and has legally protected evil corporations, toxic pollutants, and so on.

Oh, yeah they’re problems too.

 

[Larniavc]

Blame the sin/system, not the sinner/generation.

I don’t blame them for that. I critique them for the notion that younger people today should just be like them and work hard and it’ll all fall into place.

It won’t.

 

[Confused-by-christianity]

I don’t blame them for that. I critique them for the notion that younger people today should just be like them and work hard and it’ll all fall into place.

It won’t.

I had just thought the russians (and possibly others) were playing sides against eachother over here in the west.

I also figured:

• "the algorythm" amplified the loudest and most controversial voices
• People have confused "the news" and "entertainment". When someone without passion explains boths sides of a story and doesn't try to get you emotional - you're being informed (thats news). When you're seeing all controversy and outrage - you're being entertained.

Personally - I think the idea we have of seeking and saying the truth is robust enough to withstand "the culture wars". It'll just reinforce the idea of free speech and telling the truth.

One concern that should go sooner rather than later is what i would call the cynicism in the UK. I feel that the previous generation think they had it really tough. I think they had it pretty good. (A house, car, one holiday to the coast on occasion, 1 - 1.5 jobs supporting this, children at younger age, defined benefit pensions)
They seem materialistic, leading to being cynical, leading to this insane "boxticking" culture we all have to endure.
Most people seem to grit and bear the box ticking - but they aren't true believers.
I think it's coming from this (cynical) idea that everyone is out to prosecute you and you have to cover yourself as though you're going to court.
It's a massive drain on resources and waste - the sooner we change our attitude the better.
In short - culture wars are there but will smooth out as our societial defences take effect (free speech and thirst for truth) - good philosophy.
One problem is: Materialism → cynicism → paperpushing and box ticking → parasitic energy drain - bad philosophy (destined to also disappear as most people hate it and aren't true believers).

In summary - i think we are ok. free speech and value of truth will save us.

 

[Larniavc]

I had just thought the Ruskies and possibly others were playing sides against eachother over here in the west.

More like the effects of American’s love affair with unfettered capitalism.

Bootstraps really only means ‘screw you, I got mine’.

 

[Confused-by-christianity]

More like the effects of American’s love affair with unfettered capitalism.

Bootstraps really only means ‘screw you, I got mine’.

That thinking will die off too.

We all benefit and suffer as a huge community - there is no such thing as freedom without duty.

Eventually people will accept that to hurt others is to hurt yourself.

They seem to have the secret sauce to innovation which opens a lot of doors. Eventually - it will be considered unacceptable to leave others behind.

 

[Confused-by-christianity]

More like the effects of American’s love affair with unfettered capitalism.

Bootstraps really only means ‘screw you, I got mine’.

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