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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Federal judge temporarily halts Tennessee's 'drag ban' law on free speech grounds

Aug 29, 2005
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As a general question, who do you really think is best qualified to determine what kids can see? You or their parents?
People who believe the parents are best qualified to control their children's worldly content, and we are talking about everything because in the past it was evil music, today it is Drag Queens and Taylor Swift, and tomorrow holds another attack on some new crisis, are not the ones who are looking to government to legislate morality. The answer is obvious. Just by reading comments we know which people think they know better than other parents and are actively working to use the government for control in this culture war.
 
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rambot

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1. Your opinion and I disagree but that's fine - it's okay to agree to disagree
2. see above
1. Is not my opinion. Its demonstrable fact.

Yes I agree its OK to disagree.

But it's not OK to think that your opinion that lacks evidence should be enforced or given creedence.
 
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YorkieGal

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Yes I agree its OK to disagree.

But it's not OK to think that your opinion that lacks evidence should be enforced or given creedence.
It's 100% okay. As I keep saying, whatever 'evidence' is provided will be refuted by 'evidence' on the other side. It's circular and unproductive.
 
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rambot

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It's 100% okay. As I keep saying, whatever 'evidence' is provided will be refuted by 'evidence' on the other side. It's circular and unproductive.
Well not quite. My point is that your side of the argument doesn't come up with evidence; just plattitudes.

I've seen no study that delineates harm from gender larping and reading because I dont think there is one
 
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Many parents make mistakes or intentionally subject their children to inappropriate people or places. Many would have better judgment than these people.
Sounds like an official statement from the morality police putting bad-judgement parents on notice.
 
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rambot

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Many parents make mistakes or intentionally subject their children to inappropriate people or places. Many would have better judgment than these people. I could ask you how you think that is not the case, but I don't really care because it would be a circular discussion and, as such, unproductive.

Re: your general question, see answer above.
Many parents also propagate fear, ignorance and mistrust in their children. This turns into disrespectful and hate-filled treatment of those groups. We should not have that. Bigotry and hatred are taught.


Very few parents actually subject their children to things they find offensive or inappropriate so your point is moot unless you can provide evidence contrary to that.
 
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YorkieGal

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Sounds like an official statement from the morality police putting bad-judgement parents on notice.
maybe I need a career change?
Many parents also propagate fear, ignorance and mistrust in their children. This turns into disrespectful and hate-filled treatment of those groups. We should not have that. Bigotry and hatred are taught.


Very few parents actually subject their children to things they find offensive or inappropriate so your point is moot unless you can provide evidence contrary to that.
Nah, instilling caution and good judgment in children isn't bigotry. That word gets thrown around a lot by people and it's nonsense. I have many friends who live their lives on the complete opposite spectrum of mine and we love each other. There are some of those friends I wouldn't trust my kid with because they employ different judgment than mine but that's what parents do.

Your second point: I disagree but we've already addressed that, previously
 
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YorkieGal

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I did not claim to be the morality police, and this is my day job.
Your day job is the forum?

I didn't claim to be morality police, either?

I don't think you and I are going to come through with any sort of productive discussion, though, do you?

That said, all the best.
 
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camille70

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I'm not a fan of DQSH or LGBTQ lifestyle in general, but I am a huge fan of free will so if folks want to engage in those activities or allow their children to, as long as children are not being sexually or otherwise abused, that is their business. There is a subset of the LGBT community that has a sinister agenda regarding schools and education, but the majority of people are just trying to live their lives on their own terms.

DQSH, which is not sexual at all, has nothing on carnival parades and other celebrations that are public and open to children. I have only ever seen an obvious or flamboyantly trans/person in drag out and about a handful of times. However on a daily I see tshirts with naughty to obscene slogans, women barely covered up with all their assets on display, heterosexual couples groping each other and swallowing each other's tongue in public, sexually suggestive tv shows and innuendo on regular network tv, along with profanity. Several years ago I was driving and with my nephew's wife and kids and there was a couple in the car next to us where the woman was performing oral on the male driver. (She proceeded to roll down the window and cuss them both out until they sped off then spent the next 10 minutes apologizing to me for using the language.) There is no way you can protect your children from everything. How your children respond will depend on how you respond and what you teach them. I had several family members who used colorful language growing up, but the guidance we received from my mother was we could use any word we heard HER use.

If we are going to say drag queen story hour shouldn't be allowed to exist because one of the performers was a pedophile, then by that same logic church service shouldn't be allowed to exist for the same reason. I can list story after story of church leaders preying on the congregation. As well as police officers preying on the public or committing domestic violence. The fact that many children are abused by family members or people they know, does that mean that family homes should be abolished? Of course not. We (hopefully) prosecute those responsible and make sure they never do it again.

The sooner folks realize we have to learn to peaceably share this country with people we don't like, whose religion and lifestyle we don't personally support, who may not live and love like we do, and learn to mind our own business, the better.
 
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rambot

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maybe I need a career change?

Nah, instilling caution and good judgment in children isn't bigotry. That word gets thrown around a lot by people and it's nonsense. I have many friends who live their lives on the complete opposite spectrum of mine and we love each other. There are some of those friends I wouldn't trust my kid with because they employ different judgment than mine but that's what parents do.

Your second point: I disagree but we've already addressed that, previously
ABSOLUTELY it can be bigotry. That's just silly.

Watch.

"Watch out for those black people! Protect your daughters feom the scourge of young black men who will rape your daughter"
Or
"Watch out for those gay people! Soon they are going to want the same rights as married people"
Or
"They're not sending us their bests and brightest. They're sending rapists and drug dealers"

I'm a bit surprised you don't see how teaching caution and "good judgement" (and i use the term loosely since good judgements should be based on FACTS and not opinions) cannot be bigotry. I'm not say you ARE being bigoted but sewing the seeds of distrust based on one's own under supported opinions is EXACTLY how bigotry gets handed down through generations.
Do you think racists do not think thye are teaching "good judgement" to their children? Of course they do. But their position is fundamentally undersupported by facts.
 
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YorkieGal

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ABSOLUTELY it can be bigotry. That's just silly.

Watch.

"Watch out for those black people! Protect your daughters feom the scourge of young black men who will rape your daughter"
Or
"Watch out for those gay people! Soon they are going to want the same rights as married people"
Or
"They're not sending us their bests and brightest. They're sending rapists and drug dealers"

I'm a bit surprised you don't see how teaching caution and "good judgement" (and i use the term loosely since good judgements should be based on FACTS and not opinions) cannot be bigotry. I'm not say you ARE being bigoted but sewing the seeds of distrust based on one's own under supported opinions is EXACTLY how bigotry gets handed down through generations.
Do you think racists do not think thye are teaching "good judgement" to their children? Of course they do. But their position is fundamentally undersupported by facts.
You're way too passionate to have a reasonable discussion with, IMO, and you are going on tangents which are unfounded by anything but your opinion, which I'm pretty sure you said wasn't evidence or credible, when you asserted that I was doing the same thing.

When discussions aren't progressive/constructive, I bow out so, have a good one and all the best.
 
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You're way too passionate to have a reasonable discussion with, IMO, and you are going on tangents which are unfounded by anything but your opinion, which I'm pretty sure you said wasn't evidence or credible, when you asserted that I was doing the same thing.

When discussions aren't progressive/constructive, I bow out so, have a good one and all the best.
Rambot said that many parents instill hatred and bigotry into their children, which is a true statement. You dismissed his comment and said it isn't happening, which triggers a passionate response. It seems like your effort to make it a constructive discussion is not up to par.
 
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rambot

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You're way too passionate to have a reasonable discussion with, IMO, and you are going on tangents which are unfounded by anything but your opinion, which I'm pretty sure you said wasn't evidence or credible, when you asserted that I was doing the same thing.
Nothing you said here is reflective of anything in my posts. If my argument is so "unreasonable" boy oh boy would it EVER be easy to point out how that is so. But you didn't seem up for the challenge I guess? I'm sorry if you think I'm a lost cause.

If there are particular "opinions" I've given that you would like supported by facts I would be happy to find them for you. You just need to delineate which ones. The reason I didn't provide sources for what I've said is that usually, one doesn't need to provide sources for things that are considered "broadly understood by society" (so I'm not sure which one of my points counters that benchmark). But if you need em? I can find em.

It is a bit disappointing that instead of not having counter arguments you suggest my "passion" is the reason for you not continuing to reply though.

If I'm being irrational, just prove it. I know I'm not a perfect person....ESPECIALLY when I post here on CF (as mods will attest). But when I'm wrong or unfair I AM willing to admit it.
 
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Belk

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You're way too passionate to have a reasonable discussion with, IMO, and you are going on tangents which are unfounded by anything but your opinion, which I'm pretty sure you said wasn't evidence or credible, when you asserted that I was doing the same thing.

When discussions aren't progressive/constructive, I bow out so, have a good one and all the best.
To have a reasonable discussion one has to have reason. You have already stated that you not only reject others reasoning but have none to offer yourself. That would seem to preclude reasonable discussion with anyone. :wave:
 
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rambot

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To have a reasonable discussion one has to have reason. You have already stated that you not only reject others reasoning but have none to offer yourself. That would seem to preclude reasonable discussion with anyone. :wave:
Excellent and reasonable points.
 
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KCfromNC

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Yes, people (including myself) are wrong, in the eyes of God, when they sin. That's no secret regarding Christianity, is it?

As far as what people think regarding right or wrong etc in society, I don't care if anyone is on my side. I'm on the side of the kids.
Have you asked the kids what they think of the subject? Are they getting entertainment and education out of it? Do they feel at risk or uncomfortable? Are they being forced against their will into some deviant lifestyle?

I'm pretty sure we all know the answers here.

It seemed like we had a breakthrough with admitting this was all about the feeling that certain minority groups were icky. Now we've fallen back to empty platitudes to hide from that fact. Makes one wonder why there'd be a need if the reasons were as solid as the asserted confidence about them.
 
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KCfromNC

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Many parents make mistakes or intentionally subject their children to inappropriate people or places.
Perhaps.
Is there any possibility that your claims might be the mistaken one in this situation? You know, given the posted complete lack of evidence for your opinions, the shifting excuses for them, not knowing the first thing about any of the children or performers involved, and the lack of regard for the law in the situation?
 
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