soul = spirit?

[tonychanyt]

I understand that in the scriptures the Hebrew word nephesh and the Greek word psykhe are translated soul. It's also my understanding that in the scriptures the word soul refers to a person, an animal, or the life that a person or an animal has.(Genesis 1:20; Genesis 2:7; Numbers 31:28; 1Peter 3:20) God tells us how he created the first man Adam at Genesis 2:7 which says, "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul." So going by Genesis 2:7 it's telling us that God took dust from the ground and formed a flesh and blood human body, then God blew the breath or spirit of life into that flesh and blood human body and that flesh and blood human body became a living soul, or living person. So it's my understanding from the scriptures that the scriptures don't say human beings or animals have souls but instead the scriptures teach us that human beings and animals are souls.

In contrast to the way that the term "soul" is used in many religious contexts, the Bible shows that both the Hebrew word nephesh and the Greek word psykhe, in connection with earthly creatures, whether they are animal or human, refers to that which is material, tangible, visible, and mortal. So the Hebrew word nephesh and the Greek word psykhe can be translated , "life," "creature," "person," "one's whole being," or simply as a personal pronoun( for example, "I" for "my soul"). When referring to doing something with one's whole soul, it means to do it with one's whole being, wholeheartedly, or with one's whole life(Deuteronomy 6:5; Matthew 22:37). In some contexts, these original language words can be used to refer to the desire or appetite of a living creature. They can also refer to a dead person or a dead body.(Numbers 6:6; Proverbs 23:2; Isaiah 56:11; Haggai 2:13).


The Hebrew word ruach and the Greek word pneuma which is often translated "spirit," have a number of meanings. All of them refer to that which is invisible to human sight and gives evidence of force in motion. The Hebrew and Greek words are used with reference to "wind," "the active life force in earthly creatures" (human or animals), "the impelling force that issues from a person's figurative heart and causes him/her to say and do things in a certain way," "inspired expressions originating from an invisible source," "spirit persons," and God's active force."(Holy Spirit)
Exodus 35:21; Psalm 104:29; Matthew 12:43; Luke 11:13

Right.

In some contexts, it is useful to distinguish between spirit and soul.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Right.

In some contexts, it is useful to distinguish between spirit and soul.

Right.

In some contexts, it is useful to distinguish between spirit and soul.

What I'm saying is that from what I read in the scriptures, when keeping the words "soul" and "spirit" in context when reading the Bible, the scriptures don't say human beings have a living soul or a living person in his/her flesh and blood human body, but that the flesh and blood human body is a living soul or living person.

I have no problem with people distinguishing the words "soul" and "spirit," just as long as when they're speaking about the soul and spirit regarding human beings, they're not saying that human beings have a living person in their flesh and blood human body. I haven't found in the scriptures where it says human beings have living persons in their flesh and blood human bodies but what I have found when reading the scriptures is that human beings are living souls or living persons, they don't have living persons in their flesh and blood human bodies.

Scriptures like Hebrews 4:12 teach us that God's Word exerts power to change our lives, and that it's just as effective in helping us make needed changes after our baptism as it was prior to our taking that step of getting baptized. Paul in the letter to the Hebrews wrote that the word of God, "pierces even to the dividing of soul and spirit, and joints and their marrow, and is able to discern thoughts and intentions of the heart." (Hebrew 4:12) In other words Hebrews 4:12 is teaching us, when we clearly understand God's purpose for us, the way we respond to it reveals what we are deep inside. Sometimes there is a difference between what we appear to be(the soul) and who we really are(the spirit) [Matthew 23:27, 28]

 

[tonychanyt]

I have no problem with people distinguishing the words "soul" and "spirit," just as long as when they're speaking about the soul and spirit regarding human beings, they're not saying that human beings have a living person in their flesh and blood human body.

To me, these are all a matter of definition. I don't have trouble accepting these kinds of definitions.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

To me, these are all a matter of definition. I don't have trouble accepting these kinds of definitions.

I prefer agreeing with the things that are written down in the inspired word if God. I haven't seen anywhere in the inspired word of God that God had written down which says human beings have souls, not in any context does the inspired word of God say human beings have souls, so that is what I choose to agree with.

 

[tonychanyt]

I prefer agreeing with the things that are written down in the inspired word if God. I haven't seen anywhere in the inspired word of God that God had written down which says human beings have souls, not in any context does the inspired word of God say human beings have souls, so that is what I choose to agree with.

So you don't have a soul in you?

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

So you don't have a soul in you?

I don't agree that human beings have souls in their bodies. So no i don't have a soul in me. Human beings are living souls, so I am a living soul, I don't have a living soul in me. That's what I see in the scriptures.
I was brought up to believe that human beings have souls in their bodies, and I was taught when human being dies, their soul separates from their human bodies and goes to Heaven or Hell, and I was brought up to believe that Hell was a place of fiery torment where the soul was tormented for eternity. The problem with what I was brought up to believe is that the Bible doesn't teach this.
I said previously that Genesis 2:7 doesn't teach God gave a living soul to the flesh and blood human body when he blew the breath(spirit) of life into the flesh and blood human body that he had formed from the dust of the ground. So the breath(spirit) of life separately on its own not being in a flesh and blood human body isn't a living soul, and the flesh and blood human body without the breath(spirit) of life in it isn't a living soul. So it takes both the breath(spirit) of life and the flesh and blood human body being combined together to make a living soul or living person. So if the breath(spirit) of life separates from the flesh and blood human body there is no living soul or living person anymore because it takes the breath(spirit) of life being combined with the flesh and blood human body for there to be a living soul or living person. So at death human beings cease being living souls or living persons. This is true death, the death that the majority of humanity doesn't want or will not believe in. In the scriptures the hope of the dead is the resurrection. This means that when the resurrection begins those that have died will be raised back from the dead as living souls or living persons.

 

[tonychanyt]

i don't have a soul in me

Let proposition P1 = I have a soul in me.
P2 = I don't have a soul in me.

Between 0 and 10, how much weight do you put on each of the above propositions?

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Let proposition P1 = I have a soul in me.
P2 = I don't have a soul in me.

Between 0 and 10, how much weight do you put on each of the above propositions?

As I said I haven't found where the scriptures teach human beings or animals have souls in them. From what I read from the scriptures, both animals and human beings are souls. So I don't believe P1 to be true so it's a big fat zero and P2 is true and I give P2 a 10

 

[tonychanyt]

As I said I haven't found where the scriptures teach human beings or animals have souls in them. From what I read from the scriptures, both animals and human beings are souls. So I don't believe P1 to be true so it's a big fat zero and P2 is true and I give P2 a 10

Great.
Are you willing to bet based on your weight assignments?

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

Great.
Are you willing to bet based on your weight assignments?

The scriptures tell us not to bet, but as I said from my understanding the scriptures teach that human beings are living souls or living persons not that human beings have living souls or living persons in their human bodies.

 

[tonychanyt]

The scriptures tell us not to bet

verse?

 

[Divide]

Our spirit is our spirit man. We were born spiritually dead, then when we were born again, God gave us a new spirit and we are now spiritually alive and this is how God sees us, already perfected in spirit.

Our soul is our mind will & emotions, our personality if you will and our logic and reason, the carnal mind.

Our body is our vehicle or tent.

I am a spirit. I have a soul. I live in a body. (on house arrest at this time, lol.)

Andrew Wommack explains it pretty good. Parts 2 & 3 should link to them after part one finishes playing.

 

[tonychanyt]

this is how God sees us, already perfected in spirit.

verse?

 

[Divide]

verse?

Testimony of a Christian who said that Jesus essentially said this to him. He was on Sid Roth too.

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

verse?

Isaiah 65:11-But ye that forsake Jehovah, that forget my holy mountain, that prepare a table for Fortune, and that fill up mingled wine unto Destiny(American Standard Bible)

I'm not going to start talking about betting in this post because that's not the topic that's being discussed. The topic being discussed is soul=spirit. So lets stay on that topic.

 

[tonychanyt]

Testimony of a Christian who said that Jesus essentially said this to him. He was on Sid Roth too.

Can you actually quote a verse from the Bible? That's what I am asking.

 

[tonychanyt]

Isaiah 65:11-But ye that forsake Jehovah, that forget my holy mountain, that prepare a table for Fortune, and that fill up mingled wine unto Destiny(American Standard Bible)

I'm not going to start talking about betting in this post because that's not the topic that's being discussed. The topic being discussed is soul=spirit. So lets stay on that topic.

So you say things but you won't put money where your mouth is?

 

[Divide]

Can you actually quote a verse from the Bible? That's what I am asking.

1 Samuel 16:
7 But the Lord said to Samuel, “Don’t judge by his appearance or height, for I have rejected him. The Lord doesn’t see things the way you see them. People judge by outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.”,,,/NLT

 

[BARNEY BRIGHT]

So you say things but you won't put money where your mouth is?

I haven't seen anywhere in scripture that disagrees with what Genesis 2:7 teaches, which is from my understanding, that human beings are living souls or living persons. So Genesis 2:7 is teaching us how God created the first human being and that scripture doesn't say that God gave the flesh and blood human body a living soul or living person, but instead teaches that the flesh and blood human body became a living soul or living person when God blew the breath(spirit) of life into that flesh and blood human body. I will not disagree with what Genesis 2:7 teaches me, because I don't see anywhere in Genesis 2:7 where it says that God gave the flesh and blood human body a living soul or living person. So just because so many others choose to disagree with Genesis 2:7 doesn't mean I'm going to disagree with it.

 

[lanceleo]

Soul and spirit aren't the same.

Spirit (pneuma) — The "spirit" is that part of man which is aware or conscious of God — God- awareness. It is made "alive" by God's Spirit at salvation. It is "energized" by God's Spirit when we are filled with the Spirit. The functions of man's spirit include the following:

a. Revelation from God
b. Prayer to God
c. Communion with God
d. Worship of God
e. Witness to man (world)
f. Conscience: to judge (discern)
g. Fellowship with God (church)
h. Discernment of spirits (spiritual senses)
i. Spiritual warfare
j. Seedbed for the fruit of the Spirit
k. Reception area for the Gifts of the Spirit.

Soul (psuche) — The "soul" is that part of man which is aware or conscious of himself — self-awareness. It is the center of the ego or personality. The functions of the soul can be outlined as follows:

a. Memory: to recall (remember, reflect)
b. Curiosity: to inquire (explore)
c. Perception: to interpret (sense and understand)
d. Reason: to think (meditate, conceive)
e. Imagination: to create (envision, dream)
f. Emotion: to feel (have passion, affection)
g. Volition: to will (decide)