Modern day systemic racism, does it exist?

[rjs330]

Why should it be up to the bank where to put “full service” banks?
We need banks to have equal services in each community as far as is possible because if they don’t, that’s “unequal treatment” which leads to less choice for black borrowers. Less choice the higher the interest rate is because that’s “how it works”.

Ummm because they are a private business and they get to decide which branch offers which service. Perhaps the bank would have been better off if they had not built a branch period.

Less choice? Are you kidding? You can go three miles and get a loan somewhere. Guess what I had to to go 10 miles for a loan. Oh the horror.

 

[RDKirk]

Why should it be up to the bank where to put “full service” banks?
We need banks to have equal services in each community as far as is possible because if they don’t, that’s “unequal treatment” which leads to less choice for black borrowers. Less choice the higher the interest rate is because that’s “how it works”.

Because they're operating on profit. It's a business, not a government service. Why should it be up to government to decide?

As I've mentioned, not all the Chase banks in my environs are full-service banks. You think it's cheap to put a $80,000-150,000 employee in a desk where he'll never have anything to do?

In essentialsaltes's case we're talking about a well-to-do black neighborhood where people certainly have the ability to travel seven miles to the bank that has a loan officer...and, frankly, anyone who can't make it seven miles to a full-service bank probably can't afford a mortgage.

 

[RDKirk]

“Assimilation” is so 1950s.
What’s “wrong” with a predominantly black wealthy neighborhood existing?

You didn't approach the question. What is it that keeps white people, asians, or other races from moving into such a neighborhood?

 

[essentialsaltes]

I've heard of such neighborhoods but have never seen one. Curious; what is it that keeps white people, asians, or other races from moving into such a neighborhood?

You didn't approach the question. What is it that keeps white people, asians, or other races from moving into such a neighborhood?

Nothing. I have moved into this neighborhood.

I am not black; neither is my spouse.

 

[Ken-1122]

Nothing. I have moved into this neighborhood.

I am not black; neither is my spouse.

Do you suspect there is something about the Neighborhood that attracts blacks but not other people?

 

[Pommer]

Because the banks are the ones who have to suffer the consequences of failure. Now if the City agrees to make sure the bank makes money, then they should be able to dictate how they do business

Did you totally miss the Great Recession?
Having equal access to the products of our economy (and yes, a loan is a “product” that banks “make”, they “sell money”), for all segments of our society is necessary to thwart our tendency to exclude “iffy-prospects” because of racist attitudes.

 

[RDKirk]

Do you suspect there is something about the Neighborhood that attracts blacks but not other people?

It could be like the neighborhood I lived in while in high school. It had been the first middle-class neighborhood for blacks in 1960, while the city was still segregated. At the time, upper-working class to high-middle class and a few genuinely wealthy blacks moved in. Over time, as the city integrated through the 70s, the high-middle class blacks moved to newly integrated areas. Price values declined slightly, but not much because the upper-working and middle-class blacks stayed.

At this point, with the houses all being 40-50 years old, it's still a decent area populated to a great extent by the original residents and their children, plus some working-class blacks. But because the area was always known as "black," to this day no white people have ever moved there.

 

[rjs330]

Did you totally miss the Great Recession?
Having equal access to the products of our economy (and yes, a loan is a “product” that banks “make”, they “sell money”), for all segments of our society is necessary to thwart our tendency to exclude “iffy-prospects” because of racist attitudes.

What are you talking about? Was anyone refused a loan from this bank because of their skin color? .

What people couldn't go up the street to a different branch of this same bank and apply for a loan?

 

[Larniavc]

Guess what I had to to go 10 miles for a loan. Oh the horror.

What if you are disabled and have low mobility?

Seems harsh for the millions of people with similar issues. Are they not to be able to engage fully in the world?

Very harsh.

 

[RDKirk]

What if you are disabled and have low mobility?

Seems harsh for the millions of people with similar issues. Are they not to be able to engage fully in the world?

Very harsh.

Did anyone make that charge?
What would that have to do with racism?
Do even disabled people choose to go only to the nearest bank to shop for a mortgage loan?

I'm trying to imagine a genuine circumstance in which a disabled person who was reasonably able to be qualified for a home loan would be prevented from engaging "fully with the world" by the nearest bank not having a loan officer. Such a person, if they exist, would be unable to engage "fully with the world" for a lot more reasons than the nearest bank not having a loan officer.

At least make your "what if" something reasonable.

 

[rjs330]

What if you are disabled and have low mobility?

Seems harsh for the millions of people with similar issues. Are they not to be able to engage fully in the world?

Very harsh.

Well good grief you expect everything a person needs to be within what distance from you?

What if you are disabled and your closest

Grocery store is 5 miles away
Pharmacy is 5+miles away
Medical clinic is 6+ miles away
Hospital is 13 miles away
etc ad nauseum.

Having a bank with a loan officer is the least of your concerns. So tell me what IS the distance all these things should be from your house?

Millions of people can't get to a bank that is 6 miles away? If they are that bad off they won't be getting to a bank that is 3 miles away either.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Do you suspect there is something about the Neighborhood that attracts blacks but not other people?

Historically, racial covenants prevented black people from moving into this neighborhood. Black people were restricted to certain areas of Los Angeles (and were densely populated there because they were few other places they could move). When racial covenants were no longer enforceable, black people began moving into adjacent areas. In this neighborhood, after the first black people moved in in the 1960s, many of the white folks chose to leave (white flight). So with leaving white people creating a vacuum, black people filled that void. That's what set the stage for the area being highly concentrated with black people. Similar stories could be said of Watts and Compton, which were originally all white (and exclusive). But they were close to Bronzeville, so the same transformation happened.

My particular neighborhood, with bigger houses and nice views, attracted black lawyers and doctors and entertainers. The old-timers will tell you where Ike & Tina and Ray Charles lived; younger folk point out Issa Rae and Regina King.

Anyway, at the outset, it was white flight that attracted black people to the area. Once established, it takes a while for demographics to shift. It takes at least a generational shift before (some) whites no longer feel a need to flee.

 

[rjs330]

Historically, racial covenants prevented black people from moving into this neighborhood. Black people were restricted to certain areas of Los Angeles (and were densely populated there because they were few other places they could move). When racial covenants were no longer enforceable, black people began moving into adjacent areas. In this neighborhood, after the first black people moved in in the 1960s, many of the white folks chose to leave (white flight). So with leaving white people creating a vacuum, black people filled that void. That's what set the stage for the area being highly concentrated with black people. Similar stories could be said of Watts and Compton, which were originally all white (and exclusive). But they were close to Bronzeville, so the same transformation happened.

My particular neighborhood, with bigger houses and nice views, attracted black lawyers and doctors and entertainers. The old-timers will tell you where Ike & Tina and Ray Charles lived; younger folk point out Issa Rae and Regina King.

Anyway, at the outset, it was white flight that attracted black people to the area. Once established, it takes a while for demographics to shift. It takes at least a generational shift before (some) whites no longer feel a need to flee.

Aren't we glad that the racial covenants were removed this ending systemic racism there? I'm glad. Why didn't those more wealthy blacks move to the white neighborhoods. Oh wait they did. Then they decided to all gather there.

The 1960s. What a great 10 years. Ending systemic racism and providing the civil rights desperately needed.

Yes yes it was a volatile time of change. That was 50 years ago. And now look at it. Whites are coming g back. Shows just how much we have changed in those 50 years. It shows how much attitudes have changed over the years. We are a long long way from the old days.

 

[Ken-1122]

Did you totally miss the Great Recession?

What does the Great Recession have to do with what I said?

Having equal access to the products of our economy (and yes, a loan is a “product” that banks “make”, they “sell money”), for all segments of our society is necessary to thwart our tendency to exclude “iffy-prospects” because of racist attitudes.

Just because you don't have a bank a stone's throw away from your house doesn't mean you don't have equal access to banks. Besides, even if you did, you likely gonna shop around for the best rate in town anyway; and the one that gives you the best rate will likely not be the one a stones throw away from your houses so......

 

[Ken-1122]

Historically, racial covenants prevented black people from moving into this neighborhood. Black people were restricted to certain areas of Los Angeles (and were densely populated there because they were few other places they could move). When racial covenants were no longer enforceable, black people began moving into adjacent areas. In this neighborhood, after the first black people moved in in the 1960s, many of the white folks chose to leave (white flight). So with leaving white people creating a vacuum, black people filled that void. That's what set the stage for the area being highly concentrated with black people. Similar stories could be said of Watts and Compton, which were originally all white (and exclusive). But they were close to Bronzeville, so the same transformation happened.

So what prevented your neighborhood from suffering the same fate as Compton and Watts?

 

[essentialsaltes]

So what prevented your neighborhood from suffering the same fate as Compton and Watts?

The problem with Watts was not blackness. The problems were poverty, unemployment and other inequities.

The McCone Commission identified the root causes of the riots to be high unemployment, poor schools, and related inferior living conditions that were endured by African Americans in Watts. Recommendations for addressing these problems included "emergency literacy and preschool programs, improved police-community ties, increased low-income housing, more job-training projects, upgraded health-care services, more efficient public transportation, and many more." Most of these recommendations were never implemented.

 

[Ken-1122]

The problem with Watts was not blackness.

I never said it was.

The McCone Commission identified the root causes of the riots to be high unemployment, poor schools, and related inferior living conditions that were endured by African Americans in Watts. Recommendations for addressing these problems included "emergency literacy and preschool programs, improved police-community ties, increased low-income housing, more job-training projects, upgraded health-care services, more efficient public transportation, and many more." Most of these recommendations were never implemented.

Great! Now care to answer my question? Or are you gonna answer more questions that nobody has asked!

 

[RDKirk]

The problem with Watts was not blackness. The problems were poverty, unemployment and other inequities.

The McCone Commission identified the root causes of the riots to be high unemployment, poor schools, and related inferior living conditions that were endured by African Americans in Watts. Recommendations for addressing these problems included "emergency literacy and preschool programs, improved police-community ties, increased low-income housing, more job-training projects, upgraded health-care services, more efficient public transportation, and many more." Most of these recommendations were never implemented.

Watts was a high-density housing project area that shared the same problems as other high-density housing project areas.

I'd be more interested in what the problem with Compton was (which I'm led to understand is currently predominantly Latino). Compton is not a high-density project area.

 

[Pommer]

What does the Great Recession have to do with what I said?

Just because you don't have a bank a stone's throw away from your house doesn't mean you don't have equal access to banks. Besides, even if you did, you likely gonna shop around for the best rate in town anyway; and the one that gives you the best rate will likely not be the one a stones throw away from your houses so......

And yet this bank accepted the fine and vowed to “do better” in servicing black communities.

 

[Ken-1122]

And yet this bank accepted the fine and vowed to “do better” in servicing black communities.

Don't let that fool ya. History is full of examples of business accepting a slap on the wrist/fine, apologizing so they can move on even when they feel they were right, because it's cheaper to do so than going through years of litigation in order to prove yourself right.