Can people who disagree on abortion stop attacking each other?

[jayem]

Also, in the case of abortions, a majority are done by crushing the skull and ripping off the arms and legs of a fetus.

Not anymore. Since 2020, more than half of all abortions in the US are done medically with mifepristone (formerly known as RU 486) and either misoprostol, or an H2 blocker. Mifepristone is a progesterone antagonist. Progesterone acts to thicken the endometrium (uterine lining) and helps maintain the placenta which nourishes the embryo. Blocking that action causes the placenta to degenerate and the embryo dies. Misoprostol, or H2 blockers such as cimetidine, stimulate uterine contractions which expel the placental and embryonic remains.

CDCs Abortion Surveillance System FAQs | CDC

Medical abortion is most effective when done early in pregnancy, i.e. 7- 9 weeks after the missed period.

 

[Belk]

The scientific definition is the only correct definition. All other definitions are lies made up by people who do not want to believe the facts for the sake of their political and/or religious agendas.

On the topic of abortion, the lying goes both ways, with many pro-choicers calling the unborn offspring part of the mother despite the scientific fact he/she obviously has his/her own unique DNA, while all pro-lifers get it wrong by insisting he/she is a baby starting at the moment of conception despite knowing the word "baby" scientifically is limited to born humans under one year old.

My point was that as far as I am aware there is no such thing as a "scientific definition", there are only definitions. While science can help us explain processses and facts it has nothing to say on matters of morality such as abortion.

 

[YahuahSaves]

Not anymore. Since 2020, more than half of all abortions in the US are done medically with mifepristone (formerly known as RU 486) and either misoprostol, or an H2 blocker. Mifepristone is a progesterone antagonist. Progesterone acts to thicken the endometrium (uterine lining) and helps maintain the placenta which nourishes the embryo. Blocking that action causes the placenta to degenerate and the embryo dies. Misoprostol, or H2 blockers such as cimetidine, stimulate uterine contractions which expel the placental and embryonic remains.

CDCs Abortion Surveillance System FAQs | CDC

Medical abortion is most effective when done early in pregnancy, i.e. 7- 9 weeks after the missed period.

And this is still not taking life because.....?

 

[YahuahSaves]

My point was that as far as I am aware there is no such thing as a "scientific definition", there are only definitions. While science can help us explain processses and facts it has nothing to say on matters of morality such as abortion.

True, but many scientists and ex-abortionists do.

 

[NxNW]

You obviously don't know much about human biology, or how twinning occurs.

All of your arguments fail based on the scientific/medical definition of "human being" and what constitutes "life".

It's a simple question, which you seem unwilling or unable to answer: are the twins distinct human beings before the split?

 

[NxNW]

If you want to understand the "truth" about how human beings and life are defined scientifically, there's plenty of information if you're unbiased enough to accept it.

Human beings are distinct and quantifiable. A zygote is not quantifiable, because it might split, or it might not. Most likely, it will miscarry. And therefore it's not a human being.

 

[NxNW]

I already did. Or do you want to deny that a zygote is of the species homo sapiens?

No you didn't. A zygote is not a human being, and I've already proved it.

You said "an acorn is not an oak tree", which is equivalent to saying "an infant is not an adult".

No, it's not. An infant is a human being. A zygote is not.

You think birth is the deciding factor in this?

I never made such claim.

So it is fine to kill the baby in the womb 3 days prior to delivery?

I never made such claim. Also, it's not a baby.

As long as it is in the womb it can be killed without any consideration?

I never made any such claim.

 

[Friedrich Rubinstein]

No you didn't. A zygote is not a human being, and I've already proved it.

You didn't though. This is the definition of a human being:

A zygote is an individual, unique and whole organism of the species H. sapiens and therefore meets the definition.

I never made such claim.

You did make the claim that "being born" is the requirement for being a human being. Yet here you are denying that you think birth is the deciding factor. Make up your mind.
If you don't think that birth is the deciding factor, then what is?

 

[Belk]

True, but many scientists and ex-abortionists do.

Do what? Have an opinion? Of course they do, they are human and we tend to hold opinions.

 

[jayem]

And this is still not taking life because.....?

I'm only correcting this statement of yours:

Also, in the case of abortions, a majority are done by crushing the skull and ripping off the arms and legs of a fetus.

The majority of elective abortions are now done non-surgically with medication, If you're going to comment on abortion technique, you should be up to date. You could say a majority of abortions are done with drugs that kill a fetus. Then you'll be accurate.

 

[YahuahSaves]

It's a simple question, which you seem unwilling or unable to answer: are the twins distinct human beings before the split?

Yes. They're distinctly human at fertilisation. I've already answered the question in a previous post but you keep avoiding the answer.

 

[YahuahSaves]

Human beings are distinct and quantifiable. A zygote is not quantifiable, because it might split, or it might not. Most likely, it will miscarry. And therefore it's not a human being.

Science disagrees with you

 

[YahuahSaves]

Do what? Have an opinion? Of course they do, they are human and we tend to hold opinions.

As people working in the field, they know what life is, they leave the industry because they can no longer lie to themselves or others.

 

[YahuahSaves]

The majority of elective abortions are now done non-surgically with medication, If you're going to comment on abortion technique, you should be up to date.

You think your government regulates the industry? The law is just a piece of paper. What happens in reality is often very different.

 

[Belk]

As people working in the field, they know what life is, they leave the industry because they can no longer lie to themselves or others.

Their opinion is noted.

 

[Kylie]

So what's your view on human-animal chimeras?

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand

That contradicts your statement that sperm and ova are alive. Also, in the case of abortions, a majority are done by crushing the skull and ripping off the arms and legs of a fetus.

Yeah, if you could NOT cherry pick and quote mine in order to dishonestly distort what I said, that would be great.

 

[Kylie]

@Kylie HERE is something you might be interested in watching (or not). It relates to DNA

I'd prefer to get my science from actual scientists, not new age authors.

 

[YahuahSaves]

Yeah, if you could NOT cherry pick and quote mine in order to dishonestly distort what I said, that would be great.

What I quoted was relevant to prove your own contradictory statements.

Life does NOT begin at conception, since the sperm and ova that combine are already alive PRIOR to conception.

Life comes in stages. The beginning of an individual human life starts at conception. That's the scientific point of view.

If you believe that a unique set of DNA is sufficient to grant personhood, then yes, I must have committed a murder.

Person
noun

1) A living human. Often used in combination.

Living
adjective

1) Possessing life.

Murder
noun

1) The killing of another person without justification or excuse, especially the crime of killing a person with malice aforethought or with recklessness manifesting extreme indifference to the value of human life.
2) An instance of such killing.

Yet there is no body, no life has been lost, no experiences lost.

Having a fully developed body defines being human? That's not accurate at all.

 

[coffee4u]

Are both identical twins alive and distinct at the moment of conception?

At the moment of conception you have a single new human being called at that stage a zygote. It doesn't split and become twins until day 2-6

 

[coffee4u]

Or anyone trying to understand the actual truth.

The actual truth is the Hebrew word simply means secret covered place. They didn't know about the womb and fallopian tubes because they didn't need to know. God always works on a need to know basis, the same way he gave them hygiene laws but didn't explain about germs. Secret place inside of the mother was good enough.