BobRyan

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If it were nonsense, people of your persuasion would not be terrified of the question being put them about the inspiration of the New Testament books and why such people will not or cannot explain their dismissal of its contents. .

An accusation without any support is not as compelling as it may seem at first.

... I would really like to know why SDAs, at least those on these forums, do not accept the New Testament but say that they do.

I beg to differ. I quote the NT almost non-stop so also does the Adventist 28 Fundamental Beliefs.

So for example on "this thread" --
1 John 3:4 "Sin IS transgression of the Law"

Rom 3:19-20
19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin...23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

James 2:
8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,”(Lev 19:18) you do well; 9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all. 11 For He who said, “Do not commit adultery,” also said, “Do not murder.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12 So speak and so do as those who will be judged by the law of liberty.

Gal 3:8 "the Gospel was preached to Abraham"

1 John 5:3-4 "This IS the LOVE of God - that we KEEP His Commandments"
Rev 14:12 "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND Their faith in Jesus"
1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"




Albion - Some sort of 'fact' needs to get into your post when making those accusations.

The New Testament is divine and no one is stating otherwise, but nowhere does it delete the 4th commandment

True statement
 
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SabbathBlessings

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You didn't use that word, but we have post after post on record here in which you disavow the contents, so you can't have it both ways.

And, in case there is any question, my interest is not in showing you up or winning some debate here, but I would really like to know why SDAs, at least those on these forums, do not accept the New Testament but say that they do.
Which context ? The ones where the disciples teach us to keep the commandments of God as well as Jesus our Creator? Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7, James 2:10-12, 1 Cor 7:19, 1 John 5:3, John 14:15, John 15:10, Revelations 14:15, Revelations 12:17, Revelations 22:14 and both the disciples and Jesus keeping the Sabbath commandment Acts 18:4, Luke 4:16-22, and the Sabbath is still a commandment after Jesus ascended back to heaven Luke 23:56, Matthew 24:20 Seems like we are not the ones who are disregarding contents and since you seem to only provide commentary over scripture the disciples even tell us we ought to obey God over man.

God bless
 
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BobRyan

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The law, the Sabbath, really only tells you that you are a transgressor. The law has no other benefit,

For the lost - the Law serves to convict them that they are lost - Rom 3:19-20 makes that case perfectly.

For the born-again the New Covenant writes that Law on the heart - the law known to Jeremiah and his readers (Jer 31:31-34 Heb 8:6-12, Rom 3:31)
 
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Albion

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At some point in ALL these identical debates on this same topic, the "big question" has to be asked. And answered.

That's why I focused on it in these last few messages.

If it gets answered, that would be great. If it never is, but the evasions and the dancing around the issue continue on, then at least it can be said that it wasn't because of anyone's inability to understand what's at issue.
 
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HIM

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You didn't use that word, but we have post after post on record here in which you disavow the contents, so you can't have it both ways.

And, in case there is any question, my interest is not in showing you up or winning some debate here, but I would really like to know why SDAs, at least those on these forums, do not accept the New Testament but say that they do.
I am not a SDA and we are done with you.
Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

Matt 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
 
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Albion

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I am not a SDA and we are done with you.

I can imagine. ;)

But you realize that doing so just says you cannot or will not explain why you both affirm and deny the New Testament at almost the same time.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I can imagine. ;)

But you realize that doing so just says you cannot or will not explain why you both affirm and deny the New Testament at almost the same time.
Please do share these scriptures you keep claiming changes God’s Sabbath day of worship. God’s Word should shine, not be hidden.

We are told the Sabbath will continue to be God’s chosen day of worship for eternity Isaiah 66:23 as God promised Exodus 31:16-17 so if you can’t find scripture that tells us these scriptures are wrong, which they are not, I would consider worshipping Jesus in Truth and Spirit, because that is what Jesus wants from us. John 4:24


Happy Sabbath all! I am off for now.

God bless!
 
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HIM

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Please do share these scriptures you keep claiming changes God’s Sabbath day of worship. God’s Word should shine, not be hidden.

We are told the Sabbath will continue to be God’s chosen day of worship for eternity Isaiah 66:23 as God promised Exodus 31:16-17 so if you can’t find scripture that tells us these scriptures are wrong, which they are not, I would consider worshipping Jesus in Truth and Spirit, but that is what Jesus wants from us. John 4:24


Happy Sabbath all! I am off for now.

God bless!
Happy Sabbath to you and everyone also. May the Lord our God continue to bless us all in all His Way; Jesus Christ.
 
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Albion

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Please do share these scriptures you keep claiming changes God’s Sabbath day of worship. God’s Word should shine, not be hidden.!
I'm waiting for a reply from the person I was addressing there.

And, no, I am not going to name the same verses for you yet another time, as though you don't know them. By chapter and verse, you have discounted them and denied their meaning already. This, and the familiar routine that would follow, were addressed earlier in the thread.
 
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Freth

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So.....you are saying that the Old Testament is God's word, but what almost every Christian denomination except yours, whether Catholic, Protestant, or Orthodox, considers to be also part of the Bible--the New Testament--is not, in fact, divine revelation?

If it were nonsense, people of your persuasion would not be terrified of the question being put them about the inspiration of the New Testament books and why such people will not or cannot explain their dismissal of its contents.

Yes, I know that story about an "apostate" church making the New Testament meaningless to true Christians, but if you use that one, you might as well say, without equivocation, that you are not interested in the New Testament which, as we all know, is the basis for Sunday worship.

The word of God is the answer to the problem—both Old and New Testaments. There is only one truth. Why I believe in the seventh-day Sabbath? I can't find one verse to support Sunday sacredness, or Sunday observance as a worship day, but I can find a commandment spoken by God and written with His own hand.

What does Jesus say about the broad way?

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
If this one verse were the only evidence of a wrong path in scripture, one could easily dismiss it and say, "Oh, well, it's the non-believers who are following the broad way. Christians are the narrow way." There's a problem with that line of thinking. The Old and New Testaments prophesy apostasy, which is a problem originating within the church, directly concerning blasphemy, the changing of times and laws of God, persecution of the saints, and more.

On top of the prophesied apostasy, you find statements like this in the New Testament:

"Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." (Revelation 14:12)
One has to put their fingers in their ears and make loud noises to ignore such statements (and there are so many), which point directly to the Ten Commandments. The commandments of God do not tell us to worship on Sunday. Jesus did not declare Sunday as a new day of worship.

There are numerous threads on this forum where SDA (and others; not to leave them out) quote the Old and New Testaments alike, on the daily, on a wide variety of subjects (not just the Sabbath). The vast majority of these posts are expositional, and contextually sound. Whether you agree or not with the cases presented is your prerogative.

Closing statement regarding the seventh-day Sabbath vs Sunday debate: I have yet to see a compelling argument that trumps the voice of God and His own handwriting. Or the Revelation of Jesus Christ, as given to John, telling us the saints keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
 
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Albion

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The word of God is the answer to the problem—both Old and New Testaments. There is only one truth. Why I believe in the seventh-day Sabbath? I can't find one verse to support Sunday sacredness, or Sunday observance as a worship day, but I can find a commandment spoken by God and written with His own hand.
Any search engine can solve that problem for you.
 
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Albion

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Why search the Internet when we can read God’s Word directly from scripture.

People didn’t believe Jesus either and it reminds me of this passage I am reading. John 8:37-47
I suppose that's clever as a retort, but if we want to treat this issue as serious, we will acknowledge that there is no problem in locating the relevant Scriptures because a search engine will direct you to those Bible verses.
 
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Freth

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I suppose that's clever as a retort, but if we want to treat this issue as serious, we will acknowledge that there is no problem in locating the relevant Scriptures because a search engine will direct you to those Bible verses.

Referring someone to a search engine isn't a compelling argument.
 
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Albion

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Referring someone to a search engine isn't a compelling argument.
It is not an argument. It was the answer to the question about where to look.

It's actually remarkably simple and easy to put your question into a search engine and find all sorts of websites that give listings of applicable verses. Of course, not all of them are equally informative, but if "which verses" was what was sought, coming up with them is not as tough as that seems to lots of people initially. And if something else about the content or meaning of those verses is wanted, that's different and could of course be asked here.
 
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Icyspark

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It is not an argument. It was the answer to the question about where to look.

It's actually remarkably simple and easy to put your question into a search engine and find all sorts of websites that give listings of applicable verses. Of course, not all of them are equally informative, but if "which verses" was what was sought, coming up with them is not as tough as that seems to lots of people initially. And if something else about the content or meaning of those verses is wanted, that's different and could of course be asked here.


Hi Albion,

How about this. Since you seem hesitant to supply the texts yourself, why don't you supply a link to the search engine result you find that most aligns with your mindset? That way if I respond to something I can know that I'm not responding to a belief you don't hold.

God bless.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark
 
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Icyspark

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Why do you require biblical evidence? What is wrong with historical evidence?


Hi prodromos,

I look to the Bible for evidence because I believe that "All Scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for teaching, for rebuking, for correcting, for training in righteousness."

By historical evidence I'm surmising you mean tradition? If so, Jesus doesn't speak fondly of tradition, especially when it directly contradicted His inspired word as recorded in Scripture.

Matthew 15:1-9
Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked, “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!

Jesus replied, “And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, ‘Honor your father and mother’ and ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is ‘devoted to God,’ they are not to ‘honor their father or mother’ with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:

“‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
They worship me in vain;
their teachings are merely human rules.

If one exchanges the word of God for "historical evidence" then one is bound to go off the straight and narrow path which leads to life. The "historical evidence" of the Jews was to reject God and to set their "hearts on evil things."

1 Corinthians 10:1-13
For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers and sisters, that our ancestors were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.5 Nevertheless, God was not pleased with most of them; their bodies were scattered in the wilderness.

6 Now these things occurred as examples to keep us from setting our hearts on evil things as they did. 7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: “The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in revelry.” 8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did—and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died. 9 We should not test Christ, as some of them did—and were killed by snakes. 10 And do not grumble, as some of them did—and were killed by the destroying angel.

11 These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the culmination of the ages has come. 12 So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don’t fall! 13 No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to mankind. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can endure it.

The historical evidence of the Jews was recorded in Scripture as examples and warnings for us.

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark
 
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LoveGodsWord

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1. Sabbath as a Memorial
Genesis 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array.
By the seventh day God had finished the work he had been doing; so on the seventh day he rested from all his work. And God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it he rested from all the work of creating that he had done.

Exodus 20:8-11
“Remember the Sabbath day by keeping it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the LORD your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your manservant or maidservant, nor your animals, nor the alien within your gates. For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

One of the reasons Jesus gives for regularly observing His Sabbath is in reference to the singular monumental event in this world's history—its creation. The Sabbath is a weekly reminder that Jesus created this Earth (John 1:3; Colossians 1:15-17). It is a day to rest from our works just as Jesus rested from His (Hebrews 4:7-10). It is to this very fact of being the Creator that Jesus appeals to over and over in the Scriptures as validation for His claim to being the one and only true God (c.f. 1 Chronicles 16:23-27; 2 Kings 19:15; 2 Chronicles 2:12; Nehemiah 9:6; Psalm 33:6; 96:5; 102:25-27; 115:15; 121:2; Isaiah 37:16; 40:20; 45:18; Jeremiah 10:12; 27:5; 32:17; 33:2, 3; 51:15; Jonah 1:9; Job 26:7; Acts 4:24; 14:15; 17:24; Revelation 14:7).

Psalm 111:2-4
Great are the works of the LORD; they are pondered by all who delight in them. Glorious and majestic are his deeds, and his righteousness endures forever. He has caused his wonders to be remembered; the LORD is gracious and compassionate.

If Jesus says to "Remember the Sabbath," and this remembering is directly connected to the "wonders" of His creation, why is it that people find this something they wish to forget? If one were to develop a hierarchy of the most important events in human history would not the act of creation rank toward the very top? Aside from the life, death and resurrection of the Creator, what other event do you suppose would be more worthy of remembering? Interestingly, even though Jesus nor His disciples ever hinted at any regularly repeating recognition for His resurrection, there are some who insist that we honor Sunday as a resurrection memorial. So while we have no divine command for a weekly remembering of the resurrection (making it a tradition of men), we likewise have no command overturning the weekly remembering of the creation. About this Jesus asks, "Why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?"

2. A Day for Our Benefit
Isaiah 58:13-14
“If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath and from doing as you please on my holy day, if you call the Sabbath a delight and the LORD’s holy day honorable, and if you honor it by not going your own way and not doing as you please or speaking idle words, then you will find your joy in the LORD, and I will cause you to ride on the heights of the land and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.” The mouth of the LORD has spoken.

Through His prophet Isaiah, Jesus portrays His holy day as something to delight in. If Jesus says to delight in His Sabbath I'm certain that there must be a blessing to be obtained by observing the day He blessed.

Mark 2:27
Then he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man (444 anthropos; human being), not man for the Sabbath.

Not only is the Sabbath affirmed as something to "delight" in, but Jesus Himself takes the opportunity to make it clear that when He made the Sabbath on the seventh day of creation it was made for the benefit of all humanity. The word for man in this text is "anthropos" which means people. Thus the Sabbath is for men and women, Jews and Gentiles, slaves and those who are free. All humanity can delight in the benefits of having a day off to remember their Creator and to rest from their own works.

3. Jesus Kept the Sabbath
Luke 4:16
[Jesus] went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom. And he stood up to read.

It was Jesus's regular practice to assemble together with other believers on the Sabbath day. Leviticus 23:3 says that the Sabbath is "a day of sacred assembly." You can certainly worship God on all days of the week, but the Sabbath is the day Jesus set aside for worshipping with other believers in a corporate setting. It is a day set apart—a "holy day"—on which holy people are to rest from their own works and be blessed on the day that Jesus blessed.

1 Peter 2:21
To this you were called, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should follow in his steps.

Jesus is our example in all things and following the things He did should not give anyone cause for concern. On the contrary, it is in doing those things which Jesus never did and never told us to do which we should seriously question the safety of such position. Keeping the Sabbath is in keeping with following Jesus's steps.

1 John 2:6
Whoever claims to live in Him must walk as Jesus did.

Again, if we are to "walk as Jesus did" it is a simple thing to ascertain that the example He left was to regularly assemble together with believers on the day He personally blessed and continues to make holy.

4. Disciples Kept the Sabbath After the Cross
Luke 23:56
Then they went home and prepared spices and perfumes. But they rested on the Sabbath in obedience to the commandment.

Because Jesus never intended to put an end to the regular seven day cycle He set in motion for humanity's (anthropos) benefit and "delight," Jesus never informed them that it was no longer necessary to observe the Sabbath after His death. This is confirmed by the fact that His closest followers—those who went out of their way to see to His burial preparations—still "rested on the Sabbath in obedience to the commandment." If Jesus did not intend for the Sabbath to be included in His new covenant then He needed to add this to His will before He died. After the death of the Testator nothing can be added or subtracted from that person's will (see Hebrews 9:16-17).

5. Paul Kept the Sabbath

Acts 17:2, 3
As his custom was, Paul went into the synagogue, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures, explaining and proving that the Christ had to suffer and rise from the dead. “This Jesus I am proclaiming to you is the Christ,” he said.

After his conversion (recorded in Acts 9) Paul continues his "custom" of going to synagogue on the Sabbath. Not only was this his regular habit but the Bible also records that Paul preached to both Jews and Gentiles on the Sabbath for a year and a half!

Acts 18:4, 11
Every Sabbath he reasoned in the synagogue, trying to persuade Jews and Greeks.


So Paul stayed for a year and a half, teaching them the word of God.

So, "Every Sabbath" for a "year and a half" Paul reasons in the synagogue with both Jews and Greeks (i.e. Gentiles). That's a biblical record of 76 Sabbaths in which Paul is preaching to Jews and Gentiles.

1 Corinthians 11:1
Follow my example, as I follow the example of Christ.

As we would expect from an apostle of Christ, Paul acknowledges that he follows "the example of Christ." Paul's actions testify to the fact that "his custom" of Sabbath observance was the same as the custom of Jesus. Paul then goes on to assert that you should not only follow Christ's example but you should also follow his own example. Are you following the examples left for you by both Jesus and Paul?

6. Gentiles Kept the Sabbath
Acts 13:42-45
So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.


On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God. But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy; and contradicting and blaspheming, they opposed the things spoken by Paul.

Some people suggest that Paul was evangelizing to Jews on the Sabbath and what better way to do that then to meet them on the day they all were gathering together? But in this text we see that after witnessing to the Jews in the synagogue that Gentiles begged Paul to preach these words "to them the next Sabbath." So if the Sabbath had ceased as a requirement and blessing of God, if it was not part of the New Covenant, if it was only for the Jew, then Paul need not wait an entire week to minister to the needs of these pleading Gentiles. Why wait seven days when tomorrow would work just fine? After all, as some people believe, the first day of the week is supposedly "the Lord's day"—a day to be honored in remembrance of Jesus's resurrection—so why not preach to them on this newly preferred day? Paul does not take this golden opportunity to inform these Gentiles that the Sabbath is passé and that it is no longer necessary to remember Jesus as the Creator. Instead, as someone who unashamedly "follow the example of Christ," he honors their Sabbath-keeping request.

7. The Sabbath 40 Years After the Cross
Matthew 24:20
Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath.

Jesus is speaking in reference to the future destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. (40 years after His death). If we consider this admonition from the aspect of keeping the Sabbath holy by not working on it, then the prayer to not have to flee on the Sabbath is easily understandable. Additionally, this text also affirms the continuity of the Sabbath 40 years into the New Covenant.

8. Venerated Title Remains
Matthew 28:1
After the Sabbath, at dawn on the first day of the week, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to look at the tomb.


Mark 16:1
When the Sabbath was over, Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James, and Salome bought spices so that they might go to anoint Jesus’ body.


Luke 23:54
It was Preparation Day, and the Sabbath was about to begin.


John 19:31
Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jews did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down.

Each of the four Gospels were written years after the cross. One would expect that if the Sabbath was no longer relevant to New Covenant Christianity that the Gospel authors would've conveyed such in their writings. But Matthew, Mark, Luke and John all maintain uninterrupted use of the venerated title of Sabbath in their Gospels. None of them ever refer to it as the "Sabbath of the Jews," which of course makes perfect sense in keeping with point #2 above (i.e. the Sabbath was made for humanity's benefit). Luke points out certain things as being exclusively Jewish ("country of the Jews," "synagogue of the Jews") but in neither his Gospel nor his book of Acts does he do so to the Sabbath. Since Jesus said the Sabbath was made for people—regardless of race or gender—then the fact that these authors do not attempt to tie it strictly to the Jews is perfectly logical and consistent. This is especially meaningful when one considers their use of this title after the cross. Since they are writing years afterward there should be no reason why they should not know that the Sabbath has been discontinued. All four authors continue to address the seventh day of the week using it's venerated title and all of the remaining days of the week maintain their generic numeral designation.

9. The Sabbath in the New Earth
Isaiah 66:22-23
As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me,” declares the LORD, “so will your name and descendants endure. From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me,” says the LORD.

When Jesus first created this world we find that He set in motion His weekly memorial to His creative act by establishing His Sabbath (Genesis 2:1-3). In the "restoration of all things" the Lord will create a "new heavens and a new earth." Will the need to remember Jesus as Creator be any less meaningful or necessary once we are redeemed? Will the Sabbath be any less of a blessing or a "delight"? Since the Sabbath was "made for man" before man became a sinner it is apparent that its value was not based in relation to our sinful condition. Isaiah tells us that in the new earth all humanity will bow down before God "from one Sabbath to another." Jesus is going to hit the divine reset button for this Earth. It is going to be baptized by fire. After burning off all the sin and those who stubbornly held on to it, this Earth will be restored to how it was "in the beginning" and it will be our home as it was originally intended. Since the Sabbath comes to us from the seventh day of the beginning, we see that this special day has been a blessing to humanity from our creation to our ultimate salvation and will continue on throughout eternity.

10. The Sabbath in Languages of the World.
Did you know that there are flood traditions around the world? From Africa to Asia and Australia, from Europe to North and South Americas, the story of a world wide flood is a part of the tradition of the peoples in these areas. This is as one would expect for such a universally destructive event.

But did you also know that the word "Sabbath" can be found in various languages all around the world? This too is what one would expect if the Sabbath was instituted on the seventh day of creation. Just like Noah and the other seven survivors were witnesses to the flood, Adam and Eve would've been witnesses of the first Sabbath and Adam was around for 930 years to share his eye witness account to his progeny.

Here are a few languages that use the word Sabbath for the seventh day of the week:

Greek: Sabbaton (Sabbath)
Latin: Sabbatum (Sabbath)
Spanish: Sábado (Sabbath)
Portuguese: Sabbado (Sabbath)
Italian: Sabbato (Sabbath)
French: Samedi (Sabbath day)
High German: Samstag (Sabbath)
Prussian: Sabatico (Sabbath)
Russian: Subbota (Sabbath)
Congo Africa: Sabbado or Kiansbula (Sabbath)​

These are a few examples from our modern languages which still identify the seventh day as the Sabbath. There are a number of ancient languages which also do the same thing. The Babylonian language—dating back to 3800 BC (or shortly after the flood)—identifies the seventh day as "Sa-ba-tu" or Sabbath. Exactly what one would expect to find embedded in this Earth's recorded history.

I pray this helps.

But for the grace of God go I,cyspark

Thanks good post and I enjoyed reading it. Did you write this? If you did it is well put together. Welcome to CF Icyspark and nice to meet you. HAPPY SABBATH! :)
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi, thanks for your post! I largely agree. I have a question of sorts more than a criticism. I just want to know what you think of this more than anything. What do you think of the idea that Christ is the true sabbath?

Hi @True Counterphobia, nice to meet you. I think this is a good and fair question as this teaching is taught in most of the Christian world but is it true? For me I can't see anywhere in the scriptures where it says that Jesus is the true Sabbath or that the "seventh day" creation Sabbath is a "shadow law" of anything. The reason for this is that according to the scriptures alone the only definition of the creation Sabbath of God's 4th commandment is written in Exodus 20:10 where it says "...the "seventh day" is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God. There is no scripture anywhere that says Jesus is a Sabbath.

If you look at the context of Hebrews 4:1-5 it defining two rest's. One is the rest of believing and following the gospel (Gods Word) and the second as God's rest which is defined in these scriptures as the "seventh day" Sabbath created from the foundation of the world. Now if you think about when the Sabbath was made on the "seventh day" of the creation week as shown in Genesis 2:1-3 that God made for all mankind (Mark 2:27) you will see that it is impossible for the Sabbath of God's 4th commandment to be a "shadow law" of anything. Why do I say this? Well firstly the "creation Sabbath" was created on the "seventh day" of the creation week making of the seventh day of the week which is every seventh day of the week.

If you read God's 4th commandment in Exodus 20:8-11 it points "backwards" not "forwards" to things to come. "Remember" the Sabbath day... So according to God's 4th commandment it is a memorial of creation pointing backwards to the finished work of creation and a celebration of God as the creator of heaven and earth.

In fact I believe according to the bible it is impossible for the creation Sabbath to be a shadow law of anything. Why do I say thin? Well the Sabbath was created "before" the fall (sin) of mankind when mankind were in perfect harmony with their creator. When the Sabbath was made for mankind (Genesis 2:1-3; Mark 2:27) there was no sin, no Moses, no Israel, no plan of salvation was given because there was nothing to be saved from. Therefore there were no shadow laws pointing to God's plan of salvation for mankind. There was only Adam and Eve created in God's image walking and talking with God in the garden of Eden.

That said there were many different kinds of other ceremonial shadow sabbaths in the old testament. These however were not the same as God's 4th commandment that is one of God's 10 commandments. These Feast sabbaths attached to the annual Feast days could fall on any day of the seek depending on the yearly cycle and were not attached to specific set times but were linked directly into the annual Feasts of Leviticus 23.

Anyhow I have spent some time prayerfully studying the above in a lot of detail from the bible. If you would like to discuss what the scriptures teach in detail here your welcome to PM me as to not take the OP off topic too much. Nice to meet you and good question.

God bless.
 
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