Independently repeatable evidence that God interacts with our world

[Clizby WampusCat]

The story of Jesus making the old obsolete.

Neither the old or new have been shown to be true.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

I wonder why you bother attacking the beliefs of others. You are a collection of molecules randomly assembled by nothing but time and chance. Your thoughts are no more correct than the thoughts of murderous Kim Jong Un, whose thoughts are also a result of evolutionary process - if indeed evolution is true. What makes your thoughts and better, any more accurate, or any more true than any other human being? That includes those you despise called Christians. The answer is simple. Nothing. If man evolved, then his every action, thought, response, emotion, imagination, creation and desire is purely a product of random processes that are hard wired into an individual. How can you say one is right and one is wrong? The very concept has no meaning. You can say that you are programmed to think a different way to others. But you have no moral right to judge anyone else.

I see no difference between this and your beliefs. A god does not solve this problem. What makes God's morality any different? It is just His subjective opinion on right and wrong.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

The evidence for God its the universe and creatures themselves, things like beauty love, spirituality etc and well designed things don't come out by themselves, but people are blinded by the devil to not see this.

Nature is not well designed. Every plant and animal including humans have design flaws that would have been easily corrected if a perfect god designed them. But we do see in nature what we would expect and have predicted by evolution.

I am not blinded by the devil, I do my best to believe things based on good evidence. Provide evidence for a devil please.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Actually God reveals Himself to everyone. Most just don't want to see. It's more like describing a sunset to people who refuse to open their eyes.

What about people like me that want to know if god exists but have not been shown convincing evidence yet?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

No point. Atheists generally have no interest in truth and reality. They start with an unproveable position themselves and then demand Christians prove that they are wrong. No amount of evidence suffices. Even in a court of law, if there is enough circumstantial evidence, a conviction can be secured. But the atheist rejects everything that does not fit their world view. That's their choice.

Most atheists would not say a god does not exist. They are simply not convinced a god does exist. Provide convincing evidence and we would have no choice but to believe.

Using a strawman argument and lumping all atheists into one belief system allows you to dismiss them and not have to deal with the real and substantive objections we have to the god claim.

 

[SkyWriting]

Neither the old or new have been shown to be true.

I give instructions for discovering here:- Answered Prayer

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

I give instructions for discovering here:- Answered Prayer

Why is what you wrote true?

 

[SkyWriting]

Why is what you wrote true?

Hmmmm. I'm stuck on that one.
Why would I tell the truth? Hmmm

 

[SkyWriting]

Nature is not well designed. Every plant and animal including humans have design flaws that would have been easily corrected if a perfect god designed them.

If that were true, you'd have a case.
There are about 3000 Billionaires.
What design defects in common do they have fixed?
I'll settle for 20 who have had the same defects repaired.

 

[SkyWriting]

What about people like me that want to know if god exists but have not been shown convincing evidence yet?

Mark 11:24
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask in prayer,
believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

- Answered Prayer - God heard your prayer, planned, and laid out your answer for you to live through.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Hmmmm. I'm stuck on that one.
Why would I tell the truth? Hmmm

I am asking why you believe it is true. I know that you believe it is true.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

If that were true, you'd have a case.
There are about 3000 Billionaires.
What design defects in common do they have fixed?
I'll settle for 20 who have had the same defects repaired.

I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Mark 11:24
Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask in prayer,
believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

- Answered Prayer - God heard your prayer, planned, and laid out your answer for you to live through.

Until you give good reasons to believe the bible is true, quoting scripture means nothing.

 

[NxNW]

It is perfect, we are not.

So it's utterly incomprehensible?

If not, then please tell what percentage is comprehensible. 10%? 50%? 75%?

 

[NxNW]

Or perhaps it was written by men who loved God, rather than God with a glowing printing press.

That's an interesting speculation, but if true, it renders all of it unreliable.

 

[NxNW]

Atheists generally have no interest in truth and reality.

This is a lie.

They start with an unproveable position themselves

What position is that?

and then demand Christians prove that they are wrong.

Link?

No amount of evidence suffices.

I promise you, zero is insufficient.

Even in a court of law, if there is enough circumstantial evidence, a conviction can be secured. But the atheist rejects everything that does not fit their world view.

Atheists reject flimsy arguments and appeals to emotion. There is a difference.

 

[Aussie Pete]

This is a lie.



What position is that?


Link?


I promise you, zero is insufficient.



Atheists reject flimsy arguments and appeals to emotion. There is a difference.

Whatever.

 

[NxNW]

Whatever.

You can't argue with air-tight logic like that!

 

[Aussie Pete]

This is the same as God does not want me to know He exists. He made me the way I am knowing I would not be able to believe on the evidence presented so He must not want me to know He exists.

I don't know what makes other people tick. I never doubted that God was real. I can't say why. I wanted nothing to do with God. My dad was an atheist. He was hostile and aggressive about it too. I went to Sunday School. There were no cartoons on TV (No TV at first!) to give parents a break from the kids, so my parents sent us to Sunday School instead. That was a normal English tradition. My dad was OK to a degree. He really thought that all four kids would be like him. But he also thought that we should be able to choose for ourselves.

I was put off Christianity by my 3 years of compulsory church attendance. 1 hour was an eternity for me. However, when I was 12 there was a family crisis (so it seemed at the time. It was not quite the disaster that my young mind imagined). I prayed to this God that I avoided at all costs. My prayer was answered. I was shocked to the core and immediately tried to rationalise it as coincidence.

My two younger brothers remained atheists. My sister became a Christian a few years after me. You can come to know God. I know how crazy this sounds, but in fact God did not make you the way you are. You've been on the forum enough to know the story of Adam and Eve, how they turned away from God and became Satan's puppets. God wants to save you from all that. Do you know what I get if you ask God to open your eyes and save you? Nothing. I get no brownie points with God. I'll be delighted because I do not want to see anyone go to hell. I have been a Christian 50 years. It is tough at times. But I could not go back to the way I was.

I was in hospital with heart trouble a couple of years ago. They wanted to stop my heart and fire it up again. I wondered if it was my last day on earth. I was almost looking forward to going to the next life. As it happened, my heart came back to normal without intervention. Both the anaesthetist and heart specialist were Christians. We had a little church meeting to celebrate, only briefly as they were busy. This is the story of my life, God being there to help all the time. It could be your story too.

 

[Carl Emerson]

So it's utterly incomprehensible?

If not, then please tell what percentage is comprehensible. 10%? 50%? 75%?

Truth is spiritually discerned.

Understanding scripture is not an intellectual exercise, when you foster a humble relationship with Him, the pages come alive.