NT support for a third temple

[Jipsah]

The idea is that all the religions of the world will be mashed together to the agreement of most so that everyone will be willing to go along with the "united" one-world version.

So Christians and Muslims and Sikhs and Hindus and Jews and Parsees and whoever else are all gonna join hands, sing Kumbaya, and worship a pantheon of gods together at the Temple of All Deities. Yeeeaah, no. Human nature militates against that ever happening. You can't even get all Christians to agree on anything.

See, he sets sets himself up as being over "everything that is called God or is worshiped". That would include Allah, Mary, Buddah, Gaia, the almighty dollar, the sun, or whatever else people call their god and worship. If Islam, Catholicism, Earth worship, etc. were combined to create a one-world religion that the anti-christ sets himself up over, then the temple could be just about anything.

And if we all had some ham, we could have ham sandwiches... if we had some bread. Ain't happenening mate.

 

[Jipsah]

Because you have a carnal mind, thinking Christ was talking about a physical building. Just like the Jews of His days.

Boy, Signs, I wish I was all spiritual like you!

 

[keras]

Because He’s already ruling the universe on His throne.

And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

Hebrews 10:12-13 tells us that Jesus now sits at God's right hand and waits until His enemies are destroyed.
Those who like to think Jesus is ruling the earth now, are in error as Satan was the prince of this world at Jesus first Advent; Matthew 4:8-10 and still is now; 1 Peter 5:8-9

Only when Jesus Returns, will His enemies be gone. At Armageddon and by all the end times events before that.
THEN He can take up His rightful rule; for the next thousand years.

 

[Aldebaran]

So Christians and Muslims and Sikhs and Hindus and Jews and Parsees and whoever else are all gonna join hands, sing Kumbaya, and worship a pantheon of gods together at the Temple of All Deities. Yeeeaah, no. Human nature militates against that ever happening. You can't even get all Christians to agree on anything.

Who said people would be given much of a choice. Agree to it and take a mark and pledge allegiance to the new god or you won't be able to buy food or anything else ever again. Few people will pass on that offer if the world is in turmoil.

And if we all had some ham, we could have ham sandwiches... if we had some bread. Ain't happenening mate.

When I get responses like that, I quickly realize there's not much of a discussion to be had.

 

[Hammster]

Hebrews 10:12-13 tells us that Jesus now sits at God's right hand and waits until His enemies are destroyed.
Those who like to think Jesus is ruling the earth now, are in error as Satan was the prince of this world at Jesus first Advent; Matthew 4:8-10 and still is now; 1 Peter 5:8-9

Only when Jesus Returns, will His enemies be gone. At Armageddon and by all the end times events before that.
THEN He can take up His rightful rule; for the next thousand years.

But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
— Matthew 12:28

 

[Timtofly]

But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
— Matthew 12:28

Sounds to me if Christ is personally on the earth, not the fact demons are cast out by the Spirit of God.

If it is the removal of demons, then those without demons already had the kingdom of God upon them, ie the religious leaders themselves.

The point was made that neither Jesus nor the religious leaders were using Satan to divide up Satan's own kingdom. Jesus did not accuse them, like they were accusing Him. Jesus pointed out that if Satan was behind their own people doing it, then the kingdom of heaven was not involved at all. But yet, even when they cast out devils, the kingdom of heaven did not come to earth. Because they could not do a permanent, and complete work. Jesus did it in such a way as to actually result in a more permanent solution, and the kingdom of God was realized more than just when humans cast out demons.

Having demons or not having demons would not be the point. Having Christ on the earth working as Christ is the point.

 

[keras]

But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
— Matthew 12:28

Colossians 1:12 Give joyful thanks to the Father, who has made you ready to share in the heritage of the Kingdom.
The Kingdom is our inheritance, but until the King arrives it isn't a reality yet.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Exactly. He is the chief cornerstone of the temple of God. Here is a description of the third temple of God, which is not a physical temple building:

Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Indeed...the New Testament congregation is the church where Christ is the chief cornerstone of that building. Not physical temple in 70AD or third temple. So....

Rev 11:1-2
(1) And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
(2) But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

The Preterists and Premillennialist who insisted that this chapter speaks of the literal building of a Temple in Jerusalem, completely ignore the fact that it is commanded that no court be measured for building, yet speaks of the court as being there.

So if this was talking about building the literal Temple, then why would the court not be measured for building, and yet God say the court is given to the Gentiles? It makes no sense!

But when we understand the truth of this being a spiritual Temple, then the reason the court is not included for, and therefore cannot be measured part of the Temple. Thus the court 'outside' of the Temple's dimensions symbolize the place of those who externally or covenantally link themselves with Christ. They are the professed Christians but who are not truly raised up in Christ. In other words, they have joined the external Covenant Churches, saying they are part of the Holy Temple, but they have not truly entered therein.

So the temple in NT is not really about physical stones and building, whether its a so-called third temple in the future, or 70AD temple, but His PEOPLE, the living stones of God's congregation, making up of Elect (The stones of Gold Silver and Precious Stones) and Professed Christians (The stones of wood, hay and stubble). The church is only a visible representation of God's kingdom on Earth SINCE THE CROSS! Not 70AD temple. One need to wonder why the Lord is giving up the court of the temple to the Gentiles? Do they even know who these Gentiles really are that comes into the court of the Temple as God's judgment upon unfaithful believers, spare the temple, altar, and worshippers therein? Did it happen in 70AD? Or will it happen in future third temple? Of course not.

 

[Hammster]

Sounds to me if Christ is personally on the earth, not the fact demons are cast out by the Spirit of God.

If it is the removal of demons, then those without demons already had the kingdom of God upon them, ie the religious leaders themselves.

The point was made that neither Jesus nor the religious leaders were using Satan to divide up Satan's own kingdom. Jesus did not accuse them, like they were accusing Him. Jesus pointed out that if Satan was behind their own people doing it, then the kingdom of heaven was not involved at all. But yet, even when they cast out devils, the kingdom of heaven did not come to earth. Because they could not do a permanent, and complete work. Jesus did it in such a way as to actually result in a more permanent solution, and the kingdom of God was realized more than just when humans cast out demons.

Having demons or not having demons would not be the point. Having Christ on the earth working as Christ is the point.

I guess I should have posted the whole passage.


Then a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute was brought to Jesus, and He healed him, so that the mute man spoke and saw. All the crowds were amazed, and were saying, “This man cannot be the Son of David, can he?” But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “This man casts out demons only by Beelzebul the ruler of the demons.” And knowing their thoughts Jesus said to them, “Any kingdom divided against itself is laid waste; and any city or house divided against itself will not stand. If Satan casts out Satan, he is divided against himself; how then will his kingdom stand? If I by Beelzebul cast out demons, by whom do your sons cast them out? For this reason they will be your judges. But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
— Matthew 12:22-28

His point was that because He cast out demons, the kingdom of God had come upon them.

 

[Hammster]

Colossians 1:12 Give joyful thanks to the Father, who has made you ready to share in the heritage of the Kingdom.
The Kingdom is our inheritance, but until the King arrives it isn't a reality yet.

Now you’re just making things up. It doesn’t say that anywhere in that verse.

 

[keras]

Now you’re just making things up. It doesn’t say that anywhere in that verse.

I quoted the verse, then commented on it.
I use the Revised English Bible. A better translation for understanding the true meaning.

That we are not yet in the Kingdom of Jesus as world ruler, is plain to all.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

A lot of people here are making categorical statements, that actually contradict scripture.
They also seem to think they know the Mind of God.

Why shouldn't we know that? Did you know that Christians have the mind of Christ because of having the Holy Spirit dwelling in us who gives us spiritual discernment? Are you getting your understanding from the Holy Spirit or from your own imagination?

1 Corinthians 2:15 The person with the Spirit makes judgments about all things, but such a person is not subject to merely human judgments, 16 for, “Who has known the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him?”. But we have the mind of Christ.

Apparently they think Jesus will live in an apartment and rule the world from a rented office.

If having a temple building was necessary for Jesus to rule from, then why won't there be one on the new earth?

Revelation 21:22 I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

I have pointed out the prophesies which show there will be a new Temple.

You have pointed out your false interpretations of many prophecies which shows your lack of discernment.

Why be so adamant to reject another Temple?

Why be so adamant to be ignorant about the true nature of the temple of God? We (the church) are the temple of God and Jesus has no need for a building. Frankly, it's utterly foolish to think He would ever need one. As I pointed out, there will be no temple on the new earth, so why would Jesus need one to rule from during the supposed earthly millennial kingdom? You're making up requirements for Him that He Himself never said anything about and scripture never says anything about.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

I quoted the verse, then commented on it.
I use the Revised English Bible. A better translation for understanding the true meaning.

That we are not yet in the Kingdom of Jesus as world ruler, is plain to all.

It's plain to me that you don't know what you're talking about. You are making the assumption that He can't rule over all unless all obey Him. But, that is not the case. The fact that many people don't obey Him doesn't change the fact that He is King of kings and Lord of lords and it certainly doesn't prevent us from being in His kingdom. If some people in your country don't accept the leadership of your Prime Minister and they disobey the laws of your country, does that mean she is not the Prime Minister? Of course not.

The following passages, along with the passage that your translation mistranslates (Col 1:12-14), make it very clear that Jesus is our King now and rules over all now.

Matthew 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.".

Revelation 1:5 and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, 6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father—to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen.

1 Peter 2:9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, God’s special possession, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light. 10 Once you were not a people, but now you are the people of God; once you had not received mercy, but now you have received mercy.

Ephesians 2:18 I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in his holy people, 19 and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is the same as the mighty strength 20 he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, 21 far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. 22 And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, 23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.

You also don't seem to understand that His kingdom "is not of this world" (John 18:36) and "does not come with observation" (Luke 17:20).

 

[TribulationSigns]

That we are not yet in the Kingdom of Jesus as world ruler, is plain to all.

You do not make any sense. In fact, you deny the kingdom of Christ today because you are expecting a physical kingdom first...like the Jews of His Days! If Jesus Christ is not ruling now in His Kingdom, we are NOT saved today.

Col 1:13-14
(13) Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
(14) In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

 

[Aldebaran]

It's plain to me that you don't know what you're talking about. You are making the assumption that He can't rule over all unless all obey Him. But, that is not the case. The fact that many people don't obey Him doesn't change the fact that He is King of kings and Lord of lords and it certainly doesn't prevent us from being in His kingdom. If some people in your country don't accept the leadership of your Prime Minister and they disobey the laws of your country, does that mean she is not the Prime Minister? Of course not.

The following passages, along with the passage that your translation mistranslates (Col 1:12-14), make it very clear that Jesus is our King now and rules over all now.

Matthew 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.".

Christ may have the authority on Earth, but He doesn't seem to have actually put it into effect at this time. See Revelation 11:15, which tells of the future:

"Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”

And then 2 verses later:

"saying, “We give You thanks, Lord God, the Almighty, the One who is and who was, because You have taken Your great power and have begun to reign."

Clearly, these things haven't happened yet. So in the meantime, the kingdom of the world isn't the kingdom of God, and He has not begun to reign.

 

[Aldebaran]

You do not make any sense. In fact, you deny the kingdom of Christ today because you are expecting a physical kingdom first...like the Jews of His Days! If Jesus Christ is not ruling now in His Kingdom, we are NOT saved today.

Col 1:13-14
(13) Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
(14) In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Those who are saved are indeed part of Christ's kingdom, but that doesn't mean that His kingdom is ruling and reigning. See my previous post as to when that happens.

 

[ViaCrucis]

ALL Christians are Paul's intended audience.

That's not how the Bible works.

What Paul said in 2 Thess 2:1-4 is for the end times; just before Jesus Returns.

Is that what the Church in Thessaloniki would have understood it to mean? If they didn't, then any further attempted exegesis is actually eisegesis. And further, it is insulting to suggest that we can have a better understanding of Scripture then the ones who wrote and first received the Scriptures--that is pure human hubris.

It did console the Thessalonian Christians, as they then knew not to think Jesus had Returned until the Temple was desecrated by an ungodly man sitting in the holy Place. And still today, we can know it must happen before Jesus Returns.

In what way would the third temple, its inner halls, and artifefacts be a holy place? What would be holy about it?

The Tabernacle was holy.
The Temple built by Solomon was holy.
The Second Temple was still holy.
And then it was destroyed, and we enter into the Holy of Holies by the blood of the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world, who is our Great High Priest.

Take and eat, this is His body broken for you. Take and drink, this is His blood of the new covenant.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Hammster]

I quoted the verse, then commented on it.
I use the Revised English Bible. A better translation for understanding the true meaning.

That we are not yet in the Kingdom of Jesus as world ruler, is plain to all.

Whatever version you use, it’s still not in that verse.

 

[Hammster]

Christ may have the authority on Earth, but He doesn't seem to have actually put it into effect at this time.

Has His kingdom grown?

 

[Aldebaran]

Has His kingdom grown?

Yes, all the time.
A kingdom can be built up without actually taking power and reigning. It's currently in the process of being built.

Another verse I thought of that illustrates that Christ's kingdom isn't here and isn't in power yet. It was what the thief on the cross said to Jesus:

Luke 23:42
And he was saying, “Jesus, remember me when You come into Your kingdom!”

This again indicates that Christ's kingdom is still not in power.