The Warped World of Incel Extremists

[2PhiloVoid]

it did seem a little like that which was why I wanted to explain that it was not necessarily the case. In the church community it can be a little bit judgy like that, people just kind of assume everyone is married or on their way to being married and if they're still single by their mid 20's they must be voluntarily choosing that.
People don't always grasp but no, God didn't create an Eve for everyone.

Oh don't worry. I've had my own share of lived experiences by which to understand this stuff.

 

[bèlla]

Was it a bad thing to do? Yes, it is still lying. But at the same time.. you can kind of feel some sympathy for why she did it. Some people are just desperate to somehow feel something for someone and have it be reciprocated, even if it's based on a lie.

I have no sympathy for her if she misled him and they were building a relationship. She should have admitted she wasn't comfortable with her appearance and left it at that. If he insisted on seeing pictures she has choice. Provide them or not. She didn't have to lie.

I went through this years ago in a chat room. He spoke to three of us. But his mistake was sharing the same information. He forgot that women talk. A casual image was his downfall. Everything was fake and he was older.

I confronted him. He came clean. He wanted to continue and for me to keep the secret. But I wouldn't. The cat was out the bag. He tried to save face and say we knew. That was his second mistake. We corrected the problem.

 

[bèlla]

Why spread rumors, why get people to threaten to physically attack me over it when I was already well aware that I was rejected and was not going to press it any further?

I'm sorry you experienced that. I don't agree with their behavior. Expressing interest shouldn't warrant that response. If someone refuses to back down; aggression is understandable. But just because is unacceptable. I don't like bullying or teasing either.

I've called my friends out in school and afterward about pretty girl antics. Beauty and money don't give you the right to be nasty. I'm not into making people feel crappy because of their appearance or resources. I don't have time for that.

If I don't like you it's due to your character or behavior. Not something along those lines. That's petty.

 

[Jamdoc]

I have no sympathy for her if she misled him and they were building a relationship. She should have admitted she wasn't comfortable with her appearance and left it at that. If he insisted on seeing pictures she has choice. Provide them or not. She didn't have to lie.

I went through this years ago in a chat room. He spoke to three of us. But his mistake was sharing the same information. He forgot that women talk. A casual image was his downfall. Everything was fake and he was older.

I confronted him. He came clean. He wanted to continue and for me to keep the secret. But I wouldn't. The cat was out the bag. He tried to save face and say we knew. That was his second mistake. We corrected the problem.

It's sympathy for the why, not justifying the how.

 

[bèlla]

It's sympathy for the why, not justifying the how.

Every one has something that makes them feel insecure, unimportant, etc. But when we're interacting with others and desiring a connection we must be willing to show ourselves. You want them to embrace the real you. Not a mirage.

I value people who acknowledge their imperfections. It inspires my compassion and empathy. That's where bonding begins. We've had this discussion and I've pointed out others who aren't afraid to get real. In a world of pretending it's refreshing.

That's how people with challenges end up settled. As @Sparagmos shared. They tell the truth. Even when they feel ashamed and scared. What you admitted today very few would say publicly. Especially a man.

You can't build lifelong connections without transparency. You're already there. Some people never arrive. They spend their lives hiding. What you said softens a woman's heart. Keep praying.

 

[Jamdoc]

Every one has something that makes them feel insecure, unimportant, etc. But when we're interacting with others and desiring a connection we must be willing to show ourselves. You want them to embrace the real you. Not a mirage.

I value people who acknowledge their imperfections. It inspires my compassion and empathy. That's where bonding begins. We've had this discussion and I've pointed out others who aren't afraid to get real. In a world of pretending it's refreshing.

That's how people with challenges end up settled. As @Sparagmos shared. They tell the truth. Even when they feel ashamed and scared. What you admitted today very few would say publicly. Especially a man.

You can't build lifelong connections without transparency. You're already there. Some people never arrive. They spend their lives hiding. What you said softens a woman's heart. Keep praying.

I admitted something? or Sparagmos?

 

[SarahsKnight]

Being born an unattractive man is a real suffering, you will never even feel like this.

I consider myself a physically unattractive man - a 4 out of 10 on a typical day, and a 6 at best on a good day, just barely above plain - and I have also never been in a romantic relationship, as you yourself apparently bemoan lacking. ..... And yet I hold none of the moderately disturbing thoughts and sentiments towards women as a race that you seemed to in your first post in this thread ... in particular the part where you want God's wrath to fall upon the world because a woman or two in the past might have been rude in her rejection of you, thus in your eyes the whole dating system is corrupt and you think God should burn it all down (read: because you aren't getting a fair piece of the system).

Think about that. Going by your two posts in this thread as far as where I am quoting you now, you are already on a course to becoming the level of incel that the OP has been speaking of, and it isn't pretty.

You are not a creep or a criminal on account that you have little to no romantic experience with women; you are acting like one on account of being so angry about the fact.

 

[bèlla]

I admitted something? or Sparagmos?

You did. I value your honesty. She admitted her brother's struggle.

 

[bèlla]

@SarahsKnight ~buffs your armor and beams~

That's why He made us a little lower than angels. We'd have blown this up long ago.

 

[Jamdoc]

You did. I value your honesty. She admitted her brother's struggle.

what specifically did I admit?
I'm not sure of specifics but I tend to be kind of a "no defenses" kind of guy.
honestly it opens me up to being hurt easily but at the same time, it hurts more to just bottle up and pretend that everything is great.

 

[Sparagmos]

Marriage rate is in decline.
so it's not like you have people just pairing off, but rather a hookup culture where multiple women pursue "the best" men.
as incels call them "Chads", their view is lopsided though seeing 80% of women going after the "top" 20% of men and leaving out all the rest.
It's not that, but it also isn't everyone sticking to monogamous partners so nobody's left out.

That’s not what is happening in real life, though. At least where I live, most people are paired up and most women don’t pursue men out of their league. These guys whole life is online and it’s what they see happening on tinder.

 

[SarahsKnight]

@SarahsKnight ~buffs your armor and beams~

Thanks but I don't wear armor, my dear. I find it too ... cliche. I think I do better in a magic cape, or cloak. (I know what you meant, though. )

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

We’re in a different period now. In spite of the complaints, I think you’re seeing the truth. If she didn’t have to choose him to secure her life or sustenance, would she have him? The answer is no. I wouldn’t want someone who’s only with me because of my provision or breeding potential.

For the life of me I cannot remember this Chinese film that I saw the trailer for while watching another back in the 90s. It was about a young girl in love with a young soldier who went away to war and died. She somehow ended up with an older widowed man in her village (not sure if arranged) and at first she hated him and was repulsed by him. But slowly she wound up loving him fully.

I thought it was one of Zhang Yimou's films (tearjerkers but I love them), yet I couldn’t find it in his catalogue.

Reminds me of an anecdote an oriental brother said to a preacher friend: "You Americans' marriages start hot and end cold. Our's start cold and end hot."

I know we can’t pull off arranged marriages in our culture, but they have some benefits perhaps.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Given what the original definition of "Incel" is... stemming from "Involuntarily Celibate"

I think that makes a case for legalizing prostitution.

And I'm not trying to be "witty" or ironic when I say that.

Involuntarily (against someone's will; without someone's cooperation.)
Celibate (a person who abstains from sexual relations.)


The way I look at it, sexual interaction is just as much of a basic human desire as eating.

If a person (for whatever reason) was unable to make themselves financially stable, would we call them "Inpoo" (short for Involuntarily Poor)? And if they acted out in various ways due to their poor financial circumstances, would we label them extremists?

I use that example, because when people are born into poor neighborhoods (outside of their control), much of society tends to take a more sympathetic view when people in that environment act out with hostility or commit acts of aggression or crime...or portray it as "it's really more of a reflection of the unfairness of society than it is that individual"

Yet, when a dude is born with sub-par looks or genetics, maybe isn't born with the intellectual gifts to earn a lot of money, and born socially awkward...when they act out in bad ways due to the frustration of not being able to secure a sexual partner, society has created a "slang term" and "extremist designation" for them.

If they're bent out of shape about not being able to "hook up" with a woman...seems like legalizing the outlet that could let them blow off some steam may make them a little less "tense". (in the same way that creating good jobs in a poor neighborhood could lessen someone's likelihood of feeling like they should rob a gas station or join a gang with other people in that same situation)

 

[dzheremi]

Arranged or family/community-mediated marriage is still normal for Coptic people, even in the USA from what I've seen. One of the deacons from my old community of St. Bishoy in Albuquerque, NM was briefly in such an arrangement after his parents found him the perfect girl back in Egypt (he was only in the USA temporarily to his degree, at that time). Sadly, it turned out when he went to Egypt to visit and meet her, they didn't get on for whatever reason, but it's still considered a good way to go about things. I kinda like that just as an organizational principle (why not outsource the job of finding someone to aunties who refuse to mind their own business anyway? ), though of course being a westerner I am also at least slightly uncomfortable with it as a means to a happy marriage. I'm sure it works for plenty of people, but I had to put the breaks on hard when some of the Egyptians started saying over the Agape meal or at other communal meetings outside of liturgy "Jeremy, we have to find you a nice girl to settle down with, so that you'll stay with us." No, you guys...I'm only here to get my degree, too. So it never happened for me, but I could see the value in the approach, particularly as Coptic people really don't do modern, western-style dating anyway (since we have to marry within the communion, so it makes sense to meet someone in/through church).

 

[bèlla]

what specifically did I admit?
I'm not sure of specifics but I tend to be kind of a "no defenses" kind of guy.
honestly it opens me up to being hurt easily but at the same time, it hurts more to just bottle up and pretend that everything is great.

You shared your experiences with the opposite sex and your approaches.

 

[MehGuy]

I think for many incels the problem is much deeper than wanting mere sex. Most are probably mainly starving for romantic companionship. Prostitutes will not cut it.

Although I mostly find the idea of inceldom silly. Autistic people and those with high social anxiety have my higher sympathizes but in the internet age dating niches should be available for everyone. I suspect the ones who are not masochistic are mostly reacting in anger that they have to settle for bottom of the barrel women.. women equivalent to their own value.

Tinder and whatnot might be changing the landscape and women may partly be developing higher standards, but in the back of most of their mind's they probably realize they do have to settle with someone below the level of a "Chad". The relationship will probably not be as romantically or sexually gratifying as being with someone of higher value.. but most people are probably not doomed to being "involuntarily celibate. Romantically or sexually.. Even someone like the Elephant man in modern times can probably exploit the fetish scene. There do exist women who are attracted to men with severe burns. The internet in theory should be a place where anyone can find someone.

 

[Jamdoc]

You shared your experiences with the opposite sex and your approaches.

Or well... lack of approaches

 

[ThisIsMe123]

That is a horrible truth, I mean that's how things seem to operate.. but it is horrible all the same.
the line between "sexual harassment" or not is sometimes just if he was handsome or not.
I'd think that.. on a first approach it wouldn't be sexual harassment just a rejection, and becoming sexual harassment if they persist after being refused, but sometimes it's considered harassment on the first approach now, making men kind of hesitant to even approach people as a result. Because it's more than a rejection, it can get them made social pariahs now, if not cost them a job.

I'll just leave this here...it's an SNL skit, it's funny because it's true. lol

 

[ThisIsMe123]

Thanks for elaborating.

My circle of friends consists of like-minded people who share my interests. I don't have apples and oranges friendships. We have a lot in common. As a result, the single women I'm acquainted with are seeking partners who fall in that group.

You really think relationships won't work if there are no shared interests? I know marriages/relationships where each person has their own thing they enjoy doing. The husband goes fishing, the wife does her thing. etc.