Why did the Lord come to the earth?

[Clare73]

You follow the good news of "Christ crucified".
Vive la Difference! between "authoritive NT teaching" and Matthew 23:8.
I follow the good news of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Since we know what Jesus taught we know what Peter's gospel is, Galatians 2:7-9... which couldn't have been "Christ crucified" yet, since the Pharisees hadn't yet killed Jesus to steal His inheritance.

There is no "Peter's gospel" in the NT.

Yours is not orthodox Christianity.

 

[Ligurian]

Galilee was occupied by Gentiles, and was called Galilee of the Gentiles before Israel occupied it.
It kept its name after Israel finally occupied it. That is the origin of the name.

It's not about ten tribes.

Try letting the Bible interpret itself.

Matthew 4:15 The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, [by] the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles;

ethnos = a race (as of the same habit), i.e. a tribe; specially, a foreign (non-Jewish) one (usually, by implication, pagan):--Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

For it to have been Galilee of the Gentiles, it would not have been the land of Zabulon and Nephthalim... in other words, "Gentiles" is the wrong word choice.

The same Greek word is translated as "nation" in this verse:

John 11:51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;

It is certainly about the northern half of the divided kingdom... the lost sheep of the house of Israel... not about Judea which tried and succeded in murdering Jesus... Matthew 23:37-39.

 

[Clare73]

To answer your question, Why did Jesus Christ come into the world?
Answer: So that we can go to heaven. The only way to make it to heaven was through his blood because we were not worthy to make it to heaven.

Yes, we must believe in and trust on his person and atoning death (blood--Romans 3:25) for the forgiveness of our sin and its punishment (eternal separation from God) and right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty," justified.

Jesus Christ is the creator of everything and we were made in his image.
We are all in him.

Only those who believe in and obey him are in him.

In the old testament, they made sacrifices
for the forgiveness of the sins of the physical body and not the spiritual body.

They made sacrifices for spiritual defilement (sin).

The NT reveals that we have a natural physical body, and at the resurrection we will have a spiritual physical body.
Our natural (sinful, weak, mortal/decaying) physical bodies will die, and at the resurrection will be transformed into spiritual (sinless, strong, immortal) physical bodies (1 Corinthians 15:42-44, 52).

 

[Clare73]

You sound like a red letter Christian? Red Letter Christians – Staying true to the foundation of combining Jesus and justice, Red Letter Christians mobilizes individuals into a movement of believers who live out Jesus’ counter-cultural teachings.

Sounds to me like a typical dispensational attempt to divide the cross into two events,
one: atonement without death (contrary to Mosaic law under which he died and atoned) and
two: death.

 

[Ligurian]

There is no "Peter's gospel" in the NT.

Yours is not orthodox Christianity.

"Orthodox definition is - conforming to established doctrine especially in religion."

Matthew 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at His doctrine: 29 For He taught them as [one] having authority, and not as the scribes.

The Gospel of the Kingdom

Matthew 24:14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 26:13 Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this Gospel shall be preached in the whole world, shall also this, that this woman hath done, be told for a memorial of her.

Matthew 28:16-20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you

1 Peter 4:17-18 For the time [is come] that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if [it] first [begin] at us, what shall the end [be] of them that obey not the Gospel of God? 18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 24 For all flesh [is] as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: 25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you. (Esaias 40:3, John 1:23)

James 1:18 Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

John 17:17 Sanctify them through Thy truth: Thy word is Truth.

John 16:2 They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service. 16:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved Me, and have believed that I came out from God.

John John 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 15:7 If ye abide in Me, and My words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

John 14:15-17 If ye love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you for ever; the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

John 13:35 By this shall all [men] know that ye are My Disciples, if ye have love one to another.

John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me, but on Him that sent Me. 45 And he that seeth Me seeth Him that sent Me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear My words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of Myself; but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His Commandment is Life Everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

Begotten by the word of truth. This is the Gospel of the Kingdom.

 

[Ligurian]

If you don't think he was only sent to the nation Israel in his first coming, it must follow Jesus was also sent to the gentiles then correct?

Nope.

Matthew 10:5 These Twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

Matthew 15:24 But He answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Matthew 28:16-20 Then the Eleven Disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them... And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All authority is given unto Me in heaven and in earth. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations... to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you...

Apparently Jesus didn't have authority over all nations until He came back glorified unto His Disciples. And He told His Disciples to teach the nations what He'd taught to them. Were the 10 lost tribes scattered among these nations to such an extent that they wouldn't have been recognizable without a DNA analysis? Probably, since they mixed with nations around their homeland. I'm not one of those whole-nation-lost-tribe people... I believe that the blood itself is thinned out in all nations... so that knowing the people of 10-north-tribes becomes a matter of finding those sheep who hear Jesus voice and will not listen to the voice of strangers/hirelings. It's as though the Gospel of the Kingdom were a lighthouse, searching.

The dragon seems to see them as such, for he makes war upon, and kills those who keep the Commandments of God given by Jesus. It's not just the remnant who has this doctrine... it's all of the people who follow Matthew and John and the Revelation. They are single-minded, cleaving to these words alone, because these words are Eternal Life.

 

[Ligurian]

But there is no true knowledge of God apart from or in disagreement with it.

Only those who believe in and obey him are in him.

Agreed. John 14:15-17

 

[Clare73]

Try letting the Bible interpret itself.

Okay, let's do that.

Matthew 4:15 The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, [by] the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles;
ethnos = a race (as of the same habit), i.e. a tribe; specially, a foreign (non-Jewish) one (usually, by implication, pagan):--Gentile, heathen, nation, people.
For it to have been Galilee of the Gentiles, it would not have been the land of Zabulon and Nephthalim...

And that is precisely what it is, according to Matthew 4:15.

Grammatically. . . "Galilee of the Gentiles" is suppositional to (descriptive of) "Zebulun and Napthali, by the sea, beyond Jordan;" (which flows into the Sea of Galilee). . .i.e, they are located west and north of the Sea of Galilee.
"Zebulun and Napthali" are the same teriitory as "Galilee of the Gentiles."

Jesus spent most of his public ministry in the area of Zebulon and Naphtali, northern Galilee, formerly the northern kingdom (consolidated with Judah in the church, Hosea 1:11), which territory was occupied by Gentiles.

in other words, "Gentiles" is the wrong word choice.

Actually, according to the grammatical construction of Matthew 4:15, it is exactly the right word choice. . .imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease. . .

John 11:51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year,
he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;

"Die for the nation" in the sense of John 11:48, to keep the Romans from taking away the place of the chief priests and the Pharisees, and the nation itself. . .

It is certainly about the northern half of the divided kingdom... the lost sheep of the house of Israel... not about Judea

Not according to the text of Matthew 4:15.

 

[Clare73]

"Orthodox definition is - conforming to established doctrine especially in religion."

Matthew 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at His doctrine: 29 For He taught them as [one] having authority, and not as the scribes.

The Gospel of the Kingdom

Matthew 24:14 And this Gospel of the Kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 26:13 Verily I say unto you, Wheresoever this Gospel shall be preached in the whole world, shall also this, that this woman hath done, be told for a memorial of her.

Matthew 28:16-20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you

1 Peter 4:17-18 For the time [is come] that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if [it] first [begin] at us, what shall the end [be] of them that obey not the Gospel of God? 18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

1 Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. 24 For all flesh [is] as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: 25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you. (Esaias 40:3, John 1:23)

James 1:18 Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

John 17:17 Sanctify them through Thy truth: Thy word is Truth.

John 16:2 They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service. 16:27 For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved Me, and have believed that I came out from God.

John John 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 15:7 If ye abide in Me, and My words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

John 14:15-17 If ye love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you for ever; the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

John 13:35 By this shall all [men] know that ye are My Disciples, if ye have love one to another.

John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me, but on Him that sent Me. 45 And he that seeth Me seeth Him that sent Me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear My words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of Myself; but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His Commandment is Life Everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

Begotten by the word of truth. This is the Gospel of the Kingdom.

I don't see anything referring to "Peter's gospel" in the above.

"Peter's gospel" is a notion of man, not found in the NT.

Not orthodox Christianity.

 

[Ligurian]

Try letting the Bible interpret itself.

Matthew 4:15 The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, [by] the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles;

ethnos = a race (as of the same habit), i.e. a tribe; specially, a foreign (non-Jewish) one (usually, by implication, pagan):--Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

For it to have been Galilee of the Gentiles, it would not have been the land of Zabulon and Nephthalim... in other words, "Gentiles" is the wrong word choice.

The same Greek word is translated as "nation" in this verse:

John 11:51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;

It is certainly about the northern half of the divided kingdom... the lost sheep of the house of Israel... not about Judea which tried and succeded in murdering Jesus... Matthew 23:37-39.

Okay let's do that.

And that is precisely what it is, according to Matthew 4:15.

Grammatically. . . "Galilee of the Gentiles" is suppositional to (descriptive of) "Zebulun and Napthali, by the sea, beyond Jordan;" (which flows into the Sea of Galilee). . .i.e, they are located west and north of the Sea of Galilee.
"Zebulun and Napthali" are the same teriitory as "Galilee of the Gentiles."

Jesus spent most of his public ministry in the area of Zebulon and Naphtali, northern Galilee, formerly the northern kingdom (consolidated with Judah in the church, Hosea 1:11), which territory was occupied by Gentiles.

Actually, according to the grammatical construction of Matthew 4:15, it is exactly the right word choice. . .imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease. . .
"Die for the nation" in the sense of John 11:48, to keep the Romans from taking away the place of the chief priests and the Pharisees, and the nation itself. . .

Not according to the text of Matthew 4:15.

(Rust added... Your bias is showing.)

1 Peter 1:1 Peter, an Apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers Diaspora scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia... 23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. ... 25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the Gospel is preached unto you.
2:10 Which in time past [were] not a people, but [are] now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy. ... 12 Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by [your] good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

1 Peter 2:10 is quoting Hosea 2:23 from what was written about the "children of Israel", not the "children of Juda". So... is it a stretch to think that Peter's from the lost sheep of the house of Israel? and then so is Andrew... Matthew 4:18-22, Matthew 10:6-7...

I don't think it's a strech at all, because of this prophecy:
"in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God"... "in the place" is literally the land from which they were taken by Assyria.

And here, prophecy is fulfilled: Matthew 4:13-17.
These "sons of the living God" are Galilean Disciples upon whom light is sprung up: The Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven taught by Jesus, the Son of God, in Galilee of the Nation, to the house of Israel.
Matthew 4:16-17 The people which sat in darkness saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up. From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

Osee 1:6 And she conceived again, and bore a daughter. And he said to him, Call her name, Unpitied: for I will no more have mercy on the house of Israel, but will surely set myself in array against them. 7 But I will have mercy on the house of Juda, and will save them by the Lord their God, and will not save them with bow, nor with sword, nor by war, nor by horses, nor by horsemen. 8 And she weaned Unpitied; and she conceived again, and bore a son. 9 And he said, Call his name, Not My people: for ye are not My people, and I am not your God. 10 Yet the number of the children of Israel was as the sand of the sea, which shall not be measured nor numbered: and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God.LXX

In Peter's time, there was a difference between Judah and Israel. He says Galilee of the Nation of Israel held the house of Israel... and that the 10 tribes were also in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia.

But Juda's house is still desolate, in Matthew 23:37-39.

 

[Ligurian]

<snip>imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease<snip>

I don't see anything referring to "Peter's gospel" in the above.

"Peter's gospel" is a notion of man, not found in the NT.

Not orthodox Christianity.

The definition of orthodoxy... from someone who says:
"imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease".


Matthew 13:10-19 And the disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

 

[pescador]

The definition of orthodoxy... from someone who says:
"imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease".


Matthew 13:10-19 And the disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

Translation...

Matthew 13:11-23 (In 21st Century English, not 17th Century Englyshe, correctly formatted)...

"He replied, “Because the knowledge of the secrets of the kingdom of heaven has been given to you, but not to them. Whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them. This is why I speak to them in parables:

“Though seeing, they do not see;
though hearing, they do not hear or understand.

In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah:

“‘You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
For this people’s heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.’

But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. For truly I tell you, many prophets and righteous people longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it.

“Listen then to what the parable of the sower means: When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in their heart. This is the seed sown along the path. The seed falling on rocky ground refers to someone who hears the word and at once receives it with joy. But since they have no root, they last only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away. The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful. But the seed falling on good soil refers to someone who hears the word and understands it. This is the one who produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown.” NIV

 

[Clare73]

(Rust added... Your bias is showing.)

The grammatical construction of authoritative NT teaching is showing.

1 Peter 1:1 Peter, an Apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers Diaspora scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia... 23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. ... 25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the Gospel is preached unto you.
2:10 Which in time past [were] not a people, but [are] now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy. ... 12 Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by [your] good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

1 Peter 2:10 is quoting Hosea 2:23 from what was written about the "children of Israel", not the "children of Juda". So... is it a stretch to think that Peter's from the lost sheep of the house of Israel? and then so is Andrew... Matthew 4:18-22, Matthew 10:6-7...

I don't think it's a strech at all, because of this prophecy:
"in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God"... "in the place" is literally the land from which they were taken by Assyria.

And here, prophecy is fulfilled: Matthew 4:13-17.
These "sons of the living God" are Galilean Disciples upon whom light is sprung up: The Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven taught by Jesus, the Son of God, in Galilee of the Nation, to the house of Israel.
Matthew 4:16-17 The people which sat in darkness saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up. From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

Osee 1:6 And she conceived again, and bore a daughter. And he said to him, Call her name, Unpitied: for I will no more have mercy on the house of Israel, but will surely set myself in array against them. 7 But I will have mercy on the house of Juda, and will save them by the Lord their God, and will not save them with bow, nor with sword, nor by war, nor by horses, nor by horsemen. 8 And she weaned Unpitied; and she conceived again, and bore a son. 9 And he said, Call his name, Not My people: for ye are not My people, and I am not your God. 10 Yet the number of the children of Israel was as the sand of the sea, which shall not be measured nor numbered: and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God.LXX

In Peter's time, there was a difference between Judah and Israel. He says Galilee of the Nation of Israel held the house of Israel... and that the 10 tribes were also in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia.

But Juda's house is still desolate, in Matthew 23:37-39.

Israel and Judah are united in the NT church (Hosea 1:11) of OT and NT saints, the one and only people of God, the one olive tree, which began with Abraham.

There are no people of God who do not believe in and trust on the person and atoning death (blood--Romans 3:25) of Jesus of Nazareth, the Christ (the Promise), for the remission of their sin and right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty," justified (apart from faith's works).

 

[Clare73]

The definition of orthodoxy... from someone who says:
"imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease".


Matthew 13:10-19 And the disciples came, and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.

Still don't see anything referring to "Peter's gospel" in the above.

Not orthodox Christianity.

 

[Cornelius77]

Please don’t get offended from my post here.

My goal is to learn. I am quite new to Christianity and still learning.

My problem is possibly that I have a deep thirst to learn more about the Lord. All the time. I study the Bible virtually every day.

Today, during my study, something new came to me. Oddly, a concept that was causing me some mental anguish was relieved when reading a chapter in Zechariah. I surely wasn’t expecting it, but it led me into a further search. I decided to put my findings into words and post it here. I am seeking constructive comments and guidance.

Personally, I focus primarily on the OT, and heavily on the gospels, particularly the words of Jesus. If you have information to assist me, please use those portions of our beautiful Bible. Thanks to all.


So here we go:


It doesn’t seem to make sense that Jesus died on the cross for our sins.


Let’s examine this concept from statements in the gospels which give us information relative to the life of Jesus. I will considerably simplify this for brevity.


Jesus was born.


At age 12, he visits the temple.


He is a carpenter until age 30.


When he was around 30 years old, he is baptized and begins a ministry.


From this point until his day of crucifixion he traveled around Judea; enlisted some followers, performed miracles, taught the people, schooled the pharisees, and had a few temptations.


Let’s now focus on the final day.


It appears that some people think that Jesus’ purpose was to die on a cross for the sins of some people. Let’s examine this claim.


First, it must be that the Lord came to the earth for some purpose.

Unless there is a purpose, why do anything?

We probably all agree that the Lord had a purpose, but what is that purpose?

After the arrival on earth, the Lord proceeded to exercise various means available to him to reach his intended result.

And when the result occurs, following his purpose, then the purpose has been completed, or finished.


Matthew 5:17-18: Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.


(The law and prophets are the Christian Old Testament.)

Which are the ONLY scriptures that Jesus ever spoke of.


From the above, it appears that we can see the purpose.

His purpose was stated by the Lord himself, so hopefully, we cannot disagree.


Now, what exactly MUST be fulfilled? Is it a few select verses here and there?


John 5:39. Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.


The Lord himself again tells us the answer. ALL the scriptures testify of him, then all must be fulfilled. What are these scriptures he speaks about? Most people would probably conclude that they are what Christians refer to as the Old Testament. That’s it.


The life of Jesus and his work are spoken of throughout the Scriptures, there is no doubt.


So the purpose of the Lord, fulfilling the scriptures, would be his ‘enactment’ of all events in those scriptures. When is this purpose, then, completed?


Many times in the gospels the Lord speaks about fulfilling the scriptures. The night before his death, he chastened Peter, after Peter cut an ear off a servant:


Matthew 26:52-54 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword. Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?


The final time on the cross:


John 19:24 24. They said therefore among themselves, Let us not rend it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be: that the scripture might be fulfilled, which saith, They parted my raiment among them, and for my vesture they did cast lots. These things therefore the soldiers did.


And it continues:


John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.


We see that the purpose that the Lord came for was accomplished.


After being accomplished, Jesus spoke his final words:


John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.


“It is finished”.


His final words tell us that his purpose was finished.


Nothing else to do, so Jesus “gave up the ghost”


He gave his own life, no one on earth took it.


He had accomplished his purpose.


The death of the empty body hanging on the cross came AFTER his purpose was finished.


It appears that the death is merely the end of the earthly body, since the purpose of Jesus was accomplished by the spirit within, which was released by him just before his death.

God bless you if you made it through that long post of mine.

Regarding why Jesus must come to earth, my church friend gave me a very logical answer. Another friend made a video that kinda sums up his explanation. Not sure if this makes sense to you...?

He kinda relates why old testament law must exist and how Jesus transformed (a.k.a fulfill) the OT law into NT spiritual law through his death and resurrection.

 

[.Jeremiah.]

I'm sorry, I thought your "questions" were rhetorical... especially, since I already told michael21 that I keep the Commandments of Jesus. The OT says with all your heart and soul, but doesn't say with your mind. Surely the reasons are clear for that as well, since the New Covenant is written in our mind, according to the Prophets... and Jesus says the Holy Spirit reminds His sheep of what He said and teaches what Jesus means. The only reason I replied to your rhetorical questions was to confirm what you said, I sure didn't expect to get accused of something by doing so. Are you His sheep?

Hmmm, did I respond to the wrong person?

If so, I’m terribly sorry.

I was asking Michael the same question over and over, and he would just quote a couple of verses and ignore me.

I guess that explains why he completely didn’t respond to me last time.

Edit: I just went back and moved that post to Michael.
It was definitely NOT meant toward you.

 

[.Jeremiah.]

OK
So do you obey all of the following, alongside all the other literal commands of Christ in the Gospels? I can quote more if you like
You do not to invite friends, family or neighbours home for a meal but rather the poor, lame, blind and beggars?
You never so much as to hint to anyone if you fast?
If someone wanted to borrow from you, you give to them without expecting anything back?
You from your heart love people who may be unkind to you and persecute you?
You would give someone who stole from you more than what they stole with nothing but love in your heart for them?
You would leap for joy if you are persecuted?
Only an honest answer would be following Christ's teaching wouldn't it?

ok

You didn’t answer my question AGAIN
SO, I will ask directly:

How do YOU love the Lord? (With all your heart, soul, mind and strength). How do you do it?

The Lord said that (loving the Lord), is the GREATEST commandment. OF ALL.

The Lord said there is another, that is LIKE it. Yes, another 1, like the greatest.

The Lord said ALL of the law and the prophets HANG ON THOSE. ALL OF THE LAW.

So, I don’t need to prooftext some strange verses, and throw them at people, and ask “do you do this”? That’s the problem with christianity today. Too many people throwing a few prooftexted verses at everyone else.

The Lord made it simple:

“Master, which is the great commandment in the law?”
Jesus said unto him, “Thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.”

So, I ask again: How do you love the Lord thy God?
What ways do you DO it?

 

[.Jeremiah.]

The Bible is a written document, it is not the person of God.
It reveals God, it is God's truth, but it itself is not God himself.
But there is no true knowledge of God apart from or in disagreement with it.

You are right.

 

[Ligurian]

1 Peter 1:1 Peter, an Apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers Diaspora scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia... 23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. ... 25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the Gospel is preached unto you.
2:10 Which in time past [were] not a people, but [are] now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy. ... 12 Having your conversation honest among the Gentiles: that, whereas they speak against you as evildoers, they may by [your] good works, which they shall behold, glorify God in the day of visitation.

1 Peter 2:10 is quoting Hosea 2:23 from what was written about the "children of Israel", not the "children of Juda".

"in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God"... "in the place" is literally the land from which they were taken by Assyria.

Prophecy fulfilled

These "sons of the living God" are Galilean Disciples upon whom light is sprung up: The Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven taught by Jesus, in Galilee of the Nation, to the house of Israel.

Matthew 4:16-17 The people which sat in darkness saw great light; and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up. From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

Osee 1:6 And she conceived again, and bore a daughter. And he said to him, Call her name, Unpitied: for I will no more have mercy on the house of Israel, but will surely set myself in array against them. 7 But I will have mercy on the house of Juda, and will save them by the Lord their God, and will not save them with bow, nor with sword, nor by war, nor by horses, nor by horsemen. 8 And she weaned Unpitied; and she conceived again, and bore a son. 9 And he said, Call his name, Not My people: for ye are not My people, and I am not your God. 10 Yet the number of the children of Israel was as the sand of the sea, which shall not be measured nor numbered: and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said to them, Ye are not My people, even they shall be called the sons of the living God.LXX

In Peter's time, there was a difference between Judah and Israel. He says Galilee of the Nation of Israel held the house of Israel... and that the 10 tribes were also in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia.

But Juda's house is still desolate, in Matthew 23:37-39.

Actually, according to the grammatical construction of Matthew 4:15, it is exactly the right word choice. . .imagine that. . .the NT getting it right. . .wonders never cease. . .

"Grammar refers to the way words are used, classified, and structured together to form coherent written or spoken communication."

As in Galilee of the Nation of Israel.

Myth of a Gentile Galilee, by Mark Chancey
assets.cambridge.org/97805218/14874/sample/9780521814874ws.pdf

Your bias is still showing, Clare73.
Because your sentence says the NT... not the translators thereof.
Did your grasp of grammar fail you?
Or are you an unbeliever regarding the New Testament?
Whose "authoritative NT teaching" are you talking about?

The grammatical construction of authoritative NT teaching is showing.

Israel and Judah are united in the NT church (Hosea 1:11) of OT and NT saints, the one and only people of God, the one olive tree, which began with Abraham.

There are no people of God who do not believe in and trust on the person and atoning death (blood--Romans 3:25) of Jesus of Nazareth, the Christ (the Promise), for the remission of their sin and right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty," justified (apart from faith's works).

Judah/Jerusalem is still a secular nation. So, this verse hasn't happened yet.

Osee 1:11 And the children of Juda shall be gathered, and the children of Israel together, and shall appoint themselves one head, and shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezrael.
=
Revelation 16:16 And He gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

Which begs the question: What does any of this have to do with modern Jerusalem? unless the modern isn't the ancient.

Still don't see anything referring to "Peter's gospel" in the above.

Not orthodox Christianity.

What do you think Peter was teaching, which has him called in John 21 a witness of God, because he kept the commandment of Matthew 28:20? Deductive reasoning lets you figure things out. Do you have to be spoon-fed explicit phrases, like "Peter's Gospel", in order to know that what Peter taught was the Gospel of the Kingdom?

Even Paul affirms this. Galatians 2:7-9 says Peter went to the circumcision; Romans 15:8 says Jesus went to the circumcision. And Matthew 10:5-7 and Matthew 15:24 say the Galilean Apostles and Jesus went to the lost sheep of the house of Israel: the curcumcision which was NOT in Judah/Benjamin... because the house of Judah wasn't lost. Jesus tells the Pharisees that He came to give mercy to those who needed to repent... again, not those in Judah which had sacrifice.

Jesus' last words in Matthew says The Eleven taught what He had taught them, which is the Good News of the Kingdom, so God's message to the circumcision never changed after Jesus' Resurrection. And it doesn't in the Revelation, either, because we see the dragon making war on those who keep the Commandments of God and have the Testimony of Jesus... meaning that these Commandments are what Jesus brought from the Father, John 12:50.

 

[Ligurian]

Regarding why Jesus must come to earth, my church friend gave me a very logical answer. Another friend made a video that kinda sums up his explanation. How sure if this makes sense to you...?
[...]
He kinda relates why old testament law must exist and how Jesus transformed (a.k.a fulfill) the OT law into NT spiritual law through his death and resurrection.

Jesus taught the Law of the Kingdom in Matthew 5-Matthew 7... the Kingdom Law judges the heart before the action can harm someone. The heart and soul and mind is Spirit-dwelt if we keep the Commandments of Jesus.

Jesus' blood with hyssop, John 19:28-30, fulfilled the Passover text, Exodus 12:21-27, and makes Him the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world, Genesis 3:15. And the Passover text makes Jesus the advocate/defender of His sheep in Heaven, Revelation 12:9-10. The death of Jesus' human body is what makes Resurrection even possible: Jesus' Resurrection defeated Death, Genesis 3:15.