CDC updates guidance, recommends vaccinated people wear masks indoors in certain areas

[probinson]

If you don't know who Dr. Vinay Prasad is, take 8-9 minutes to watch this video where he talks about the CDC's new masking guidance.

 

[loveofourlord]

Well in this case we know it came from CHY-na. It's COVID from China. It's China's fault and China's responsibility at this point.

Again what does this have to do with the price of tea in china? WEere talking china TOWN which has little to no relation to the country, are you saying that Chinese Americans are to blame for covid and shouldn't go near them? Or at least at that point?

 

[jayem]

I was a subject in the Pfizer clinical trial and have been fully vaccinated since last September. I’m confident of my immune status, but it’s possible that I can be an asymptomatic carrier of Delta, and transmit it to unvaccinated persons. (Who, unfortunately, are fairly numerous where I live.) I’m a retired health care provider myself. Even if someone I might infect doesn’t succumb, I know how his/her medical care further stresses an overburdened system. I just found out today that a major hospital in my area is totally full. No beds available. So if wearing a mask lessens the risk of others needing medical care, I’m all for it.

I actually like keeping my face covered. I can finally be out in public and not send young children and small animals running for their lives, screaming in terror.

 

[Blade]

Be nice if the CDC said something about ANYONE NEW coming into the USA with no masks.. are not required to get the shot what so ever and then free to go almost anywhere they want. To me...and we wonder why were seeing spikes where? Up north on that border? hmm what are the odds. Just wondering

 

[stevil]

Given these pieces of info, wouldn't that mean that me going back to wearing a mask is solely for the benefit of anti-vaccine types who don't take it seriously and have no intention of getting vaccinated anyway?

I presume there are people who for valid medical reasons cannot take the vaccine.
If most people in your country were vaccinated then it protects these people above too, because the disease will not be prevalent.
But if you have a large percentage of people refusing to take the vaccine, and you yourself are vaccinated but catch the disease and then you spread it on, then you are playing a part in keeping the disease prevalent in society which will lead to the deaths of some of those people who cannot be vaccinated for valid medical reasons.

Anyway, It's up to you.
I don't see what the big deal is in wearing a mask for now.

 

[Aldebaran]

Are you just obtuse, or back tracking now you been caught being racist, she made the point because people like you were avoiding china town out of fear of catching covid, racists made a huge deal out of it hell that's where your argument comes from. That Pelosi wasn't taking the virus seriously and telling me to go to china town and risk getting the virus. If your nor racist, might not want to use racist talking points.

Or complain about someone trying to deal with racism.

I guess I'll have to give you a more condensed version of what I already showed you. Here's what happened before Pelosi's Chinatown stunt:

Dec 31, 2020, China confirms dozens of cases.

Jan 20, 2020, Other countries confirm cases, including the USA.

Jan 23, 2020, China closes off Wuhan

Jan 30, 2020 World Health Organization declares a global emergency

Feb 2, 2020 First known death outside of China reported. Total of 360 deaths in China.

Feb 24, 2020 Pelosi goes to Chinatown

Mayor De Blasio of New York preceded her in encouraging the same type of thing on Feb. 13th, and then came the questions about the wisdom of such decisions only about a month later: Coronavirus Update: Did Local Leaders Send The Wrong Message In Early Days Of The Outbreak?

 

[Halbhh]

Question about the Israel finding of 39% vaccine effectiveness against Delta infection (which includes asymptomatic and mild of course):

One thing I wonder about is since generally during the vaccine trials and for at least 2 weeks after, the participants would typically be wearing masks, but....since they would not really know which of them had gotten the real vaccine and which had a placebo, right?....then logically it would seem likely that most or almost all would just continue wearing masks during the remaining weeks/months of the trial, at least.

But in contrast to those trial participants, just the general population of a nation like Israel for instance (highly vaccinated and more rapidly than other nations) would be people that would take off their masks after their 2nd shot, you'd think....even if some would wait the 2 weeks (some).

Many would take it off before 2 weeks, though many would wait 2 weeks.

So, that's a significant difference at least during that time period comparison between vaccinated and masked vs. vaccinated and not masked.

Possibly giving us information about the combination of vaccine and masking vs not masking.

So, I just wonder if that was well taken into account in various previous viewpoints about transmissibility?

Israel reporting that the vaccination effectiveness against infection (which would be generally mild cases) was about 39%:
"Pfizer and BioNTech’s Covid-19 vaccine is just 39% effective in Israel where the delta variant is the dominant strain, but still provides strong protection against severe illness and hospitalization, according to a new report from the country’s Health Ministry.

The efficacy figure, which is based on an unspecified number of people between June 20 and July 17, is down from an earlier estimate of 64% two weeks ago and conflicts with data out of the U.K. that found the shot was 88% effective against symptomatic disease caused by the variant.

However, the two-dose vaccine still works very well in preventing people from getting seriously sick, demonstrating 88% effectiveness against hospitalization and 91% effectiveness against severe illness, according to the Israeli data published Thursday.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/23/del...ective-in-israel-prevents-severe-illness.html

Agreed. The modeling has often been highly inaccurate, despite lots of smart people all over the place trying to get it right. This pandemic has behaved in ways that are not well understood by anyone.

 

[Strathos]

We are actually doing really well with our vaccines and responses, considering this is a brand new virus that we know practically nothing about.

The people ruining it are those that refuse to take medical recommendations seriously.

If everyone had practiced masking and social distancing, and taken the vaccine when it was available for their age group, the pandemic would be over by now, and the majority of these new variants wouldn't exist.

But some people just refuse to follow common sense.

 

[loveofourlord]

I guess I'll have to give you a more condensed version of what I already showed you. Here's what happened before Pelosi's Chinatown stunt:

Dec 31, 2020, China confirms dozens of cases.

Jan 20, 2020, Other countries confirm cases, including the USA.

Jan 23, 2020, China closes off Wuhan

Jan 30, 2020 World Health Organization declares a global emergency

Feb 2, 2020 First known death outside of China reported. Total of 360 deaths in China.

Feb 24, 2020 Pelosi goes to Chinatown

Mayor De Blasio of New York preceded her in encouraging the same type of thing on Feb. 13th, and then came the questions about the wisdom of such decisions only about a month later: Coronavirus Update: Did Local Leaders Send The Wrong Message In Early Days Of The Outbreak?

Again, racists were acusing Chinese Americans of having covid and the purpose wasn't to downplay the threat, but to counteract the racists thinking that China town and such were going to make everyone sick.

 

[Halbhh]

I guess I'll have to give you a more condensed version of what I already showed you. Here's what happened before Pelosi's Chinatown stunt:

Dec 31, 2020, China confirms dozens of cases.

Jan 20, 2020, Other countries confirm cases, including the USA.

Jan 23, 2020, China closes off Wuhan

Jan 30, 2020 World Health Organization declares a global emergency

Feb 2, 2020 First known death outside of China reported. Total of 360 deaths in China.

Feb 24, 2020 Pelosi goes to Chinatown

Mayor De Blasio of New York preceded her in encouraging the same type of thing on Feb. 13th, and then came the questions about the wisdom of such decisions only about a month later: Coronavirus Update: Did Local Leaders Send The Wrong Message In Early Days Of The Outbreak?

Weather forecasts about days 4 and 5 days out change pretty often.... Is that a big deal? Not really.

In spite of the fact that we know the forecast is just reasonable guessing, and only mostly close much of the time, and often wrong, we still of course rationally want even those imperfect forecasts.

But no one would just pretend a forecast 5 days out is supposed to be a 100% sure thing.

That'd not be a normal way of looking at life. We don't expect forecasters to be magical or have crystal balls.

Or at least not if one has been paying attention to weather forecasts for more than a few weeks.

 

[Aldebaran]

I presume there are people who for valid medical reasons cannot take the vaccine.
If most people in your country were vaccinated then it protects these people above too, because the disease will not be prevalent.
But if you have a large percentage of people refusing to take the vaccine, and you yourself are vaccinated but catch the disease and then you spread it on, then you are playing a part in keeping the disease prevalent in society which will lead to the deaths of some of those people who cannot be vaccinated for valid medical reasons.

Anyway, It's up to you.
I don't see what the big deal is in wearing a mask for now.

"For now" has been in effect since "2 weeks to flatten the curve", although it ended with, "If you've been fully vaccinated, you no longer need to wear a mask"---Joe biden.

And now we've progressed to "Wear a mask even if you've been vaccinated".

 

[Halbhh]

We are actually doing really well with our vaccines and responses, considering this is a brand new virus that we know practically nothing about.

The people ruining it are those that refuse to take medical recommendations seriously.

If everyone had practiced masking and social distancing, and taken the vaccine when it was available for their age group, the pandemic would be over by now, and the majority of these new variants wouldn't exist.

But some people just refuse to follow common sense.

You and 'Bama Governor

It is frustrating.

But....I think a lot just honestly didn't know it's a threat, because they listen to people that falsely claimed to them that it isn't a threat.

Some have realized it is more of a threat than they thought, and now it's a bigger threat than those empty claims the vaccines were too quick, etc.

So, we have to sacrifice now and many will have to wear masks again in a lot of indoor situations, for the sake for those that didn't/don't have that same ability/time/knowledge to find out sooner what we can learn sooner ourselves.

 

[stevil]

"For now" has been in effect since "2 weeks to flatten the curve", although it ended with, "If you've been fully vaccinated, you no longer need to wear a mask"---Joe biden.


And now we've progressed to "Wear a mask even if you've been vaccinated".

I understand that it is confusing in USA.
You first had a task force which was giving the official USA stance, but then you had a president who was at the same podium giving conflicing messages
And you had the CDC giving an independent "scientific based" recommendation.

Fauci was the Science person in the task force. The task force's stance should have been seen as the definitive position for USA.

Then you had a change of scientists or scientists removed completely from the task force, replaced a pandemic expert with a radiologist.
Then once Trump was humiliated with his Disinfectant fiasco, the task force and daily briefings stopped.

Then you had a change of government, and a reset. A promise on getting vaccinations out quickly, then you had the Right and Right media with a campaign against vaccinations. You had Right wing politicians doing political theatre to attack the scientists and the idea of mask wearing.

USA is just a mess. They couldn't possibly have botched this worse than they did.
On paper they were supposed to be one of the most prepared countries in terms of potential pandemics.
NZ were supposed to be grossly underprepared.

USA clutched defeat from the jaws of victory.
NZ just did the basics and came home a winner.

 

[Aldebaran]

I understand that it is confusing in USA.
You first had a task force which was giving the official USA stance, but then you had a president who was at the same podium giving conflicing messages
And you had the CDC giving an independent "scientific based" recommendation.

Fauci was the Science person in the task force. The task force's stance should have been seen as the definitive position for USA.

Then you had a change of scientists or scientists removed completely from the task force, replaced a pandemic expert with a radiologist.
Then once Trump was humiliated with his Disinfectant fiasco, the task force and daily briefings stopped.

Then you had a change of government, and a reset. A promise on getting vaccinations out quickly, then you had the Right and Right media with a campaign against vaccinations. You had Right wing politicians doing political theatre to attack the scientists and the idea of mask wearing.

USA is just a mess. They couldn't possibly have botched this worse than they did.
On paper they were supposed to be one of the most prepared countries in terms of potential pandemics.
NZ were supposed to be grossly underprepared.

USA clutched defeat from the jaws of victory.
NZ just did the basics and came home a winner.

You forgot what I just posted, a video of the guy in charge of what you refer to as "a reset" saying that if we've been vaccinated, we no longer need to wear a mask.
But I guess he gets a pass, even though he still listens to Fauci, who you say should have been seen as the definitive position for USA, and is the one who keeps changing his mind about what we're supposed to be doing. "Wear a mask even if vaccinated" directly contradicts what biden said.

 

[rjs330]

Read the very next paragraph:



They are assuming people are rational actors and are always willing to do the right thing. But as this pandemic has shown us, a lot of people are *not* rational actors and are *not* willing to do the right thing. Hence the need for government enforced rules to try to keep everyone collectively safe.

Vaccines are a prime example. Allowing people to volunteer for vaccines has shown us that a sizeable portion of the U.S. population is unwilling to get the vaccine. This is prolonging the pandemic, raising the risk of the evolution of more variants, and collectively making things worse for everyone.

So you're forgive me if I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for those folks when faces with the government telling them what to do. These people are clearly not able to make choices in the best interest of their society on their own.

I'd the CDC didn't change their recommendations every five minutes they might be more trustworthy. If they actually made sense it also might be more trust worth. We are going to mask up hundreds of millions of people regardless of vaccination status when the number of people people getting COVID are the unvaccinated and those dying from it are really low. They are recommending children K-12 all wear masks in school. There is very little evidence that the vaccinated are a danger of chief method of spread. Same goes for kids.

There is so much gas lighting going in over this from the left. In St Louis County there is a death rate of about 1 per day at this point. And in NY State it's about 4. And there is no evidence that the vaccinated are responsible for this. These numbers are so low. This is laughable and defies logic.

In NY 40% of teachers are not vaccinated. Yet they want to mask up our kids to protect those who refuse despite the fact that there is no evidence the kids are major vectors.

Get vaccinated they said, get back to normal they said. Don't wear masks they said, Wear masks they said. And now it's get vaccinated and wear masks. They have no clue what they are doing. They are grasping at straws.

 

[probinson]

If everyone had practiced masking and social distancing, and taken the vaccine when it was available for their age group, the pandemic would be over by now, and the majority of these new variants wouldn't exist.

In case you've forgotten, the "Delta" variant was actually the "India" variant before it became politically incorrect to name variants after the location of their origin. Why? Because it originated in India, where vaccination percentage is extremely low not primarily because of vaccine hesitancy, but because of vaccine availability.

If we were smart, we would ensure that the most vulnerable all over the world were vaccinated before we worried about vaccinating children and young adults, who have almost no risk from the virus at all, and that would actually help reduce the risk of the emergence of new variants.

 

[pitabread]

Get vaccinated they said, get back to normal they said. Don't wear masks they said, Wear masks they said. And now it's get vaccinated and wear masks. They have no clue what they are doing. They are grasping at straws.

Hyperbole aside, in an emerging pandemic with rapidly changing variables, it's understandable why guidance and recommendations do change. People act like health professionals should have perfect information, but that's just not how things work in the real world.

That people are using this as a rationalization to ignore said guidance is part of the problem. I often wonder what things in the U.S. would look like if everyone had taken the pandemic seriously. You guys could be at 80%+ fully vaccinated by now. Instead, you have this sizable contingent of the population choosing to ignore such precautions and are ensuring the pandemic will continue to stretch out in time and impact.

Ya'll have made your bed and now you get to live in it.

 

[renniks]

...and that's fine if you choose to do so due to your personal circumstances.

However, statistical logic would dictate that I (being fully vaccinated) coming in contact with you (being vaccinated) in a store presents an infinitesimally small risk of transmitting covid (that could then be transmitted to your family)

Therefore, the guidance reversal still doesn't make a lot of sense.

It's not about percentages. It's about seeing how far they can push control.

 

[probinson]

Hyperbole aside, in an emerging pandemic with rapidly changing variables, it's understandable why guidance and recommendations do change. People act like health professionals should have perfect information, but that's just not how things work in the real world.

This is a cop-out.

At the beginning of the pandemic, I would have agreed with you. But after 18 months, we still have no idea what NPI's are beneficial under what circumstances. We know nothing more about the efficacy of masks, social distancing, lockdowns, and that fault rests on the self-assuredness of public health official who unilaterally decided that they would just implement these measures indefinitely with no data or evidence to prove their efficacy. As Dr. Prasad said in the article I linked earlier today, anyone who calls themselves a scientist should be embarrassed by our collective failure to generate knowledge.

 

[ThisIsMe123]

Hyperbole aside, in an emerging pandemic with rapidly changing variables, it's understandable why guidance and recommendations do change. People act like health professionals should have perfect information, but that's just not how things work in the real world.

That people are using this as a rationalization to ignore said guidance is part of the problem. I often wonder what things in the U.S. would look like if everyone had taken the pandemic seriously.

We'd be like other countries who actually had taken the virus seriously, and not scream "My rights are being violated!" Some of the other countries look at the United States and just shake their heads. They are better examples than we are.