CDC updates guidance, recommends vaccinated people wear masks indoors in certain areas

[ThatRobGuy]

CDC updates guidance, recommends vaccinated people wear masks indoors in certain areas | CNN

I did the right thing during 2020, wore a mask and kept distance...

Did the right thing in 2021, got vaccinated...

This particular reversal in mask guidance? I'm not so sure...

Given the CDC directors comments and statements earlier, there seems to be a breakdown in the logic somewhere.

She openly acknowledged that the chance of contracting any serious level of disease when vaccinated is low... she also acknowledged that while it's still possible to transmit with an asymptomatic infection, it's less likely.

We know that the vaccine is widely available for anyone who wants to get one and there's no supply issues stopping anyone from getting vaccinated.

We know that infections in the age group that's not currently eligible are overwhelmingly mild or asymptomatic.

Given these pieces of info, wouldn't that mean that me going back to wearing a mask is solely for the benefit of anti-vaccine types who don't take it seriously and have no intention of getting vaccinated anyway?


Maybe we can come up with a new term for people like myself who have no interest in going back to masking for the benefit of people who've used words like "sheeple" to describe me for the last 18 months. Maybe "second wave anti-mask"? Sort of like the term "second wave feminist"?

 

[Isilwen]

CDC updates guidance, recommends vaccinated people wear masks indoors in certain areas | CNN

I did the right thing during 2020, wore a mask and kept distance...

Did the right thing in 2021, got vaccinated...

This particular reversal in mask guidance? I'm not so sure...

Given the CDC directors comments and statements earlier, there seems to be a breakdown in the logic somewhere.

She openly acknowledged that the chance of contracting any serious level of disease when vaccinated is low... she also acknowledged that while it's still possible to transmit with an asymptomatic infection, it's less likely.

We know that the vaccine is widely available for anyone who wants to get one and there's no supply issues stopping anyone from getting vaccinated.

We know that infections in the age group that's not currently eligible are overwhelmingly mild or asymptomatic.

Given these pieces of info, wouldn't that mean that me going back to wearing a mask is solely for the benefit of anti-vaccine types who don't take it seriously and have no intention of getting vaccinated anyway?


Maybe we can come up with a new term for people like myself who have no interest in going back to masking for the benefit of people who've used words like "sheeple" to describe me for the last 18 months. Maybe "second wave anti-mask"? Sort of like the term "second wave feminist"?

I am fully vaccinated and still wear a mask indoors in public places. I have immunocompromised people at home and I am not taking a chance.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I am fully vaccinated and still wear a mask indoors in public places. I have immunocompromised people at home and I am not taking a chance.

...and that's fine if you choose to do so due to your personal circumstances.

However, statistical logic would dictate that I (being fully vaccinated) coming in contact with you (being vaccinated) in a store presents an infinitesimally small risk of transmitting covid (that could then be transmitted to your family)

Therefore, the guidance reversal still doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

[Crwth]

Does no one find it the least bit incredible how blame for this virus has shifted FROM THE VIRUS to the unvaccinated?

The United States of America has officially become communist.

 

[RDKirk]

First: Influenza is still out there. Now that mask-wearing is a "thing," we might as well avoid influenza in situations that we're breathing the exhalations of a crowd of people.

Second: The current vaccines are judged about 85% effective against the Delta variant. Whether you wear a mask or not depends on how 85% effectiveness rates in your own mind.

Third: This is not particularly a consideration for me, but there is a 15% change a vaccinated person could be carrying the Delta variant, which would be dangerous for the unvaccinated people he's around. As I said, this isn't something I'm concerned about, inasmuch as they've had a chance to get their vaccination.

 

[RDKirk]

Does no one find it the least bit incredible how blame for this virus has shifted FROM THE VIRUS to the unvaccinated?

The United States of America has officially become communist.

Those two propositions have no relationship.

If people have a means of controlling a dangerous substance and fail to do so, we do blame the person, not the substance.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Masks for ever. You will never see someone's face in public ever again. THe risk is far too great.

 

[Isilwen]

Does no one find it the least bit incredible how blame for this virus has shifted FROM THE VIRUS to the unvaccinated?

The United States of America has officially become communist.

It has not become communist. The blame is still on the virus, but when 95% of the people that are in the hospital are unvaccinated, that shows the contributing problem now are the unvaccinated.

That is just stating a fact.

 

[Isilwen]

...and that's fine if you choose to do so due to your personal circumstances.

However, statistical logic would dictate that I (being fully vaccinated) coming in contact with you (being vaccinated) in a store presents an infinitesimally small risk of transmitting covid (that could then be transmitted to your family)

Therefore, the guidance reversal still doesn't make a lot of sense.

It's not you and I coming into contact, but those that are unvaccinated coming into contact with us or each other.

 

[RDKirk]

Masks for ever. You will never see someone's face in public ever again. THe risk is far too great.

You seem to be rolling in the hyperbole today.

People have been commonly wearing masks in Japan and South Korea for decades. It's no big deal if you don't make a big deal of it.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

You seem to be rolling in the hyperbole today.

People have been commonly wearing masks in Japan and South Korea for decades. It's no big deal if you don't make a big deal of it.

Hey man, I agree. If you don't wear a mask you are going to literally kill someone else. From now on and forever the risk of not wearing a mask is too great.

 

[FireDragon76]

This has been discussed by some medical experts for the past few weeks, like Dr. John Campbell, who has a Youtube channel I follow. Dr. Campbell is a British medical doctor that gives science-based analysis that is well supported.

A few weeks ago Dr. Campbell presented evidence from an Israeli study of the effectiveness of the mRNA vaccines against the Delta varient. He presented evidence that people who are vaccinated can still be carriers of the Delta variant, and that protection wanes somewhat after several months. The vaccine only reduced infection rates of the Delta variant by about 40 percent, though the vaccine remains effective against severe illness, hospitalization, and death.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

It's not you and I coming into contact, but those that are unvaccinated coming into contact with us or each other.

Correct... if an unvaccinated person comes into contact with me, the chances of them transmitting to me is small, and if it did occur, would likely be asymptomatic or very mild. And if they came into contact with you while you're fully vaccinated and wearing a mask, would be even smaller.

So, in either scenario, making me wear a mask while being vaccinated doesn't improve your situation at all.

Making me wear a mask at this point only offers a small measure protection to the group of people who don't take it seriously, and are likely just going to go out an engage in reckless behavior anyway.

What's the point of me wearing one to protect them, if they're just going to go to a house party an hour later, unvaccinated?

In any case, making vaccinated people wear a mask (who are unlikely to be transmitters anyway) provides only a miniscule benefit to people who don't want to get vaccinated and think the virus is "not all that serious"

 

[Daniel Marsh]

Other viruses exist. Why catch a cold when you do not need to?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

This has been discussed by some medical experts for the past few weeks, like Dr. John Campbell, who has a Youtube channel I follow. Dr. Campbell is a British medical doctor that gives science-based analysis that is well supported. There was evidence from Israel that people who are vaccinated can still be carriers of the Delta variant. The vaccine only reduced infection rates of the Delta variant by about 40 percent, though the vaccine remains effective against severe illness, hospitalization, and death.

I understand that...

But if I'm vaccinated, and you're vaccinated, neither of us has a statistically significant chance of becoming seriously ill...for us, it'd likely end up being like a mild cold or flu (which is something we never masked up for)

Those of us who are vaccinated masking up would largely be for the benefit of people who think we're "sheeple" for getting vaccinated in the first place. And let's be honest, if they're not taking it seriously, they're just going to go hang around with other like-minded people who will be far more likely to give it to them than either of us would.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I understand that...

But if I'm vaccinated, and you're vaccinated, neither of us has a statistically significant chance of becoming seriously ill...for us, it'd likely end up being like a mild cold or flu (which is something we never masked up for)

Those of us who are vaccinated masking up would largely be for the benefit of people who think we're "sheeple" for getting vaccinated in the first place. And let's be honest, if they're not taking it seriously, they're just going to go hang around with other like-minded people who will be far more likely to give it to them than either of us would.

A chance to kill is still a chance to kill. Not wearing a mask will literally kill people therefore you have the responsibility to mask up at all times and places even if you're vaccinated. Life is too precious to risk even a one percent chance of infection.

 

[FireDragon76]

I understand that...

But if I'm vaccinated, and you're vaccinated, neither of us has a statistically significant chance of becoming seriously ill...for us, it'd likely end up being like a mild cold or flu (which is something we never masked up for)

Those of us who are vaccinated masking up would largely be for the benefit of people who think we're "sheeple" for getting vaccinated in the first place. And let's be honest, if they're not taking it seriously, they're just going to go hang around with other like-minded people who will be far more likely to give it to them than either of us would.

People who are vaccinated can still be carries of the virus, even if asymptomatic, and the risks of doing so are not insignificant. The Delta variant is far more virulent than the Alpha variant that was dominant when the CDC issued guidance that vaccinated people didn't need to wear masks.

Given that the pandemic is still global, even while the virus continues to mutate, and much of the planet hasn't even been vaccinated yet, we aren't going to end this pandemic through pell-mell measures.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Does no one find it the least bit incredible how blame for this virus has shifted FROM THE VIRUS to the unvaccinated?

The United States of America has officially become communist.

Blame for the virus was put on Trump. It is now put on the unvaccinated, who are seen as Trump supporters. So no real change in blame.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Other viruses exist. Why catch a cold when you do not need to?

Because I don't want to carry a mask forever to prevent catching a cold...I'm not that concerned about a cold.

I don't think anyone wants to catch a cold...obviously it's no fun. But we also don't go out of our way to impose strict rules on people to prevent common cold transmission.

At this point, like Fauci has stated, it's become a "disease of the unvaccinated". For those of us who did the right thing and got vaccinated, we're well protected from severe outcomes.

The severe outcomes are largely preventable.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

People who are vaccinated can still be carries of the virus, even if asymptomatic, and the risks of doing so are not insignificant.

"not insignificant" to who? People who are refusing to take the vaccine. They've made their decision.

If I'm a vaccinated asymptomatic carrier, and come into contact with you (I assume you're also vaccinated)...is there any statistically significant chance that I'm going to make you seriously ill?

And if we're talking "1 in a million" types of scenarios, that's a non-starter, as you can't have a functioning society and/or economy if fixated on (and trying to mitigate for) extraordinarily rare one-off externalities.

 

[FireDragon76]

"not insignificant" to who? People who are refusing to take the vaccine. They've made their decision.

From a public health standpoint, that doesn't matter. Public health is about protecting human lives, even the lives of dumb or stubborn people.

If I'm a vaccinated asymptomatic carrier, and come into contact with you (I assume you're also vaccinated)...is there any statistically significant chance that I'm going to make you seriously ill?

That's a contrived scenario. Nobody in the US really knows who else is and isn't vaccinated, for all practical purposes.

Furthermore, as the virus continues to evolve, the vaccines that we've taken will provide less and less protection against sickness. We're already seeing that happen, in fact. We're lucky the vaccines out there continue to protect against severe disease, but who knows how long that will last? This is no time for complacency.