Why do SDA preach

[LoveGodsWord]

Okay.

If you want to have an honest friendly discussion based on the scriptures I am always happy to do so because I LoveGodsWord (excuse the pun)

 

[Ceallaigh]

If you want to have an honest friendly discussion based on the scriptures I am always happy to do so because I LoveGodsWord (excuse the pun)

Okay.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Eze 20:11 I gave them my statutes and made known to them my rules, by which, if a person does them, he shall live.
Eze 20:12 Moreover, I gave them my Sabbaths, as a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD who sanctifies them.
Eze 20:13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness. They did not walk in my statutes but rejected my rules, by which, if a person does them, he shall live; and my Sabbaths they greatly profaned. “Then I said I would pour out my wrath upon them in the wilderness, to make a full end of them.

Do you notice something unusual about what is said above? Adventists talk about the Sabbath being part of the "moral" law. Apart from it being a memorial, and a sign, and it being an appointed time, and having sacrifices, it is stated to be in addition to the laws by which if one does them they will live.

Also related to something you indicated earlier, I don't know if the Scriptures ever say explicitly that the Sabbath is the sign of the covenant, but it does say it is a sign, and is a covenant.

According to the scriptures in the old and new covenant Gods' 4th commandment is one of Gods'10 commandments that give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing and evil (moral wrong doing); sin (moral wrong doing) and righteousness (moral right doing) *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and according to James if we break any one of them we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11.

Gods' 4th commandment says...

Exodus 20:8-11 [8], Remember the SABBATH DAY, to KEEP IT HOLY. <Why?> Because God made it Holy for mankind and commands us to keep it as a Holy day) [9], Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work: [10], But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: <WHY> [11], For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

Notice: What the commandment actually says. It starts of "REMEMBER" the Sabbath day v8, it defines the Sabbath day as the "seventh day" of the week v10 then gives the reason why the Sabbath must be kept in v11 where it says For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT. This is pointing BACKWARDS to Genesis 2:1-3. Lets compare Exodus 20:11 to what it is quoting from in Genesis 2:1-3 and see if they match up.

We are told in the commandment...

Exodus 20:8 [8], REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY, TO KEEP IT HOLY.

Memorial pointing backwards while the reason is given in v11

[11], For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and RESTED THE SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

This links directly backwards to the origin of the Sabbath Genesis 2:1-3 which uses similar wording..

Genesis 2:1-3[1], Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
[2], And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED ON THE SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made. [3], And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY, and made it HOLY <the 7th day>: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

....................

Note: Did you notice the links between God's 4th commandment and Genesis 2:1-3? Unlike the appointed times in the annual Feast days and the annual sabbaths which are many and days of holy convocation God's 4th commandment "seventh day" Sabbath of the 10 commandments points BACKWARD to the FINISHED work of creation not forward to things to come like the appointed Feast days. All the annual appointed feast days were shadows of things to come fulfilled in Christ and God's plan of salvation under the new covenant. This is impossible for God's "seventh day" Sabbath because it it points backwards as a memorial of creation. When God made the Sabbath for mankind there was no sin, no shadow laws, no Jew, no Moses, no Israel and no plan of salvation given because it was not needed because there was no sin. Therefore it is impossible for God's "seventh day" Sabbath of creation to be a shadow of things to come when it points backwards to the finished work of creation.

Gods 4th commandment Sabbath written in Ezekiel 20:11-13 therefore is not an addition. "More ever" or " Further more" in Ezekiel 20:12 is following on from what God has already just said in Ezekiel 20:11. God is saying that "Further more to giving His people His laws, He gave them His Sabbaths, as a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD who sanctifies them.


Hope this is helpful.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Tall73: Isaiah 66 doesn't not talk about now. So it does not prove it. It proves it will be in the new earth. And that was not being disputed by either party



I point out what Isaiah says. You say that is not true and quote a different text.

Yeah, I don't think that is helpful.




Isaiah 66 says it is observed in the new earth. It doesn't address the time prior.




I am upset that I once again wasted time arguing with you in pointless circles.

Isaiah says the Sabbath will be kept in the new earth. That was not disputed by me, by Major 1, by you, or by anyone else I have see in this thread.

So it added nothing to the conversation.

This whole part of the discussion started when SabbathBlessings said the following:


I noted that the new moon is described as being done in the new earth and she doesn't observe it now, and that the text is not a helpful one as a Sabbath proof text.

Then you mentioned you think it is a helpful text in discussion if you talk about other texts.

If you have to go to a different text to talk about keeping it now, then Isaiah 66 didn't add anything to that, the other text did.

Hi Tall,

One thing you might not be considering is the Sabbath is a commandment of God, a new moon is not. While we may not understand everything Jesus has in store for us, which could include the months being every 28 days, we do know God put importance on His holy Sabbath day now and it is a commandment written personally by our Savior Exodus 20:8-11 and it is also in the future Isaiah 66:23. Which means God's Word stands because He already promised the Sabbath is a perpetual covenant Exodus 31:16. From the beginning Genesis 2:1-3 to forever Isaiah 66:23 the seventh day matters to God. If it matters to God it should matter to us.

God bless

 

[Ceallaigh]

According to Gregory Matthews, former Congregational Pastor at Seventh-day Adventist Church:

"First, I will say that if you were to take a poll of SDAs on just about any point of doctrine, you just might find some very weird, unbiblical responses."

What do Seven Day Adventists say the mark of the beast is? - Quora

Just something to keep in mind when talking to anonymous laypeople on the internet.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

According to Gregory Matthews, former Congregational Pastor at Seventh-day Adventist Church:

"First, I will say that if you were to take a poll of SDAs on just about any point of doctrine, you just might find some very weird, unbiblical responses."

What do Seven Day Adventists say the mark of the beast is? - Quora

That can happen. There are posters on this very forum who say they are SDA but do not go to a SDA church nor believe in the 28 fundamental beliefs. Your posted statement could apply to any church denomination and you will always have people varying in their walk with God. That's why it's important not to go by what people say and to test everything through scriptures.

 

[Major1]

You ignored the text about Abraham, please answer the question.

Since you have said that you do not care to talk with me......WHY do you keep responding to my posts?

WHAT question?

 

[Major1]

The question I asked you was where is the scripture that says God's 4th commandment has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest? It certainly does not say this in the scriptures you have quoted above does it?

Romans 14:5 is not even talking about the Sabbath and there is no mention of it in the entire chapter. It is talking about eating and not eating on days the men esteem over other days. Keep in mind that the things that men esteem according to the scriptures is an abomination in God's eyes *Luke 16:15

Galatians 4:9-11 is talking to gentiles believers returning to paganism or the works of the law for salvation. So not relevant here and there is no mention of not keeping the Sabbath there at all and keeping Sunday as a holy day of rest.

Colossians 2:16-17 is as posted earlier that I have not received a response from you. According to the scriptures, if you look at the context of Colossians 2:16 you will see that Colossians 2:16 is not talking about the "seventh day" Sabbath of God's 4th commandment. It is talking about the sabbaths or sabbath days (Genitive neuter plural in the Greek) not singular while the scripture context is to the meat and drink offerings and new moons and sabbaths (plural) in the Feast days which is the scripture context. According to the scriptures there were many different types of sabbaths in the old covenant. In the annual Feast days for example that Colossians 2:16 is talking about there were many sabbaths that were linked directly to certain Feasts and would fall on any day of the week depending on the yearly cycle. These Feast day sabbaths (not Gods 4th commandment) included for example; (1) Feast of Unleavened Bread (first and last day) *Leviticus 23:6-8 (2) Feast of Trumpets *Leviticus 23:24-25 (3) Day of Atonement *Leviticus 23:27-32 (4) Feast of Booths *Leviticus 23:34-36 (5) Feast of First Fruits *Leviticus 23:39 (6) Feast days of Holy convocation of no work (sabbaton Colossians 2:16 *Leviticus 23:7-8; 21;24; 27; 35-36. So context of Colossians 2:16 is to the Sabbaths in the annual Feast days being a "shadow of things to come" Colossians 2:17 not God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments because God's 4th commandment does not point forward to things to come but backwards to the finished work of creation and God as the creator of heaven and earth as a memorial of creation - "Remember" the Sabbath day to keep it holy. Are you interested in a detailed discussion on Colossians 2:16-17? Do you know what Paul scriptures Paul is quoting from ni the old covenant and what they refer to in the new covenant? Happy to discuss more detail here if your interested.

So you have no scripture that says God's 4th commandment has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest now do you.

Hope this is helpful.

This is a DEAD horse!

We are doing nothing but circular debating! You as an SDA are imbedded in that teaching and it will not natter one iotta what you are shown....so why are we do this?????

Matthew 19:16-19.........
"And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” 17And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.”

keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.

18Then he said to Him, “Which ones?”

“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”

19.
And Jesus said, “YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT MURDER;
YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY;
YOU SHALL NOT STEAL;
YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS;
HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and
YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

WHERE IS "KEEP THE SABBATH"???????

Now a very simple, down to earth common sense, logical question.
IF JESUS PLACED AS MUCH EMPHASIS ON SABBATH KEEPING AS YOU DO, WHY DID HE NOT EVEN SUGGEST IT IN THE COMMANDMENTS HE TOLD US TO KEEP??????

Good Lord......If Jesus was an SDA.....he would have said KEEP THE SABBATH, jump around keep the sabbath, run in circles keep the sabbath. KEEP THE SABBATH blah blah blah the SABBATH.

 

[Major1]

I do understand what your trying to say so please do not pretend that I do not. I am saying that Isaiah 66:22-23 is a great text to use as long as we understand Exodus 31:16 that the Sabbath is an everlasting covenant. My point is only that it is the best way to use it because understanding that the Sabbath is an everlasting covenant given here and applied now to God's people Isaiah 66:22-23 proves that the Sabbath is a requirement here and now and not something to be waited for in the new earth. It is an everlasting covenant here and now and Isaiah 66:22-23 proves Exodus 31:16 that the sabbath will be continued to be kept in the new earth. The Sabbath of course in the new covenant (now) is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20.

Ex 24:3 .......
" When Moses went and told the people all the LORD’S words and laws, they responded with one voice, “Everything the LORD has said we will do.”

There are 613 commands in the old covenant that Israel were required to keep perfectly. These are found in the Torah, the first five books of the Old Testament.

The Ten has one ceremonial command, the sabbath, which is not a moral command. Sabbath keeping was given to Israel as a weekly ritual "to rest" from labor. It was never commanded as a communal day of worship. THAT fact and teaching was ADDED by the SDA denomination.

Israel was commanded to remember their deliverance from Egypt and that God created the world. The sabbath is not a moral command as no person has ever been charged with sin for breaking the sabbath except Israel of the old covenant.

The Old Covenant is a binding agreement God made with Israelites alone at Sinai. It was made with no other nation on earth. It includes the entire Mosaic Law which includes the Ten Commandments written on tablets of stone by God. The entire covenant was ratified by the blood of animals.

Ex 24:8 ......
" Moses then took the blood, sprinkled it on the people and said, “This is the blood of the covenant that the LORD has made with you in accordance with all these words.”

YOU as an Adventist believe and teach that the sabbath is binding on all nations and all people for all time when in fact it was given only to one nation—Israel.

Circumcision was the entry sign into the covenant. Gentiles could only legally keep the sabbath and be accepted by God, if they joined the Israelite community through circumcision and keep all the covenant.

 

[Major1]

I take it you have not heard of "conditional predictions."

You also are not very well acquainted with history:

The Night the Stars Fell - Ancestry Insights

Unravelling the Mystery of New England’s Day of Darkness | Ancient Origins (ancient-origins.net)

1755 Lisbon earthquake - Wikipedia

Is that enough or do you want to go on?????

THAT is simply a SDA taught responce to the question at had.

Actually my friend....I taught Biblical History and I am very well acquainted with history and real historical facts.

Yes....I know about "conditional predictions".

Allow me to give you one.....
"If the earth continues to produce children at the rate we are now, and we continue to use the natural resources we have, in the year 2075 the eath can not support the population."

That my friend is what anyone can say equipped with the correct data and that is not a prophetic word from God.

THAT is not what Mrs. White did. What she did and how you believe her is what YOU own my friend.

Another REAL HISTORICAL FACT..........
Mrs. White falsely prophesied that England would declare war on the USA about the time of the Civil War as she said .........
‘This nation will yet be humbled into the dust. England is studying whether . . . to make war on her. When England does declare war, . . . there will be general war.’
Source: Testimonies for the Church, Vol. 1, p.259.

This was a false prophecy, England did not declare war on the USA during the Civil War, and the USA was not humbled into the dust and that was not a "CONDITIONAL PREDICTION"!

 

[SabbathBlessings]

This is a DEAD horse!

We are doing nothing but circular debating! You as an SDA are imbedded in that teaching and it will not natter one iotta what you are shown....so why are we do this?????

Matthew 19:16-19.........
"And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” 17And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.”

keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.

18Then he said to Him, “Which ones?”

“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”

19.
And Jesus said, “YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT MURDER;
YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY;
YOU SHALL NOT STEAL;
YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS;
HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and
YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

WHERE IS "KEEP THE SABBATH"???????

Now a very simple, down to earth common sense, logical question.
IF JESUS PLACED AS MUCH EMPHASIS ON SABBATH KEEPING AS YOU DO, WHY DID HE NOT EVEN SUGGEST IT IN THE COMMANDMENTS HE TOLD US TO KEEP??????

Good Lord......If Jesus was an SDA.....he would have said KEEP THE SABBATH, jump around keep the sabbath, run in circles keep the sabbath. KEEP THE SABBATH blah blah blah the SABBATH.

Jesus never repeated for us to love God with all your heart is that deleted too?

Remember what you are saying here about the holy day of the Lord your God. We are told to hallow Gods Sabbath day. Ezekiel 20:20, Exodus 20:8. Jesus said He made the Sabbath for you Mark 2:27. You’re free to say what you want and believe what you want but even if you think Gods holy day is only for Jews I would consider discussing God’s holy day that He personally wrote with a little more respect.

 

[Major1]

Jesus never repeated for us to love God with all your heart is that deleted too?

Remember what you are saying here about the holy day of the Lord your God. We are told to hallow Gods Sabbath day. Ezekiel 20:20, Exodus 20:8. Jesus said He made the Sabbath for you Mark 2:27. You’re free to say what you want and believe what you want but even if you think Gods holy day is only for Jews I would consider discussing God’s holy day that He personally wrote with a little more respect.

That answer does not work.

That is a straw man response as what you suggested is not in the Scriptures posted.

Listen.....no one, especially ME is saying that the Sabbath is not a holy day. IT IS!

But you are missing the spirit of the thread which was WORSHIP on the Sabbath and YOUR SDA argument that everyone should keep the Sabbth.

That is simply not Biblically true. Christians DO NOT KEEP the Sabbath because it was given to Israel not the church.

I would respond to your use of Mark 2:27 as an incorrect use without the CONTEXT applied.

In that Scripture, Jesus said......
“The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.”

This statement was in response to the accusation that His disciples were breaking the law regarding resting on the Sabbath when they walked by some fields and plucked heads of grain.

Jesus referred them to an example from the Old Testament. David was once in need of food and was given consecrated bread that was, technically, only lawful for the priests to eat. The holy bread had served a practical need of God’s anointed (David) and his followers, just as, in Jesus’ day, the grain served a practical need for God’s anointed (Jesus) and His followers.

David and his men had not acted sinfully in eating the showbread, and neither were Jesus’ disciples acting sinfully in picking heads of grain on the Sabbath. Jesus concludes, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath”.

Pharisaical law had morphed the Sabbath into a burden, adding restrictions beyond what God’s law said. The act of picking a head of grain and munching on it as one walked along a field should not be considered “harvesting,” as the Pharisees tried to categorize it. The disciples had not broken God’s law; they had only violated the Pharisees’ strict interpretation of the law. Jesus reminded the Pharisees of the original intent of the Sabbath rest.
What does it mean that the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath? | GotQuestions.org

 

[Ceallaigh]

This is a DEAD horse!

We are doing nothing but circular debating! You as an SDA are imbedded in that teaching and it will not natter one iotta what you are shown....so why are we do this?????

Matthew 19:16-19.........
"And someone came to Him and said, “Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may obtain eternal life?” 17And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.”

keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.
keep the commandments.

18Then he said to Him, “Which ones?”

“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”
“Which ones?”

19.
And Jesus said, “YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT MURDER;
YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY;
YOU SHALL NOT STEAL;
YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS;
HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and
YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

WHERE IS "KEEP THE SABBATH"???????

Now a very simple, down to earth common sense, logical question.
IF JESUS PLACED AS MUCH EMPHASIS ON SABBATH KEEPING AS YOU DO, WHY DID HE NOT EVEN SUGGEST IT IN THE COMMANDMENTS HE TOLD US TO KEEP??????

Good Lord......If Jesus was an SDA.....he would have said KEEP THE SABBATH, jump around keep the sabbath, run in circles keep the sabbath. KEEP THE SABBATH blah blah blah the SABBATH.

Keeping 9 of the Comments is reapeated throughout the NT. Paul goes on about what kind of commandment braking will keep one from entering the Kingdom. Nowhere does he or anyone else say anything about sabbath-breaking.

John outright says that Jesus broke the sabbath;

“Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.” John 5:18.

It seems obvious He didn't consider the sabbath binding any longer. Summed up in saying the sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath. The way I've seen SDA try making that say something it doesn't, has made my eyes roll.

If I just had the NT at my disposal, I'd have no prompt whatsoever to keep the sabbath. Much less a command.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Keeping 9 of the Comments is reapeated throughout the NT. Paul goes on about what kind of commandment will keep one from entering the Kingdom. Nowhere does he or anyone else say anything about sabbath-breaking. And John outright says that Jesus broke the Sabbath.

“Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.” John 5:18. It seems obvious He didn't consider the Sabbath binding any longer. Summed up in saying the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. The way I've seen SDA try making that say something it doesn't, seems incredibly far reaching.

So we should forget the one commandment that God said to "remember" and the only one that has the word "holy" in it. God told us the Sabbath is a perpetual covenant Exodus 31:16.

The covenant was a unit of Ten, not nine.
Deut 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

The Sabbath was taught by Jesus throughout the whole NT. It's referenced close to 60 times and scripture states its a commandment after Jesus rose. Luke 23:56 Jesus obeyed God's commandments and do you really think we should be doing something different than what Jesus did? That's not what scriptures teaches us.

1 Peter 2:21 For to this you were called, because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that you should follow His steps:

The Sabbath commandment was repeated in the NT:

"He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: 'And God rested on the seventh day from all His works.' There remains therefore a rest ["keeping of a sabbath," margin] for the people of God. For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His" (Hebrews 4:4, 9, 10).

Even if it was not repeated, God spoke and wrote the Ten commandments. You can not erase one of His commandments and God should not have to repeat Himself for us to obey Him.

“Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.” John 5:18. It seems obvious He didn't consider the Sabbath binding any longer.

Jesus obeyed all of His Fathers commandments which includes the 4th commandment. John 15:10. It was Jesus custom on the Sabbath day to go to Temple and read the scriptures Luke 4:16

Jesus was also accused of not being the Son of God. Do we believe the accuser or Jesus?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

That answer does not work.

That is a straw man response as what you suggested is not in the Scriptures posted.

Listen.....no one, especially ME is saying that the Sabbath is not a holy day. IT IS!

But you are missing the spirit of the thread which was WORSHIP on the Sabbath and YOUR SDA argument that everyone should keep the Sabbth.

That is simply not Biblically true. Christians DO NOT KEEP the Sabbath because it was given to Israel not the church.

I would respond to your use of Mark 2:27 as an incorrect use without the CONTEXT applied.

In that Scripture, Jesus said......
“The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.”

This statement was in response to the accusation that His disciples were breaking the law regarding resting on the Sabbath when they walked by some fields and plucked heads of grain.

Jesus referred them to an example from the Old Testament. David was once in need of food and was given consecrated bread that was, technically, only lawful for the priests to eat. The holy bread had served a practical need of God’s anointed (David) and his followers, just as, in Jesus’ day, the grain served a practical need for God’s anointed (Jesus) and His followers.

David and his men had not acted sinfully in eating the showbread, and neither were Jesus’ disciples acting sinfully in picking heads of grain on the Sabbath. Jesus concludes, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath”.

Pharisaical law had morphed the Sabbath into a burden, adding restrictions beyond what God’s law said. The act of picking a head of grain and munching on it as one walked along a field should not be considered “harvesting,” as the Pharisees tried to categorize it. The disciples had not broken God’s law; they had only violated the Pharisees’ strict interpretation of the law. Jesus reminded the Pharisees of the original intent of the Sabbath rest.
What does it mean that the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath? | GotQuestions.org

I guess in your view God's only holy day and worship are words that don't belong together, but worship on a day God deemed for us to work does. That's why God gave us free will, He will never push God's Sabbath day on anyone. God wants us to want to obey Him, because it's how we express our love and Jesus would never want to force us to love Him or anyone else. God never lets go of us, we let go of God based on our choices.

 

[Ceallaigh]

Ex 24:3 .......
" When Moses went and told the people all the LORD’S words and laws, they responded with one voice, “Everything the LORD has said we will do.”

There are 613 commands in the old covenant that Israel were required to keep perfectly. These are found in the Torah, the first five books of the Old Testament.

The Ten has one ceremonial command, the sabbath, which is not a moral command. Sabbath keeping was given to Israel as a weekly ritual "to rest" from labor. It was never commanded as a communal day of worship. THAT fact and teaching was ADDED by the SDA denomination.

I was reading their own literature and apparently what happened is after William Miller's failed prediction of the second coming, they decided they should start studying the Bible. And then they decided they should switch having church on Sunday to Saturday because that was the sabbath. I didn't read the whole thing, but it probably left out the Mark of the Beast thingy Ellen White presumably come up with.

 

[Ceallaigh]

because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” Genesis 26:5

What do you do with this text. you say the law was not added until Moses, Scripture says other wise. Now you have avoided answering this question 2 times. Please answer it. If you don't it will expose you for the fraud you are. You do not respect the scripture as you boastfully claim and you are not trying to obey God as you triumphantly pronounce.

Did you read post #566?

Excerpt:

Deuteronomy 5:2-3 says
"The Lord our God made a covenant with us at Horeb. The Lord did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, with all those of us alive here today."

 

[BobRyan]

A. It shows it will be in the new earth. It on its own doesn't show now, because it is talking about the new earth.

True but that detail alone is sufficient to show "not delete at the cross" and the only way around it is "deleted at the cross then brought back again in the New Earth" but that would be like taking Heb 10:4-12 "Animal sacrifices deleted at the cross" then trying to spin it over to "and brought back for all eternity in the New Earth" -- which frankly none of the anti-Bible-Sabbath posts on this thread or the "Sabbath and the law" forum have shown any interest at all in maintaining.

 

[BobRyan]

I was reading their own literature and apparently what happened is after William Miller's failed prediction of the second coming, they decided they should start studying the Bible.

Also not historically true. Miller's movement required a lot of Bible study - but as you may have noticed they were not SDA.

And then they decided they should switch having church on Sunday to Saturday because that was the Sabbath.

A key topic pushed into the forefront for Adventists - by Seventh-day Baptists

=======================

Am curious about this #577

It looks like you question (the SDA vs non-SDA scholars agreements ) as if you care about it and then when shown the facts on record simply drop it as if the point was of no interest.

So does the implication of being mistaken on a point you apparently considered important (in that example) have no instructive value in your POV? I notice you do not answer the question from 577.

 

[BobRyan]

According to Gregory Matthews, former Congregational Pastor at Seventh-day Adventist Church:

"First, I will say that if you were to take a poll of SDAs on just about any point of doctrine, you just might find some very weird, unbiblical responses."

What do Seven Day Adventists say the mark of the beast is? - Quora

Just something to keep in mind when talking to anonymous laypeople on the internet.

Interesting diversion from the Sabbath points were both SDAs and non-SDA scholars agree.