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The Death and True Resurrection of Jesus.

Yeshua HaDerekh

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Daniel 9:26-27 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week (Wednesday is the middle of the week) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, (Remember, Jesus is the sacrificial Passover Lamb).

You do not know what any of that really means, do you...WEEKS OF YEARS. Titus destroyed the Temple...the Romans...
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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And yet you can't get three days and three night from Good Friday to Sunday Morning. You have to have both and this is from Jesus mouth, three days and three nights. His death Wednesday night is consistent with the comment of the prophet Daniel, stating the Messiah would be cut off (killed) in the midst of the week. Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:(Luke 24:25).

But the witnesses on the road to Emmaus prove you wrong! WHY do you keep ignoring them and scripture?!?!?
 
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prodromos

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Start back at the beginning of Jesus words in (Matthew 12:38) Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. 39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: 40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

Now remember God's days start at evening and end the next evening.
So Jesus would Have been in the Grave Wednesday night, Thursday daytime and Thursday night, Friday daytime, Friday night, Saturday daytime and Jesus rose right before the sun went down on Saturday. Hence one has the 3 days and 3 nights which Jesus prophesied.

His death Wednesday night is consistent with the comment of the prophet Daniel, stating the Messiah would be cut off (killed) in the midst of the week.

Daniel 9:26-27 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week (Wednesday is the middle of the week) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, (Remember, Jesus is the sacrificial Passover Lamb).

Jesus gave us a sign, he didn't put in order. Stop trying to put it in order as you read Jesus saying it. The event didn't happen in the order Jesus is saying it. Now from the prophet Daniel we see Jesus died in the midst (Middle) of the week, so the night came first, then follow by the daytime.
Proverbs 26:11-12
 
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Bro.T

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But the witnesses on the road to Emmaus prove you wrong! WHY do you keep ignoring them and scripture?!?!?


Luke 24:13 And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs. You have to do better investigation then this. I have verse down below who made a better witness.

Remember Mary did not come to the Grave site until the first day of the week which is Sunday, when it was yet. (John 20:1) "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulcher", And it was early in the morning and it was still dark. But Jesus had already risen.

Another example in Mark 16: 1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. 3 And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre? 4 And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great. 5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted. 6 And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

Look how these two verses line up, Jesus been risen, Mary and Jesus mother got there first and Jesus was gone. Why can't you see that? Jesus didn't rise Sunday Morning!!


First , you suppose to get me three days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning, you ignore me all this time. Where's my three days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning.

Second, who came to sepulcher first? Looks like Mary did, Jesus was done when it was still dark, no rise on Sunday morning.
 
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Bro.T

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Proverbs 26:11-12


You never got me my threes days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning, and yet thats what you quote against me.

But I hang one to these words Jesus says in John 15: 17 These things I command you, that ye love one another. 18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. 19 If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
 
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Bro.T

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You do not know what any of that really means, do you...WEEKS OF YEARS. Titus destroyed the Temple...the Romans...

I know the midst of the week, is actually the middle of the week. I know you can't get threes days and threes nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning. I know this conversation is coming to an end.
 
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Bro.T

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Um YOU just said: "No, Jesus rose Saturday just before sundown. Saturday was the passover, Sunday was the feast of unleavened bread. Jesus was gone when it still dark when Mary came." ?????? You said he was crucified on Passover and you have Him rising on passover??? Get your story straight! :doh::doh::doh:

My bad on him rising on the passover. I can admit when I make a mistake and when I'm wrong, thanks for catching that.
 
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Bro.T

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You contradict the Mark's Gospel.

Mark 16:9

Now when he rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Mag′dalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons.​

You right Saturday was not the passover it was Wednesday, according to the prophet Daniel Jesus death Wednesday night is consistent with the comment of the prophet Daniel, stating the Messiah would be cut off (killed) in the midst of the week.

Daniel 9:26-27 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week (Wednesday is the middle of the week) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, (Remember, Jesus is the sacrificial Passover Lamb).

Another example in Mark 16: 1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him. 2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. 3 And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre? 4 And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great. 5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted. 6 And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

That Good Friday to Sunday Morning is like a baseball knock right out the park....Lol. Plus I need threes day and three nights to go with that, according to Jesus, the son of God! The world wide story is Jesus died Good Friday and rose Sunday Morning.
 
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Bro.T

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The death and resurrection account given in John's Gospel only specifies three days.

Here are the three days.

John 19:42
Therefore because of the Jewish day of preparation, since the tomb was nearby, they laid Jesus there.

John 19:31
Then the Jews, because it was the day of preparation, so that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath for that Sabbath was a high day.

John 20:20
Now on the first day of the week Mary Magdalene came early to the tomb, while it was still dark, and saw the stone already taken away from the tomb.

The onus is upon you to provide the evidence from John's Gospel to support a five day account.


Jesus says in (Matthew 12:38) Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. 39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: 40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

You have to focus on getting me both, threes days and three nights. Not just the days.

Another example in Mark 16: 1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him. 2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. 3 And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre? 4 And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great. 5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted. 6 And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

Is this not clearer. The world wide story is Jesus die on Good Friday to Sunday Morning. So I ask a question to you, get me three days and three night from Good Friday to Sunday Morning. No one on this thread have done that. We see from Mark 16, Jesus was gone way before Sunday Morning. Can't use Sunday, Jesus was gone. Can you understand these verses you reading. Plus you would have to give three nights to add, according to Jesus.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Luke 24:13 And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs. You have to do better investigation then this. I have verse down below who made a better witness.

Remember Mary did not come to the Grave site until the first day of the week which is Sunday, when it was yet. (John 20:1) "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulcher", And it was early in the morning and it was still dark. But Jesus had already risen.

Another example in Mark 16: 1 And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.
2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. 3 And they said among themselves, Who shall roll us away the stone from the door of the sepulchre? 4 And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great. 5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted. 6 And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

Look how these two verses line up, Jesus been risen, Mary and Jesus mother got there first and Jesus was gone. Why can't you see that? Jesus didn't rise Sunday Morning!!

First , you suppose to get me three days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning, you ignore me all this time. Where's my three days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning.

Second, who came to sepulcher first? Looks like Mary did, Jesus was done when it was still dark, no rise on Sunday morning.

NONE of what you wrote disproves the timeline the eyewitnesses on the road to Emmaus told...I never said He rose Sunday morning at dawn. He rose sometime between sunset Saturday evening AFTER the Sabbath was over and dawn Sunday morning. It is dark after sunset until dawn...
 
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prodromos

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You never got me my threes days and three nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning
Synecdoche.
and yet thats what you quote against me.
There are many more I could quote from Proverbs which would be just as applicable to your approach to the Scriptures.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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I know the midst of the week, is actually the middle of the week. I know you can't get threes days and threes nights from Good Friday to Sunday Morning. I know this conversation is coming to an end.

Again, that has NOTHING to do with it! They are weeks of years! Stop deflecting!
 
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prodromos

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We see from Mark 16, Jesus was gone way before Sunday Morning. Can't use Sunday, Jesus was gone.
Mark 16:9 explicitly states that you have to use Sunday. Jesus rose on the 1st day of the week, probably soon after sundown at the end of the Sabbath.
 
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prodromos

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My bad on him rising on the passover. I can admit when I make a mistake and when I'm wrong, thanks for catching that.
We've caught many that you are not willing to admit.
 
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The Liturgist

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It has been taught that Jesus died on Good Friday and rose early Sunday morning. As a result of this teaching, man instituted the holiday called Easter. On Easter Sunday you have Christians, world wide paying tribute to a day, in which they believe Jesus, was resurrected. In researching the scriptures one will find that the whole concept of Jesus dying on a Friday and being resurrected on Sunday is contrary to the bible itself.

That is incorrect. His resurrection was stated as being on the first day of the week, which is Sunday. Now, you also have to consider in antiquity the day was reckoned to begin and end at Sunset. We see this today reflected in Jewish practices where their Sabbath is from Sunset on Friday to Sunset on Saturday.

Our Lord said “destroy this temple and I will build it again in 3 days.” Sunset usually happens around the 12th hour; Christ the Only Begotten Son and Divine Logos, was crucified at the 6th hour and died at the ninth hour. That is day one. Day two, God the Son, having remade man in His own image through His victory on the Cross (as indicated by the famous quote from Pontius Pilate, “Ecce homo”, and despoiling Hell by freeing those captive there who chose to follow him to Heaven (thus, people from before the time of Christ are not destined to remain in Hell until the last judgement, for our God is love, and is infinitely merciful), rested in a tomb, just as He had rested following creation in Genesis 1. Day three, when the myrhh bearing women arrived in the morning (hence the custom of early morning services in some churches), the tomb was empty, meaning that at some point on that day prior to their arrival, our Lord rose from the grave. The angels who created the women had shining, luminous raiments, which combined with the triumph of life over death, is prophesied in Genesis 1, with “Let there be light.”

Genesis 1 is much more important than most people realize, for it is not just an account of the creation of the universe, which is interesting, but also of the Passion and Resurrection of Jesus Christ, by whom all things in the Universe were made, which is more interesting, because The Only Begotten Son and Word of God became incarnate, entering into His own creation, to free mankind from death, and through His own death, to show us how to be human. (Fr. John Behr, while he was dean of St. Vladimir’s Seminary, liked to stress how all of the great heresies tried to bypass that concept, because it is a “hard saying”, but a careful exegesis of the Gospels will show it to be the truth, and it is also what the early Church Fathers believed, and is reasonable, given divine omnipotence, and the experience of the church has been fighting off various heresies like Docetism, Arianism, Unitarianism, and Nestorianism, which either deny the Humanity of Christ, the deity of Christ, or,the union of His Divinity with His Humanity, acquired from being born by a virgin, Mary, meeting the three criteria Anglicans use for doctrine (Scripture, Tradition and Reason), and the fourth criterion John Wesley added, experience, which logic dictates can be collective as well as individual; this forms the Wesleyan Quadrilateral which is widely used by Protestants for purposes of dogmatic theology.

Easter Created By Man

Before we get into the death and resurrection of Jesus we need to address history of Easter itself. We will also take a look at the symbols of Easter: rabbits and eggs. What does rabbits and eggs have to do with the birth of Jesus? Furthermore, when did rabbits start laying eggs? Additionally, we will look at the history of Easter sunrise service, lilies, candles, and hot crossed buns. If you research Easter in most encyclopedias, you will see that Easter has many customs and legends that are pagan in origin and have absolutely nothing to do with Christianity.

Easter was named after Eostre (sometimes spelled Eastre), the great Anglo-Saxon goddess of spring, fertility, and new life. Similar Teutonic dawn goddesses of fertility were known variously as Ostare, Ostara, Ostern, Eostra, Eostur, Eastra, Eastur, Austron and Ausos. Her name was derived from the ancient word for spring: "eastre." Thus it is easy to see how "Eastre time" became "Easter time".
This is a common conspiracy theory about Easter, but it falls apart when one takes note of the fact that most Christians refer to the holiday as Pascha or a derivative word (for example, the Dutch call it Passen), all of which are related to the English word passover, which for some reason we interpret purely in the sense of Judaism, when there is plenty of scriptural material to suggest the Crucifixion is the new, final, ultimate Passover.

The use of the word Easter to refer to Pascha, or, as it is most properly titled, The Feast of the Resurrection, began with the Christianization of Northwest Europe, but the Dutch use of Passen, and other examples, will show that almost all people who call it Easter are native English speakers. Prior to that time, in the first few centuries of Christianity, it was called Pascha, and this term is used universally by the Eastern Orthodox, the Oriental Orthodox, the Assyrian Church of the East, and non-English speaking Maronites, and is also used in the Latin Rites of the Roman Catholic church. Indeed, the period from Good Friday to Easter Sunday is called the Pachal Triduum.

For that matter, Pentecost, on which is celebrated, based on scripture, the procession of God the Holy Spirit to the Disciples at the Third Hour, is commonly called “Whitsunday” in English, because wheat was used to symbolize the tongues of fire.

Easter Sunday falls on the first Sunday after the first full moon after March 20th, the nominal date of the Vernal (sometimes referred to as spring) Equinox. This is the day (or period of days) in spring when the days and nights are of approximately equal length. This is a time of celebrating new life, the resurrection of nature from the dead, and it has typically featured fertility rites, merrymaking, and usually centers on orgiastic sexual activities. In ancient times there were the sacrificing of virgins, the worship of fertility gods and goddesses.

The Easter sunrise service, that is practiced in many Christian churches, can be traced back to the ancient pagan custom of welcoming the sun god at the vernal equinox - when daytime is about to exceed the length of the nighttime. It was a time to celebrate the return of life and reproduction to animal and plant life as well. Worship of the sun god at sunrise is the religious ritual condemned by the Lord as recorded in Ezekiel 8:15-18.

The Nicene Paschalion was one of two in use in the early church; the other, popular in the East, was the Quartodecimian, which celebrated Pascha on the 14th of Nisan. However, concerns had emerged by the Council of Nicea that the Jews had changed their method of calculating their calendar (something confirmed by the Karaites, who rejected the Rabinnical teachings in the Talmud and followed only the text of the Old Testament. Consequently, the council made a canonical decree that set the date of Pascha as you describe.

The custom of Sunrise services on Easter is not universal, although the office of Lauds in some monasteries is observed at Sunrise. Most Christians in the West have, since the legalization of Christianity, celebrated Pascha in the morning; this is also the practice of the Armenian Orthodox. Most Orthodox Christians celebrate Pascha exclusively at night, traditionally midnight, although some churches for reasons of safety have moved the service back to 8 PM, which is fine, because it is still Sunday according to the ancient system of reckoning when days begin and end (liturgical days, interestingly, begin and end at the service of Vespers, which normally happens at Sunset, but which can happen earlier; the Eastern Orthodox have a Vesperal Divine Liturgy in the morning of Holy Saturday, and the Roman Catholics had a similar service until 1955, when Pope Pius XII made arbitrary and capricious changes to an ancient liturgy, used in a similar way by Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox, that dated back to Pope St. Gregory the Great, in the late 6th century, centuries before the Great Schism in which the Roman Catholic Church, which was innovating and experiencing corruption, excommunicated the Eastern Orthodox for their fidelity.

In the 16th century, St. Jan Hus and St. Jerome of Prague, recognized as martyrs by the Eastern Orthodox Church, started the Protestant reformation in an attempt to restore to the country we now call the Czech Republic the vernacular liturgy and communion in both kinds, which they had enjoyed under the Orthodox Church until Austria conquered the land and forcibly converted everyone to the Roman Rite of the Catholic Church. St. Jan Hus was burned at the stake, but the church he founded is still around, the Moravian Church, miraculously, and Martin Luther took up his cause, created an unstoppable Reformation, and the Roman Catholic church in turn had to reform itself to prevent more countries from leaving it, which it did in the Counter Reformation. God works in mysterious ways, and thus one can see how an aggrieved Eastern Orthodox founded Protestantism, protesting practices of the Roman Catholic Church, that after his martyrdom became a success, reforming the churches of several countries and forcing the Roman Catholics to get their house in order and put an end to corrupt popes like Alexander VI Borgia or Leo X, and to practices like the sale of indulgences.
 
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The Liturgist

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Mark 16:9 explicitly states that you have to use Sunday. Jesus rose on the 1st day of the week, probably soon after sundown at the end of the Sabbath.

Wisdom, let us attend! Stomen kalos! Let us hear the Holy Gospel According to St. Mark.
 
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Davy

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That is incorrect. His resurrection was stated as being on the first day of the week, which is Sunday. Now, you also have to consider in antiquity the day was reckoned to begin and end at Sunset. We see this today reflected in Jewish practices where their Sabbath is from Sunset on Friday to Sunset on Saturday.

Our Lord said “destroy this temple and I will build it again in 3 days.” Sunset usually happens around the 12th hour; Christ the Only Begotten Son and Divine Logos, was crucified at the 6th hour and died at the ninth hour. That is day one. Day two, God the Son, having remade man in His own image through His victory on the Cross (as indicated by the famous quote from Pontius Pilate, “Ecce homo”, and despoiling Hell by freeing those captive there who chose to follow him to Heaven (thus, people from before the time of Christ are not destined to remain in Hell until the last judgement, for our God is love, and is infinitely merciful), rested in a tomb, just as He had rested following creation in Genesis 1. Day three, when the myrhh bearing women arrived in the morning (hence the custom of early morning services in some churches), the tomb was empty, meaning that at some point on that day prior to their arrival, our Lord rose from the grave. The angels who created the women had shining, luminous raiments, which combined with the triumph of life over death, is prophesied in Genesis 1, with “Let there be light.”

No, the day that Lord Jesus died is NOT... the 1st day His body was in the tomb. The John 19 Scripture declares they rushed to bury Jesus' body before sunset, because at sunset was a "high day" of the feast, the first day of the feast, a sabbath per the feast and not the regular weekly sabbath.

Jesus was crucified and died on a Wednesday. At sunset on that day is when the 3 days and 3 nights count begins.

Wednesday before sunset - Lord Jesus dies on the cross, they rush to bury His body because at sunset begins Thursday, a high day per the feast, and is to be a sabbath.

Thursday sunset to morning = 1st night in the tomb
Thursday morning to sunset, begins Friday = 1st day
Friday sunset to morning = 2nd night
Friday morning to sunset, begins Saturday = 2nd day
Saturday sunset to morning = 3rd night
Saturday morning to sunset, begins Sunday = 3rd day
Sunday, sometime after Saturday sunset which began Sunday Jesus rose.
 
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prodromos

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No, the day that Lord Jesus died is NOT... the 1st day His body was in the tomb. The John 19 Scripture declares they rushed to bury Jesus' body before sunset, because at sunset was a "high day" of the feast, the first day of the feast, a sabbath per the feast and not the regular weekly sabbath.

Jesus was crucified and died on a Wednesday. At sunset on that day is when the 3 days and 3 nights count begins.

Wednesday before sunset - Lord Jesus dies on the cross, they rush to bury His body because at sunset begins Thursday, a high day per the feast, and is to be a sabbath.

Thursday sunset to morning = 1st night in the tomb
Thursday morning to sunset, begins Friday = 1st day
Friday sunset to morning = 2nd night
Friday morning to sunset, begins Saturday = 2nd day
Saturday sunset to morning = 3rd night
Saturday morning to sunset, begins Sunday = 3rd day
Sunday, sometime after Saturday sunset which began Sunday Jesus rose.
This has already been shown to be incorrect for a number of reasons earlier in the thread.
 
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klutedavid

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Dec 7, 2013
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No, the day that Lord Jesus died is NOT... the 1st day His body was in the tomb. The John 19 Scripture declares they rushed to bury Jesus' body before sunset, because at sunset was a "high day" of the feast, the first day of the feast, a sabbath per the feast and not the regular weekly sabbath.

Jesus was crucified and died on a Wednesday. At sunset on that day is when the 3 days and 3 nights count begins.

Wednesday before sunset - Lord Jesus dies on the cross, they rush to bury His body because at sunset begins Thursday, a high day per the feast, and is to be a sabbath.

Thursday sunset to morning = 1st night in the tomb
Thursday morning to sunset, begins Friday = 1st day
Friday sunset to morning = 2nd night
Friday morning to sunset, begins Saturday = 2nd day
Saturday sunset to morning = 3rd night
Saturday morning to sunset, begins Sunday = 3rd day
Sunday, sometime after Saturday sunset which began Sunday Jesus rose.
Your day count is not correct.

John 19:31
Then the Jews, because it was the day of preparation, so that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath for that Sabbath was a high day.

What day is John referring to is it Thursday (5th day) or Saturday (7th day)?

John did not say that the fifth day was a Sabbath day or a high Sabbath day.

John actually said, 'for that sabbath was a high day'?

That Sabbath day was a high day, not the fifth day was a high Sabbath day.
 
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