Is "socialism" a scare word in America?

[Hans Blaster]

When Ashoka accepted the Buddhadharma as the emperor of the Maruyan Empire (where India get's the wheel on its flag), he created alot of government services for the people (including hospitals) because he believed in extending the concept of benevolence to government. And he is usually considered a paragon of a Buddhist ruler.

I really need to read that book I bought about the history of India (looks at receipt...) two years ago. Until then all I know about Ashoka comes from a segment in the most recent series of Cosmos.

 

[ananda]

I feel no pain from paying taxes

You're welcome to pay the rest of us 100% of your income!

 

[Hans Blaster]

Well, duh. Of course it's nothing special for some people; but it's just as clear that those others who are only 'scraping by' feel differently about it.

Let's see, how do we solve a taxation problem where some people can easily afford to pay taxes and others are more financially constrained? Perhaps we could have some sort of, umm, progressive tax rate scale that depends on income. Has anyone ever tried that?

 

[FireDragon76]

Not if the Buddha's teachings are correct, which I believe they are.

You won't find any support for political libertarianism in the Buddhadharma. It rests on a wrong view of the self, as I pointed out earlier.

 

[ananda]

You won't find any support for political libertarianism in the Buddhadharma. It rests on a wrong view of the self, as I pointed out earlier.

I disagree, imo libertarianism is rooted in the the idea that everyone should fully experience the effects of the causes we intentionally create - it is the core idea behind the Law of Kamma. Interrupting that cycle and transferring suffering to others perpetuates ignorance and further suffering.

I see that in children whose parents ignorantly isolate them from sufferings in an attempt to make them perpetually entertained and "happy"; they are inevitably disordered individuals, in my experience.

 

[Aaron_Bethlhm]

Not if the Buddha's teachings are correct, which I believe they are.

First, I don't know if 'debate'/ controversial questions are permitted in political section here, so if not, ignore this...
if permitted, I'm wondering if the teachings you believe were tested by you sufficiently to know that they are correct ?
As compared to people who are raised in any country or religion, who are told all their life growing as a child what is correct, and do not even start to question it at all until some day in the future ...... ?

 

[ananda]

First, I don't know if 'debate'/ controversial questions are permitted in political section here, so if not, ignore this...

"The American Politics forum is open for all members to discuss and debate political topics that apply specifically to the United States"

if permitted, I'm wondering if the teachings you believe were tested by you sufficiently to know that they are correct ?
As compared to people who are raised in any country or religion, who are told all their life growing as a child what is correct, and do not even start to question it at all until some day in the future ...... ?

I can't say I can compare my personal experience to the experience of others, since I don't know their personal experience, but I can say that what I do know is what I've personally experienced.

 

[Albion]

You won't find any support for political libertarianism in the Buddhadharma. It rests on a wrong view of the self, as I pointed out earlier.

That humans are naturally free, and entitled to it, save only that they violate that same right in others if they engage in force or fraud against them?

 

[FireDragon76]

That humans are naturally free, and entitled to it, save only that they violate that same right in others if they engage in force or fraud against them?

Humans and every other phenomena arise due to causes and conditions beyond themselves.

The Buddhist conceptualization of freedom is not based on free will, which is a Christian concept.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I disagree, imo libertarianism is rooted in the the idea that everyone should fully experience the effects of the causes we intentionally create - it is the core idea behind the Law of Kamma. Interrupting that cycle and transferring suffering to others perpetuates ignorance and further suffering.

Thanks for reassuring me that my opposition to and disdain of religion isn't just rooted in a personal bias against my Christian upbringing.

 

[FireDragon76]

I disagree, imo libertarianism is rooted in the the idea that everyone should fully experience the effects of the causes we intentionally create - it is the core idea behind the Law of Kamma. Interrupting that cycle and transferring suffering to others perpetuates ignorance and further suffering.

Buddhist ethics are not based on karma. They are based on reciprocity and manifesting virtues such as compassion and kindness. The kind of view of karma you are presenting is more like Hindu superstition.

In the Kucchivikara-vatthu the Buddha did not stop to ask if the monk who was sick wouldn't benefit from awakening to the karmic roots of his dysentery, he simply acted out of compassion. The other monks would not help the monk because they didn't see how the sick monk benefited them, but the Buddha rebuked them:

"Monks, you have no mother, you have no father, who might tend to you. If you don't tend to one another, who then will tend to you? Whoever would tend to me, should tend to the sick.

 

[pitabread]

Yes, this is what I was referring to when I pointed out that taxes can be equated to suffering.

That's not really applicable in the context of your average developed country, though.

 

[pitabread]

Well, duh. Of course it's nothing special for some people; but it's just as clear that those others who are only 'scraping by' feel differently about it.

In a progressive system, those who make less money pay lower marginal tax rates. And below a certain threshold, they might pay no taxes at all (esp. where certain tax credits are concerned).

So someone who is barely scraping by, as you put it, taxation shouldn't be a significant impact.

 

[FireDragon76]

Thanks for reassuring me that my opposition to and disdain of religion isn't just rooted in a personal bias against my Christian upbringing.

The best examples of Buddhism are not the philosophy of Ebenezer Scrooge in Oriental drag.

Even the Buddha benefited from the kindness and compassion of others. The sutras state, if not for the kindness of a young girl giving him food, the Buddha might have perished.

 

[Speedwell]

The best examples of Buddhism are not the philosophy of Ebenezer Scrooge in Oriental drag.

Even the Buddha benefited from the kindness and compassion of others. The sutras state, if not for the kindness of a young girl giving him food, the Buddha might have perished.

Yeah, but we're talking about Supply Side Buddha here.

 

[pitabread]

The Buddhist conceptualization of freedom is not based on free will, which is a Christian concept.

I've been told by Christians on this forum that free will isn't a Christian concept. :/

 

[Albion]

In a progressive system, those who make less money pay lower marginal tax rates.

And of course they can less afford to pay those lower taxes than the wealthier among us can afford to pay higher ones.

So someone who is barely scraping by, as you put it, taxation shouldn't be a significant impact.

Is this all theoretical to you? People who are barely scraping by are barely scraping by! By definition, they do not have excess funds to waste.

 

[pitabread]

And of course they can less afford to pay those lower taxes than the wealthier among us can afford to pay higher ones.

Sure. Which is why a proper progressive system should put the burden of taxation onto wealthier (e.g. higher-earning) individuals.

Is this all theoretical to you? People who are barely scraping by are barely scraping by! By definition, they do not have excess funds to waste.

And in such a scenario, those individuals likely aren't paying tax to begin with.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Buddhist ethics are not based on karma. They are based on reciprocity and manifesting virtues such as compassion and kindness. The kind of view of karma you are presenting is more like Hindu superstition.

I'm glad you speak of ethics, because I find ethics more nuanced and interesting that morals which are often dogmatic.

(It's also been interesting to see differences of opinion from inside a different religious tradition than Christianity or everything being Christian v. godless heathens. on this site.)

 

[FireDragon76]

I've been told by Christians on this forum that free will isn't a Christian concept. :/

The western articulation of the concept has its origins in Augustine. It simply doesn't appear in Asian religions as a salient feature.