Doing greater deeds than Jesus?

[BNR32FAN]

Thanks, I didn't catch that. You're right, there is no "miraculous," only "works" or "greater works" in the text. I wonder why the NET takes that liberty?

I’m not sure.

 

[ZNP]

Hi guys,

In John 14:12, Jesus says this:

"I tell you the solemn truth, the person who believes in me will perform the miraculous deeds that I am doing, and will perform greater deeds than these, because I am going to the Father." (NET)

I understand that Him "going to the Father" implies that He will send His Spirit and empower us.

But, my question is: it seems to me no one has really DONE the kind of deeds / works Jesus did, never mind GREATER works.

So what is Jesus saying here? Thoughts?

Go!

Really? No one has healed the blind, and healed more blind people than Jesus? No one has helped the lame to walk, and helped more lame to walk than Jesus? Do I need to continue?

 

[HatGuy]

I think it’s his bible version that is throwing off his understanding of this scripture because the version he quoted adds the word miraculous to Jesus’ works which probably leads him to believe that Jesus is speaking of miracles and not just the works that He did in general.

Thanks, I didn't catch that. You're right, there is no "miraculous," only "works" or "greater works" in the text. I wonder why the NET takes that liberty?

Interesting indeed! Good catch, thank you. I wonder why the NET did that. Usually I like the NET, it's an underrated Bible version IMO.

So I went to the notes and found this:

"What are the greater deeds that Jesus speaks of, and how is this related to his going to the Father? It is clear from both John 7:39 and 16:7 that the Holy Spirit will not come until Jesus has departed. After Pentecost and the coming of the Spirit to indwell believers in a permanent relationship, believers would be empowered to perform even greater deeds than those Jesus did during his earthly ministry.

When the early chapters of Acts are examined, it is clear that, from a numerical standpoint, the deeds of Peter and the other Apostles surpassed those of Jesus in a single day (the day of Pentecost). On that day more were added to the church than had become followers of Jesus during the entire three years of his earthly ministry. And the message went forth not just in Judea, Samaria, and Galilee, but to the farthest parts of the known world. This understanding of what Jesus meant by “greater deeds” is more probable than a reference to “more spectacular miracles.” Certainly miraculous deeds were performed by the apostles as recounted in Acts, but these do not appear to have surpassed the works of Jesus himself in either degree or number.

It appears they translated it that way to try and contrast "miraculous deeds" vs "greater deeds" - to imply that the "greater deeds" are also greater in "type" - i.e. salvation.

Bible translation such a mission - I can see how they were trying to do that now. Always helps to look at the notes, eh? (I have a noteless version which I use for devotion to try and get at the meaning myself before I turn to study).

Thoughts on that?

Thanks for the engagement everyone!

 

[zoidar]

Hi guys,

In John 14:12, Jesus says this:

"I tell you the solemn truth, the person who believes in me will perform the miraculous deeds that I am doing, and will perform greater deeds than these, because I am going to the Father." (NET)

I understand that Him "going to the Father" implies that He will send His Spirit and empower us.

But, my question is: it seems to me no one has really DONE the kind of deeds / works Jesus did, never mind GREATER works.

So what is Jesus saying here? Thoughts?

Go!

There is a ministry in Sweden where the pastor was blessed with many spiritual gifts (he died a few years ago). In that ministry there are a lot of recordings of people being healed, from deafness and blindness to anxiety and depression. Still, in what way would those healings be greater than the miracles of Jesus? I'm not sure what Jesus meant. Was it that we are to believe and expect anything and everything to happen through the Holy Spirit? Still haven't seen anyone walk on water. What deed would be greater than those of Jesus?

 

[public hermit]

Thoughts on that?

I'm not familiar with the NET, and I'll try not to form a judgment based on this one passage. Translation is a significant task, and it can be difficult to avoid inserting unwarranted nuances into the text. This particular example strikes me as pretty blatant, but it may not have seemed so to the translators. The perfectly objective point of view is an illusion.

 

[com7fy8]

Elijah only called down fire on a sacrificial altar & sacrifice, as a demonstration

What about 2 Kings 1:10-12?

 

[Bruce Leiter]

Hi guys,

In John 14:12, Jesus says this:

"I tell you the solemn truth, the person who believes in me will perform the miraculous deeds that I am doing, and will perform greater deeds than these, because I am going to the Father." (NET)

I understand that Him "going to the Father" implies that He will send His Spirit and empower us.

But, my question is: it seems to me no one has really DONE the kind of deeds / works Jesus did, never mind GREATER works.

So what is Jesus saying here? Thoughts?

Go!

The whole church's works will be greater in number, but the greatest work of all is sharing our testimonies, which God uses to create the miracle of the new birth, a very powerful work indeed!

 

[ZNP]

The whole church's works will be greater in number, but the greatest work of all is sharing our testimonies, which God uses to create the miracle of the new birth, a very powerful work indeed!

Thank you, there is no greater work than for someone to get a new heart.

 

[bling]

First off: I am not satisfied with the answers I have been reading and especially the idea of “Numbers of converts”.

Look at the passage again because Christ gives a hint to what He is talking about: John 14: 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

Why would the “number” be greater, “because Christ went to the Father”?

What extremely great thing did Jesus not do while on earth in His body?

Look at the context of the verse since a few verses later we have: 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth… and will be in you.

In 16: 7… unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.

Jesus describes this “Advocate” as His equal replacement which can only come to permanently indwell the individual after he leaves.

Peter will get up in his first Christ Crucified sermon and say something Christ could not say while he was on earth: Acts 2:38 “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

This indwelling permanent Holy Spirit could come through Peter (or any of us), but Christ could not say that at His time on earth.

So tell me: How great of a work is it to allow the Spirit to come through you to indwell others?

 

[1213]

...
"I tell you the solemn truth, the person who believes in me will perform the miraculous deeds that I am doing, and will perform greater deeds than these, because I am going to the Father." (NET)
...
But, my question is: it seems to me no one has really DONE the kind of deeds / works Jesus did, never mind GREATER works.

So what is Jesus saying here? Thoughts?

I think we should not give own meaning to what Jesus said. He said that the people will do greater works and I believe it. But interesting question is, what are greater works.

Why people don’t seem to do greater works? Maybe one reason is that many “Christians” are not really disciples of Jesus, they follow own doctrines, not the teachings of Jesus.

 

[jasonMalloy1999]

Greater in number.

Though he was God, Jesus was also a man, and limited to one time and place. Of course, we too can only be in one place at a time, but we can travel widely; take planes, boats, trains, buses to many places to preach the Gospel. We can also use the internet, send Bibles and Christian books electronically, and use things like Zoom, Face time and other things to meet other Christians and have prayer and fellowship. Or write blogs, articles, or Christian books.
Jesus is everywhere now, through his Spirit. He is in all of us as we go out to witness for him and take his light to the world.

true i became a christian through ps4 gaming

 

[jasonMalloy1999]

First off: I am not satisfied with the answers I have been reading and especially the idea of “Numbers of converts”.

Look at the passage again because Christ gives a hint to what He is talking about: John 14: 12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

Why would the “number” be greater, “because Christ went to the Father”?

What extremely great thing did Jesus not do while on earth in His body?

Look at the context of the verse since a few verses later we have: 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth… and will be in you.

In 16: 7… unless I go away, the Advocate will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you.

Jesus describes this “Advocate” as His equal replacement which can only come to permanently indwell the individual after he leaves.

Peter will get up in his first Christ Crucified sermon and say something Christ could not say while he was on earth: Acts 2:38 “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

This indwelling permanent Holy Spirit could come through Peter (or any of us), but Christ could not say that at His time on earth.

So tell me: How great of a work is it to allow the Spirit to come through you to indwell others?

Peter will get up in his first Christ Crucified sermon and say something Christ could not say while he was on earth: Acts 2:38 “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

does that mean un baptized chrstians go
to hell a
s
im not baptized AS ITS IMPOSSIBLE FOR ME ATM I SAVED FYI DUNNO WHY IT ON CAPS LOCK LOL

 

[bling]

Peter will get up in his first Christ Crucified sermon and say something Christ could not say while he was on earth: Acts 2:38 “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

does that mean un baptized chrstians go
to hell a
s
im not baptized AS ITS IMPOSSIBLE FOR ME ATM I SAVED FYI DUNNO WHY IT ON CAPS LOCK LOL

Not sure what you are asking?

 

[Ricky M]

Translation is a significant task, and it can be difficult to avoid inserting unwarranted nuances into the text.

Which is why we should refer to several versions and not just lean on one alone.

 

[Ricky M]

Jesus calmed a stormy sea. I've seen the Holy Spirit raise waves in a calm sea. Is that greater? Not sure.

I've seen people appear and disappear out of thin air to direct me to someone the Lord wanted me to speak to. Is that greater? Don't know.

I've had visions during prayer that directed my prayer, which I later found out stopped someone from slicing their wrists. Is that greater? Still can't say.

What I do know is, if you don't think miracles can happen, they won't. Maybe faith is the greater act He was talking about.

 

[Carl Emerson]

His works include the miraculous.

 

[Carl Emerson]

When Jesus sent word to John the Baptist confirming that the Kingdom he preached had arrived - what was the message? What happens where Jesus reigns?

Matt 11

4 Jesus replied, “Go back and report to John what you hear and see: 5 The blind receive sight, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and good news is preached to the poor.

That is what happens where Jesus reigns...

 

[Carl Emerson]

Jesus lit a fire in Jerusalem at Pentecost.

Haters of Jesus immediately tried to snuff it out.

This truth of His Lordship is now heard pretty much anywhere on the Globe.

That in itself is a greater work.

 

[bling]

Jesus lit a fire in Jerusalem at Pentecost.

Haters of Jesus immediately tried to snuff it out.

This truth of His Lordship is now heard pretty much anywhere on the Globe.

That in itself is a greater work.

Might read my post 29

 

[Carl Emerson]

Yes I did... well written.