The Devil Adores the Christian Soldier

[Carl Emerson]

You are correct, Jesus did tell His followers to get swords and they answered "we have two" and Jesus said that is enough. The question is, enough for what? The answer to that question is easy if you read the entire context and not just the simple statement. Immediately before He said that He said this: "It is necessary that all prophecy be fulfilled concerning Me." It is then that He asked about the swords. So, what was the prophecy that was still unfulfilled? It was the prophecy of Jesus being associated with criminals. When Peter took the sword and used it against the state by attacking the High Priest's servant they became criminals. That is what the sword was for, to fulfill prophecy as Jesus said. After this point we never again hear of the Apostles or disciples owning or using swords. Jesus was not telling His followers that it is okay to kill an attacker. If that was the case there would have been ample opportunity for His followers to do just that but they all willingly gave up their lives as an example for us to follow just as they had followed the example of Jesus. You do have the right to defend your family according to the state but not according to Jesus; who are you going to follow? What the state does has no bearing on believers who follow Jesus.

Where does Jesus say not to defend your family?

 

[SteveIndy]

Actually, I have the right to defend my family according to the state but not according to SteveIndy. And nowhere does Jesus remove that right.

The N.T. does not give you or any Christian the right to kill another human being under any circumstance. James tells us that we are not to judge our neighbor and says, "There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save life and destroy. But you—who are you to judge your neighbor?" When you kill your enemy you have become his judge, jury, and executioner. That is a mighty heavy load to carry, are you sure that you're up to it?

 

[SteveIndy]

Where does Jesus say not to defend your family?

Yes, you should defend your family but you have no right to be another man's executioner. Jesus, His Apostles, His disciples for the better part of 300 years illustrated how this was to be done until apostacy slipped in. Their actions speak very loud; follow their example.

 

[SteveIndy]

Christian soldiers are Christian too

Christians are those who follow Christ. Do you mean to say that a Christian prostitute is a Christian, or that a Christian executioner is a Christian, or that a Christian mass murderer is a Christian? A person who does not follow the Lord is not Christian.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Rom 13:3

Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil.

Clearly Jesus maintains order through Authorities with arms...

 

[Not David]

Christians are those who follow Christ. Do you mean to say that a Christian prostitute is a Christian, or that a Christian executioner is a Christian, or that a Christian mass murderer is a Christian? A person who does not follow the Lord is not Christian.

We all don't follow the Lord at times.

 

[renniks]

I think you missed the reality.

The demons and the devil LOVE THE MILITARY and LOVE SOLDIERS willing to kill others. (and rob, and rape, and pillage....) Often many of them together committing atrocities .... "WITH APPROVAL" of the commanding officers and authorities over them (who are often doing the same, first, and worse) ...

How can you be a soldier if you are not willing to kill if necessary? Killing in self defense is not murder.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

How can you be a soldier if you are not willing to kill if necessary?

Desmond Doss

 

[renniks]

Desmond Doss

Yes I saw that movie. It was an exception to the rule. In most cases, pacifists would not be able to enlist, for obvious reasons.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Yes I saw that movie. It was an exception to the rule. In most cases, pacifists would not be able to enlist, for obvious reasons.

Another thing that is rare -> (Christians ARE the exception to the rule/ NOT of the world any more)

How can you be a soldier if you are not willing to kill if necessary?

 

[dzheremi]

Christians are those who follow Christ. Do you mean to say that a Christian prostitute is a Christian, or that a Christian executioner is a Christian, or that a Christian mass murderer is a Christian?

St. Mary of Egypt, St. Moses the Ethiopian, and all others who are known for their notoriously bad lives are all remembered as Christian saints, yes.

A person who does not follow the Lord is not Christian.

St. Peter, the prince of the apostles, denied Christ three times. Was he somehow not a Christian then? Does a person's Christianity sort of flicker in and out of existence in accordance with whether or not they are doing what is right at any given time? Is the Church a museum for saints, or a hospital for sinners?

If it is the former, what are we to make of "Lord, I believe; help my unbelief"? (Mark 9:24) Or the place of St. Thomas the doubter who also evangelized India? Or large parts of St. Paul's epistles wherein he convicts himself of his own shameful and sinful behavior, past and present?

I would love to live in a world in which no one of any kind needed to be a soldier, but that is not the world into which our Lord, God, and Savior came, for the salvation and transformation of mankind and the whole creation. And He Himself even said that He did not come to bring peace, but a sword. Though I do not believe that is meant to be taken literally, given the context (that His message and Person would pit family against each other, as some would believe and some would not), it does still show that the idea of Jesus as a peaceful proto-hippie is largely the invention of those who want Him to be so for their own ends, and so emphasize and de-emphasize accordingly, not confronting nor admitting the whole and true Christ.

 

[expos4ever]

Steve Indy: you are right about the swords. Nothing to do with self-defence. More later.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I would love to live in a world in which no one of any kind needed to be a soldier, but that is not the world into which our Lord, God, and Savior came, for the salvation and transformation of mankind and the whole creation.

It is better to live in the world we are in, as the Creator and our Lord and Savior says to do.

The way to escape the violence of killing is provided fully by Yahuweh through Yahushua Hamashiach.

The world will continue being more and more wicked, yes.

PHILLIPS
“Now of course I know, my brothers, that you had no idea what you were doing any more than your leaders had. But God had foretold through all his prophets that his Christ must suffer and this was how his words came true. Now you must repent and turn to God so that your sins may be wiped out, that time after time your souls may know the refreshment that comes from the presence of God. .....

For Moses said, ‘The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from your brethren. Him you shall hear in all things, whatever he says to you. And it shall come to pass that every soul who will not hear that prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.’

Romans 12:2
Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to discern what is the good, pleasing, and perfect will of God.

Revelation 22:11 - CJB - "Whoever keeps acting wickedly,...
[Search domain www.studylight.org/bible/cjb/revelation/22-11.html] Revelation 22:11 - CJB -
Whoever is evil must go on doing evil, and whoever is filthy must go on being filthy; whoever is good must go on doing good, and whoever is holy must go on being holy.>> Holman Christian Standard Let the unrighteous go on in unrighteousness; let the filthy go on being made filthy; let the righteous go on in righteousness; and let the holy go on being made holy."

 

[Carl Emerson]

No one responded to my post in which I showed that Jesus clearly mandated armed service to combat evil...

Rom 13:3

Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil.

Clearly Jesus maintains order through Authorities with arms...

 

[Anguspure]

But would it not be better to have Christians in the military so that they can be salt in the military? Do we want everyone in the military to be men who are living in darkness, whom God has given them over to a depraved mind? No! We need true men of God who refuse to rob, rape, and pillage - who speak out when they see these atrocities! We need commanding officers and authorities who know that they will have to give an account to the Judge of all earth. We need men in the armed forces who have a right fear of God! May God help us if our military is filled only with atheists and heathen!

A friend of mine (a believer) was in the military in his country as a medic in an active war zone. I asked him about how he dealt with the killing. His response was along the lines that the best way to protect the guy that you're trying to save is to kill the man that is trying to shoot him.
Soldiers are protectors and Love always protects.

 

[SteveIndy]

Rom 13:3

Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; 4 for it is a minister of God to you for good. But if you do what is evil, be afraid; for it does not bear the sword for nothing; for it is a minister of God, an avenger who brings wrath on the one who practices evil.

Clearly Jesus maintains order through Authorities with arms...

God has ordained governments to keep rebellious men in order. If Christians become rebellious then the government will do its job. But, all of the Apostles were murdered and imprisoned by the God-ordained government, were they rebellious? No, they were not, they simply obeyed the "higher power" which was their first duty. God has also ordained a time when He will withdraw the Spirit that holds the governments in check and anarchy and lawlessness will rule. None of this has anything to do with Christians who serve God as their ruler and they follow His directives as those who are on a mission to seek and to save those who they can. Christians have not been directed to serve in the governments of men or to enforce the laws of men with threats or harm.

 

[SteveIndy]

St. Mary of Egypt, St. Moses the Ethiopian, and all others who are known for their notoriously bad lives are all remembered as Christian saints, yes.



St. Peter, the prince of the apostles, denied Christ three times. Was he somehow not a Christian then? Does a person's Christianity sort of flicker in and out of existence in accordance with whether or not they are doing what is right at any given time? Is the Church a museum for saints, or a hospital for sinners?

If it is the former, what are we to make of "Lord, I believe; help my unbelief"? (Mark 9:24) Or the place of St. Thomas the doubter who also evangelized India? Or large parts of St. Paul's epistles wherein he convicts himself of his own shameful and sinful behavior, past and present?

I would love to live in a world in which no one of any kind needed to be a soldier, but that is not the world into which our Lord, God, and Savior came, for the salvation and transformation of mankind and the whole creation. And He Himself even said that He did not come to bring peace, but a sword. Though I do not believe that is meant to be taken literally, given the context (that His message and Person would pit family against each other, as some would believe and some would not), it does still show that the idea of Jesus as a peaceful proto-hippie is largely the invention of those who want Him to be so for their own ends, and so emphasize and de-emphasize accordingly, not confronting nor admitting the whole and true Christ.

There is no doubt, Christianity is made up of sinners, converted sinners. If this “convert” is living daily in the sin he or she was saved from then there is a very good reason to believe that it was seed that fell among the rocks. The Lord is patient but His command is firm, separate from your sin.

If you are a true Christian then you have no need of soldiers, only unbelievers need help from the world. This is exactly the reason that Jesus said, “Will I even find faith on the earth when I return?” In chapter 7 of Romans Paul talks of this battle between sin and salvation and says he is a prisoner to his old way of life. This is a good example of all of those who are still held prisoner to the idea of killing their enemies. “What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!” Paul found the answer, the question is, Will you?

When Jesus said that He did not come to bring peace but a sword He illustrates what He meant. In this illustration He means for us to see that the sword is an instrument that divides and separates, it divides families and friends. Jesus was no hippy just wanting to love and get along with everyone. This issue of non-resistance to the evil person is just such an issue. Jesus came to preach the truth that is so hard for people to grasp because it cuts so deep. This truth of non-resistance to evil is just such a truth; it has cost very many lives, divided families, and lost friends. No hippy ever wanted to preach that message, only Jesus and those who risk everything for the TRUTH.

 

[B8t6]

When you become a soldier and join the army you take an oath /vow which Jesus told you not to do


James 5:12 King James Version (KJV)

12 But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.


Then as a soldier you take up the sword or in our day a gun and at times will be commanded by men who you don't even know to use it against the enemy Jesus told you to love.

Matthew 26:52 King James Version (KJV)

52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.

Psalm 17:13 King James Version (KJV)

13 Arise, O Lord, disappoint him, cast him down: deliver my soul from the wicked, which is thy sword:


The most evil thing you do as soldier is give up your God given right to make your own decisions based on conscience through negating your free will to man by becoming an order follower controlled by men in an army who now make your decisions for you who you most likely don't even know who give you commands which you by law must follow regardless of moral right and wrong.

If you join the Army its because you identify yourself with your nation which is part of the world when your kingdom is meant to be not of this world. Their could be Christian fighting Christian in opposing armies while the devil sits back and laughs at the deception of it.

John 18:36 King James Version (KJV)

36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

The most evil thing you do as soldier is give up your God given right to make your own decisions based on conscience through negating your free will to man by becoming an order follower controlled by men in an army who now make your decisions for you who you most likely don't even know who give you commands which you by law must follow regardless of moral right and wrong.

Good exposition I think.
Did you see or read Desmond Doss's story. He (alone?) WAS ABLE to always DO what GOD SAYS is RIGHT - even though his fellow military members and those in authority over him persecuted him for it.
Even UNDER FIRE, he never picked up a gun. (there's a lot more also, about his obedience to God, not man, WHILE IN THE MILITARY)

 

[B8t6]

Its evil to give up your free will through a vow to make you own decisions based on moral right and wrong. Now the man who commands you becomes your God