Inside the squalor on ‘Skid Row’ as typhoid scare grips Los Angeles

redleghunter

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With rats running everywhere among piles of decaying garbage, these shocking images of a tent city look like a sordid third world shanty — but are actually downtown Los Angeles.

The horrifying photos show what the Los Angeles Times calls “collapse of a city that’s lost control” — and what is believed to have left at least one LAPD cop with typhoid.

“The city of Los Angeles has become a giant trash receptacle,” Los Angeles Times columnist Steve Lopez complained.


The decay covers large chunks of Skid Row, a sprawling 50-block area that is believed to be the base for around 4,200 homeless people.

“What century is this?” Lopez asked.

“Is it the 21st century in the largest city of a state that ranks among the world’s most robust economies, or did someone turn back the calendar a few hundred years?”

He described someone even dumping “a fat load of poop” in the streets among the rest of the dirt and depravity.

“It used to be that illegal dumpers were a little more discreet, tossing their refuse in fields and gullies and remote outposts,” Lopez wrote.

“Now city streets are treated like dumpsters, or even toilets.”

More at the link: https://nypost.com/2019/06/02/insid...d0Zm-_SJjS4cPmCWBRQfl803Fj2D-HMDfqXE-PeTwBkhk

Poster's note: wanted ask for prayers for our brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus who are doing Kingdom work in and around Skid Row. Here is one such ministry which runs a shelter: Union Rescue Mission - Helping People in LA Overcome Homelessness
 

redleghunter

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You can credit this to the economic survival-of-the-fittest policies that have dominated since the 80s.

Lord have mercy!
I believe that is a bit of a hand wave as the horrible conditions we see now have developed over the past 10 years. In a very large and liberal state.
 
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FenderTL5

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Andrew77

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You can credit this to the economic survival-of-the-fittest policies that have dominated since the 80s.

Lord have mercy!

But that has been the reality since the country was founded. You realize that between 1776 and 1930s, it was literally survival of the fittest. If you didn't work... you starved. Yet during that time, we had the largest economic growth in the history of the US.

And by the way, economic survival of the fittest is how the entire world works. There is no place that operates differently.
 
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Halbhh

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"I think it's very uncommon in the First World. This is not a sight that one normally sees. I'd have to say that I haven't seen this," Philip Alston, the U.N.'s Special Rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights, told Connor Sheets of AL.com earlier this week as they toured a community in Butler County where "raw sewage flows from homes through exposed PVC pipes and into open trenches and pits."

Wow. While many of us that grew up in the country have seen septic field for septic systems, I just never saw anyone merely running their sewage out into the open, without going through a typical (inexpensive) old septic, even a poorly functioning one. To not even have one at all I didn't see even in the most modest homes we visited in Oklahoma in my youth.
 
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Andrew77

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Yeah, and they don't have typhoid, and tent cities.

In fact that is a bit of a false comparison. Have you been to Alabama? I know people from there. You can live on a fraction of the wage, down there. Much cheaper. So while they are clearly poor relative to living in New York, their wage fits them in Alabama.

Now I'm not saying there are no poor. There are poor people everywhere.

The problem with California is, out of all the states, California is the most rich state in the Union. In fact if California was a country, they would be one of the most wealthy in the world.

And yet with all their taxes, and social programs, and public spending, and all the debt they racked up... they have massive tent cities, needles and poop all over the streets, and now Typhoid.

Explain that? If Alabama had all that going on, we would say "well yes, they're poor". What is the excuse for California? Explain?
 
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Halbhh

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Yeah, and they don't have typhoid, and tent cities.

In fact that is a bit of a false comparison. Have you been to Alabama? I know people from there. You can live on a fraction of the wage, down there. Much cheaper. So while they are clearly poor relative to living in New York, their wage fits them in Alabama.

Now I'm not saying there are no poor. There are poor people everywhere.

The problem with California is, out of all the states, California is the most rich state in the Union. In fact if California was a country, they would be one of the most wealthy in the world.

And yet with all their taxes, and social programs, and public spending, and all the debt they racked up... they have massive tent cities, needles and poop all over the streets, and now Typhoid.

Explain that? If Alabama had all that going on, we would say "well yes, they're poor". What is the excuse for California? Explain?

The regional or state government is not usually the one in charge of the a city and it's neighborhoods -- instead the city government is the one in charge there primarily.
Los Angeles is a pretty temperament climate, so that will attract more homeless residents. Also, sometimes big cities have so many wanting to work there that they get large poor areas of recent poor working class groups which can sometimes be slum-like regardless of how the province or regional government operates.

Now, infamously some cities simply bulldoze the homeless out of their areas.

That's inhumane.
 
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Sistrin

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With rats running everywhere among piles of decaying garbage, these shocking images of a tent city look like a sordid third world shanty — but are actually downtown Los Angeles.

But, but, but...Trump!!!
 
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MathewMark1988

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I am reminded of my first visit, as a youngster, to Union Square in San Francisco. It's a beautiful park-like area, surrounded on all four sides by high-priced hotels and stores (including Tiffany's) selling luxury goods. There was a man selling small bags of popcorn for 10 cents each.

I bought a bag and threw one or two pieces to a nearby pigeon. It seemed hungry and walked closer to me. I threw it a few more pieces and a couple of more pigeons flew up and landed nearby, competing with each other for the available morsels. At some point I spilled part of the bag and my feet immediately vanished in a carpet of pigeons. As more and more of them flew towards me I tossed the remainder of the popcorn in an arc as far away from me as I could. Literally hundreds of pigeons came fluttering in as I made good my escape.

I learned two things that day; lesson one, if you feed a pigeon, you get more pigeons and lesson two, they sure do poop a lot.

When a city provides food, shelter and services to the homeless, more of them will soon arrive. Cities like Los Angeles, San Diego, San Francisco, Seattle and Portland, with moderate climates and generous support programs for the indigent, are magnets. No matter how much the services are expanded, new arrivals will quickly exceed the city's capacity to provide food, shelter, medical care and sanitation.

Every restaurant, bar and theater I have ever seen has a sign, usually posted under the authority of the local Fire Marshall, that says something to the effect of "Max. occupancy XXXX". No city can accommodate an unlimited number of the homeless.

With them they often bring drug and alcohol addiction, mental illness, crime and filth. They throw their trash in the streets because the garbage cans are full and few in number. They steal because they do not work. They poop in the streets because they have few, if any, options. These conditions bring rats, fleas and disease.

Again, no city can support or tolerate an unlimited number of homeless!

If you feed the pigeons, you only get more pigeons!

At some point the city council or mayor has to say "Sorry, but we're full here. Keep moving."

It's not being heartless. It's being rational.
 
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Sistrin

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We should all focus on Christ, not any political person, world leader, etc.


In all my time in the Christian Church I do not recall ever encountering a Bible verse forbidding a sense of humor.
 
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Halbhh

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In all my time in the Christian Church I do not recall ever encountering a Bible verse forbidding a sense of humor.

The Christians I know laugh a lot.

(For care and completeness, there is of course some certain kinds of laughing we are not to do:
Ephesians 5:4 Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk, or crude joking, which are out of character, but rather thanksgiving., and of course also mocking/scoffing (ask if you need verses) -- those kinds of humor we all can feel and know are wrong. So, there is ok humor and bad humor, and we can feel the difference for example if it happens we ourselves are the object. If you would be fine if the humor was about you, then it's ok humor generally. Matthew 7:12)
 
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Andrew77

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The regional or state government is not usually the one in charge of the a city and it's neighborhoods -- instead the city government is the one in charge there primarily.
Los Angeles is a pretty temperament climate, so that will attract more homeless residents. Also, sometimes big cities have so many wanting to work there that they get large poor areas of recent poor working class groups which can sometimes be slum-like regardless of how the province or regional government operates.

Now, infamously some cities simply bulldoze the homeless out of their areas.

That's inhumane.

Agreed. Typically the local authorities have more direct control. I would say that the state of California has a double the state tax that Ohio does. Where a low income person like me, is paying 2.9% tax in ohio, I'd be paying over 6% in California. The top marginal tax is 13% there, where it is only 5% here.

If you think that does not filter down into low income people being less able to afford a place to live, then you should reconsider.

That said, the state imposes many expensive and costly regulations, that drive up the cost of living across California. That also makes it more difficult for people to afford their own place to live.

Well it is true that wealthy cities attract people who want to work there, there are dozens, if not hundreds of cities that are far less wealthy, and don't have poop and needles on the streets so common that they have a special app specifically for reporting it to the city.

We have a large immigrant population here in central Ohio. We don't have any of these problems.

Now, infamously some cities simply bulldoze the homeless out of their areas.
That's inhumane

Is it? Are you sure about that?

What is inhumane, is to allow people to live in filth and squalor for the rest of their lives, and calling that 'humane'.

Years ago, I was listening to the BBC about this guy who lived in an airport for 3 years. He lost his job, and got evicted, and instead of getting a job, and finding a cheap one-room apartment, he started living in the airport. People gave him money, and gave him stuff, like a backpack.

Finally after 3 years, a police officer found him, threatened him, and kicked him out of the airport. Because of that, he got a job, got some training, became and electrician, and now owns his own home.

So you tell me... which of the people around this guy, were the humane ones? The people who gave him free stuff, and allowed him to live as a homeless beggar for years? Or the cop that kicked him out, and forced him to improve his live, and make something of himself?

See I think it's the cop that was the humane person. If not for that cop, that dude would have wasted a decade of his live in that airport, collecting the charity of others who are only helping him live in squalor. That dude could have stayed living as a bum for so long, that he got too old to do anything with his life.

Let me give you another example.

A woman wrote a story of her own life on a forum like this. The story went that she had a son that was lazy. He refuse to work a hard job, refused to get any education, refuse to learn a trade, sat at home and did as little as possible. Playing games, and watching TV in his mothers basement.

For a full 5 years after dropping out of college, he was nothing but leeching off his mother. She gave him everything he needed to succeed. Offered to pay for his schooling. Offered to pay for training. Paid for a car. Paid for everything.

And he did nothing.

Finally, she completely flipped. Sold the car, and served him with an eviction notice. He had two weeks to vacate. No money for an apartment either. He was on his own.

He got a full time job to replace his part time job, and started taking night classes for a 2-year degree, and eventually got a decent job.

Now which way to dealing with her son, was humane?

Giving him what he need to survive, which resulted in him remaining a useless bum for years?
Or kicking him out on his butt, which forced him to do what is needed to improve his life?

See I think kicking him out was the most humane thing.

I think we need to rethink what we call humane. Policies that are pro-squalor, are not what I call 'humane'.
 
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Halbhh

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Agreed. Typically the local authorities have more direct control. I would say that the state of California has a double the state tax that Ohio does. Where a low income person like me, is paying 2.9% tax in ohio, I'd be paying over 6% in California. The top marginal tax is 13% there, where it is only 5% here.

If you think that does not filter down into low income people being less able to afford a place to live, then you should reconsider.

That said, the state imposes many expensive and costly regulations, that drive up the cost of living across California. That also makes it more difficult for people to afford their own place to live.

Well it is true that wealthy cities attract people who want to work there, there are dozens, if not hundreds of cities that are far less wealthy, and don't have poop and needles on the streets so common that they have a special app specifically for reporting it to the city.

We have a large immigrant population here in central Ohio. We don't have any of these problems.

Now, infamously some cities simply bulldoze the homeless out of their areas.
That's inhumane

Is it? Are you sure about that?

What is inhumane, is to allow people to live in filth and squalor for the rest of their lives, and calling that 'humane'.

Years ago, I was listening to the BBC about this guy who lived in an airport for 3 years. He lost his job, and got evicted, and instead of getting a job, and finding a cheap one-room apartment, he started living in the airport. People gave him money, and gave him stuff, like a backpack.

Finally after 3 years, a police officer found him, threatened him, and kicked him out of the airport. Because of that, he got a job, got some training, became and electrician, and now owns his own home.

So you tell me... which of the people around this guy, were the humane ones? The people who gave him free stuff, and allowed him to live as a homeless beggar for years? Or the cop that kicked him out, and forced him to improve his live, and make something of himself?

See I think it's the cop that was the humane person. If not for that cop, that dude would have wasted a decade of his live in that airport, collecting the charity of others who are only helping him live in squalor. That dude could have stayed living as a bum for so long, that he got too old to do anything with his life.

Let me give you another example.

A woman wrote a story of her own life on a forum like this. The story went that she had a son that was lazy. He refuse to work a hard job, refused to get any education, refuse to learn a trade, sat at home and did as little as possible. Playing games, and watching TV in his mothers basement.

For a full 5 years after dropping out of college, he was nothing but leeching off his mother. She gave him everything he needed to succeed. Offered to pay for his schooling. Offered to pay for training. Paid for a car. Paid for everything.

And he did nothing.

Finally, she completely flipped. Sold the car, and served him with an eviction notice. He had two weeks to vacate. No money for an apartment either. He was on his own.

He got a full time job to replace his part time job, and started taking night classes for a 2-year degree, and eventually got a decent job.

Now which way to dealing with her son, was humane?

Giving him what he need to survive, which resulted in him remaining a useless bum for years?
Or kicking him out on his butt, which forced him to do what is needed to improve his life?

See I think kicking him out was the most humane thing.

I think we need to rethink what we call humane. Policies that are pro-squalor, are not what I call 'humane'.

Thanks! I like (and liked) your account of the homeless man in the airport. Encouraging story, and easy to recognize from life. We might see this one bit differently: "If not for that cop, that dude would have wasted a decade of his live in that airport," -- I tend to know I cannot see the future, and that God acts in ways we don't always know about.... (and of course I don't know if the cop literally kicked him out, or did something like that, or did something a lot better as he got him out of the airport)

Of course, I'm not referring to humane acts as inhumane, but instead the inhumane actions as 'inhumane'. ;-)
You know -- the one that isn't the way you'd want others to treat you if you were in their shoes, in their situation. That kind. The kind the breaks our instruction in Matthew 7:12, which is the only way civilization survives (only if enough people are doing Matthew 7:12 most of the time; it collapses when not enough do it). See, there are many ways to change a slum, and some of them are a lot better than others.
 
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Andrew77

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Thanks! I like (and liked) your account of the homeless man in the airport. Encouraging story, and easy to recognize from life. We might see this one bit differently: "If not for that cop, that dude would have wasted a decade of his live in that airport," -- I tend to know I cannot see the future, and that God acts in ways we don't always know about.... (and of course I don't know if the cop literally kicked him out, or did something like that, or did something a lot better as he got him out of the airport)

Of course, I'm not referring to humane acts as inhumane, but instead the inhumane actions as 'inhumane'. ;-)
You know -- the one that isn't the way you'd want others to treat you if you were in their shoes, in their situation. That kind. The kind the breaks our instruction in Matthew 7:12, which is the only way civilization survives (only if enough people are doing Matthew 7:12 most of the time; it collapses when not enough do it). See, there are many ways to change a slum, and some of them are a lot better than others.

The man who was living in the airport, was the actual guy on the BBC telling the story. He said, the police officer threatened to send him to jail, and then escorted him off the premises, with a warning to not return.

Now I get your meaning that it is possible that something else might have made him leave the airport, and improve his life. But we can't base how we live, and how we conduct society, on 'what might happen'.

You can't do that. That's like saying you should simply allow your kid to play in the street, instead of correcting them, because someone else might do it.

In this case, it's pretty clear that for roughly 3 years, the police did nothing to this guy, and this guy remained exactly as he was. Then the police kicked this guy out, and threatened to put him in jail if he came back, and he changed his life for the better.

It is safe to conclude that if the police had not stopped him then, he would have remained there for who knows how long.

Of course, I'm not referring to humane acts as inhumane, but instead the inhumane actions as 'inhumane'. ;-)
You know -- the one that isn't the way you'd want others to treat you if you were in their shoes, in their situation. That kind. The kind the breaks our instruction in Matthew 7:12, which is the only way civilization survives (only if enough people are doing Matthew 7:12 most of the time; it collapses when not enough do it). See, there are many ways to change a slum, and some of them are a lot better than others


I would hope that someone would love me enough, to kick me out on my butt, if I got the point of being a burden on society, and not working to take care of myself, and pay for my own needs, or at the very least do my very best to meet my basic needs.

Again, I would argue that forcing people to improve their lives, is sometimes the most humane thing to do. And helping people to remain unproductive, impoverished, and hopeless, is the most inhumane thing you can do.

And while we're at it, if you are going to use the Bible, then How about 2 Thess 3:10

For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat."

Pretty clear, yes?
 
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Halbhh

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The man who was living in the airport, was the actual guy on the BBC telling the story. He said, the police officer threatened to send him to jail, and then escorted him off the premises, with a warning to not return.

Now I get your meaning that it is possible that something else might have made him leave the airport, and improve his life. But we can't base how we live, and how we conduct society, on 'what might happen'.

You can't do that. That's like saying you should simply allow your kid to play in the street, instead of correcting them, because someone else might do it.

In this case, it's pretty clear that for roughly 3 years, the police did nothing to this guy, and this guy remained exactly as he was. Then the police kicked this guy out, and threatened to put him in jail if he came back, and he changed his life for the better.

It is safe to conclude that if the police had not stopped him then, he would have remained there for who knows how long.

Of course, I'm not referring to humane acts as inhumane, but instead the inhumane actions as 'inhumane'. ;-)
You know -- the one that isn't the way you'd want others to treat you if you were in their shoes, in their situation. That kind. The kind the breaks our instruction in Matthew 7:12, which is the only way civilization survives (only if enough people are doing Matthew 7:12 most of the time; it collapses when not enough do it). See, there are many ways to change a slum, and some of them are a lot better than others


I would hope that someone would love me enough, to kick me out on my butt, if I got the point of being a burden on society, and not working to take care of myself, and pay for my own needs, or at the very least do my very best to meet my basic needs.

Again, I would argue that forcing people to improve their lives, is sometimes the most humane thing to do. And helping people to remain unproductive, impoverished, and hopeless, is the most inhumane thing you can do.

And while we're at it, if you are going to use the Bible, then How about 2 Thess 3:10

For even when we were with you, we gave you this rule: "The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat."

Pretty clear, yes?

If you only asked me simply: should everyone work that is able? -- that's so easy to answer: Yes!

I think we merely have different ways of talking, wording. Perhaps I'm too literal. When I see "kick out on my butt" I tend to think of some level of actual physical violence. At minimum, some physically rough handling. Not metaphorical. But I think you do mean it metaphorical, so I have to make an effort, work, to try to translate your lingo into my own lingo. Translation.

This one thing we do seem to really have a truly different view on though (but it's not a crucial thing, but a smaller thing to know) -- "It is safe to conclude that if the police had not stopped him then, he would have remained there for who knows how long." See, I think that if it wasn't one way, it would have been another way, if that was God's intent. One way or the other, it would happen. It could have been some quite different way, and still the same outcome.

But we do agree if you are saying we are to do actions like the Good Samaritan. I don't think I can translate your lingo perfectly enough to really know if you agree with and accept and believe in the Good Samaritan story, its message, but I trust if you have faith you will, if you haven't already, past tense.
 
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Andrew77

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If you only asked me simply: should everyone work that is able? -- that's so easy to answer: Yes!

I think we merely have different ways of talking, wording. Perhaps I'm too literal. When I see "kick out on my butt" I tend to think of some level of actual physical violence. At minimum, some physically rough handling. Not metaphorical. But I think you do mean it metaphorical, so I have to make an effort, work, to try to translate your lingo into my own lingo. Translation.

This one thing we do seem to really have a truly different view on though (but it's not a crucial thing, but a smaller thing to know) -- "It is safe to conclude that if the police had not stopped him then, he would have remained there for who knows how long." See, I think that if it wasn't one way, it would have been another way, if that was God's intent. One way or the other, it would happen. It could have been some quite different way, and still the same outcome.

But we do agree if you are saying we are to do actions like the Good Samaritan. I don't think I can translate your lingo perfectly enough to really know if you agree with and accept and believe in the Good Samaritan story, its message, but I trust if you have faith you will, if you haven't already, past tense.

Yeah, you are being too literal. If I said they kicked the guy out of the restaurant, I doubt you would conclude that the teenage girls behind register, were dragging a guy kicking and screaming out onto the street by his collar.

Although I am actually for that if required. I know a pastor who literally dragged his son out on the front lawn, and told him point black that he needed to shape up, or he was going to force his 18 year old son out of the house for good.

See, I think that if it wasn't one way, it would have been another way, if that was God's intent.

No, I don't believe that. That's like saying King Saul could not possibly have violated G-d instructions, because if he failed to do it one way, it would have happened another way, if that was G-d's intent.

We know what G-d intended. He told us. Yet King Saul made a choice to violate those intentions.

All human beings have the ability to make choices Choices that follow or choices that violate, what G-d intends.

Now I think you are correct that in a broader world scheme, that G-d's over-all plan for the world, will happen one way or another. For example, the foretelling of the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem. That would have happened, no matter what. If the Romans had not done it, then someone else would have done it. In that context, you are right, that no one can prevent G-d's grand plan from happening.

But on and individual level no. If the Romans do not destroy the Temple, he doesn't find a way to force them to do it. He just finds someone else that will do it for him.

Similarly, a Christian can very easily make choices to leave the faith, and spend years, or even decades out of G-d's will, by choosing to live against his intentions. If you are like me, you have known several Christians that have done this.

Now the irony in this case, is that this guy in the story, is not a Christian. He's just a pagan guy.
 
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Halbhh

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Yeah, you are being too literal. If I said they kicked the guy out of the restaurant, I doubt you would conclude that the teenage girls behind register, were dragging a guy kicking and screaming out onto the street by his collar.

Although I am actually for that if required. I know a pastor who literally dragged his son out on the front lawn, and told him point black that he needed to shape up, or he was going to force his 18 year old son out of the house for good.

See, I think that if it wasn't one way, it would have been another way, if that was God's intent.

No, I don't believe that. That's like saying King Saul could not possibly have violated G-d instructions, because if he failed to do it one way, it would have happened another way, if that was G-d's intent.

We know what G-d intended. He told us. Yet King Saul made a choice to violate those intentions.

All human beings have the ability to make choices Choices that follow or choices that violate, what G-d intends.

Now I think you are correct that in a broader world scheme, that G-d's over-all plan for the world, will happen one way or another. For example, the foretelling of the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem. That would have happened, no matter what. If the Romans had not done it, then someone else would have done it. In that context, you are right, that no one can prevent G-d's grand plan from happening.

But on and individual level no. If the Romans do not destroy the Temple, he doesn't find a way to force them to do it. He just finds someone else that will do it for him.

Similarly, a Christian can very easily make choices to leave the faith, and spend years, or even decades out of G-d's will, by choosing to live against his intentions. If you are like me, you have known several Christians that have done this.

Now the irony in this case, is that this guy in the story, is not a Christian. He's just a pagan guy.
Seems we see all that the same.
 
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