Is abortion analogous to taxation?

[jayem]

That aside, the matter of all these laws being passed by various state legislatures in hopes that the Supreme Court will modify Roe v. Wade is not exclusively one of making all abortions illegal. It is more about getting the issue before the Court in hopes of it allowing states to put some restrictions on abortions, certainly on later term ones.

As I said, these extreme laws are politically motivated.

Late term abortion is already restricted. In all, or nearly all states to my knowledge. They are virtually always done for medical reasons. And most often in teaching hospitals, or clinics specializing in these procedures. A late term abortion carries a significantly higher medical risk. And is further complicated by the fact that the pregnant woman is medically compromised.

 

[Speedwell]

Don't assume that people make their political decisions rationally. Hearing that "pro-life" is a smokescreen for restricting women's rights over and over again can get really irritating.

Just like hearing over and over that "pro-choice" always means unquestioning approval of abortion is annoying.

 

[Albion]

As I said, these extreme laws are politically motivated.

Isn't that what legislation enacted by elected politicians is all about? So are all the laws that make abortion easier to come by.

 

[redleghunter]

Can SCOTUS declare abortion in general in violation of the constitution thus making it illegal everywhere?

I believe a Constitutional Amendment is the only way. Perhaps a way for Congress to define legal or Constitutional person via the 14th Amendment.

Best way is for people to realize human life begins with conception and every human life is of equal moral worth. That takes a change of heart.

 

[Goonie]

I believe a Constitutional Amendment is the only way. Perhaps a way for Congress to define legal or Constitutional person via the 14th Amendment.

Best way is for people to realize human life begins with conception and every human life is of equal moral worth. That takes a change of heart.

At which point every miscarriage and still birth will demand an inquest.

 

[Speedwell]

At which point every miscarriage and still birth will demand an inquest.

Which is a failing of abortion laws generally--that they are practically unenforceable. We recently had a thread devoted to the practical aspects of abortion law enforcement in this forum. The "pro-lifers" booted it badly. They are still booting it.

 

[cow451]

I believe a Constitutional Amendment is the only way. Perhaps a way for Congress to define legal or Constitutional person via the 14th Amendment.

Best way is for people to realize human life begins with conception and every human life is of equal moral worth. That takes a change of heart.

You do know that some forms of birth control work after conception, right?
Contraception after Conception? | National Review

 

[St_Worm2]

Yes, and?

You said: "How about inducing birth at eight weeks?"

I replied: The earliest a baby has been born and survived is 21 weeks and 5 days.

There is no "and".

 

[jayem]

Isn't that what legislation enacted by elected politicians is all about? So are all the laws that make abortion easier to come by.

Sure. All state legislatures enact laws they think their constituents want. Did AL legislators do any independent polling, hold any hearings, or do any other research to determine if a majority of their constituents—especially women—really support such draconian abortion restrictions? I’m 99% certain they did not. This latest crop of outrageously authoritarian legislation is purely to challenge Roe in the federal courts. You know that. And we both know politics is a dirty business.

BTW: If a state passed an unrealistically lenient abortion law, primarily to make a political statement, it would be just as cynical, and just as much a disservice to their constituents.

 

[redleghunter]

You do know that some forms of birth control work after conception, right?
Contraception after Conception? | National Review

What’s your point?

 

[tall73]

The new Alabama law does not criminalize the woman having an abortion, only the doctor or other person performing it.

I was simply spelling out the logic of the other poster in the chain of that discussion going way back to the meme posted early in the thread.

I made no assertion about the law in Alabama.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

No.

If I woke up tomorrow connected to another person through tubes in order to keep that other person alive, I feel I have the absolute right to disconnect those tubes. It would not be murder. I refuse to remove rights from people I would want to keep for myself.

Oh, so you then admit that legality is not the issue. You would just murder a baby because "how dare it exist inside me without my consent even though statistically I more than likely consented to sexual intercourse which got me pregnant."

 

[Rubiks]

Oh, so you then admit that legality is not the issue. You would just murder a baby because "how dare it exist inside me without my consent even though statistically I more than likely consented to sexual intercourse which got me pregnant."

Do you believe sex is only for procreation?

 

[Not David]

Apples and apple seeds.

It doesn't work with your agenda?

 

[cow451]

What’s your point?

Many so-called Right-to-life folks use or have partners using birth control that kills embryos.

 

[Not David]

Do you believe sex is only for procreation?

In nature it is. Something that a lot of atheists dismiss.

 

[tall73]

Do you believe sex is only for procreation?

Not sure about the other poster, but no, it is not only for procreation. But procreation is a possibility, even with most contraception methods, and engaging in sex then involves responsibility.

 

[cow451]

In nature it is. Something that a lot of atheists dismiss.

If it’s only for procreation, why did God make it so much fun?

 

[tall73]

Do you believe sex is only for procreation?

15 Drink water from your own cistern,
And running water from your own well.
16 Should your fountains be dispersed abroad,
Streams of water in the streets?
17 Let them be only your own,
And not for strangers with you.
18 Let your fountain be blessed,
And rejoice with the wife of your youth.
19 As a loving deer and a graceful doe,
Let her breasts satisfy you at all times;
And always be enraptured with her love.
20 For why should you, my son, be enraptured by an immoral woman,
And be embraced in the arms of a seductress?

 

[USincognito]

It doesn't work with your agenda?

Any "agenda" that your imagination conjures up doesn't change the fact that grown, self-aware, self-providing adult persons are not the same as embryos.