Is 400,000 illegals a year over the Southern border a crisis?

[mark46]

So, the millions of Central Americans who want to come for asylum in the US aren't a humanitarian crisis.

WOW!

The only humanitarian crisis is the separation of migrant children from their parents - in many cases, never to see their parents again. It's a crisis entirely of the making of this casually cruel and racist president.

Other than that, there is no "crisis" at the border.
Ringo

 

[Speedwell]

What about the children of Americans that break the Law and go to jail? is that a crisis? How many kids have you adopted or sponsored because they have been separated from their parents?

Depends on the law and the reasons for breaking it. Being here illegally in itself is just a status offense, like teenagers out after curfew. Ordinary illegal economic migrants are deported. Asylum seekers can't be deported immediately because by law their asylum claims must be heard before they are deported.

 

[Speedwell]

Please clarify.

My understanding is that anyone not entering at the legal ports of entry is considered a criminal. I believe that long lines have been set up for asylum seekers at the legal ports of entry for processing by immigration judges, hopefully with initial hearings within 3 days.

What, of your proposal, isn't accepted by the Right?

That the law ought to be changed to disallow the asylum claims of illegal entrants.

 

[Ringo84]

So, the millions of Central Americans who want to come for asylum in the US aren't a humanitarian crisis.

WOW!

No no, it is. It's just not a crisis of the type Donny thinks it is.
Ringo

 

[Speedwell]

So, the millions of Central Americans who want to come for asylum in the US aren't a humanitarian crisis.

WOW!

It most definitely is a humanitarian crisis. The WOW! is that only a 35-foot concrete monolith from coast to coast will resolve it.

 

[mark46]

Agreed.

That the law ought to be changed to disallow the asylum claims of illegal entrants.

 

[grasping the after wind]

2 wrong statements in there...

1. Immigrants have net positive effect on the economy and jobs.

2. America is nothing like a socialist country.

1) You cannot just assert that immigrants have a net positive effect on the economy and jobs a as a proof of a wrong statement by someone else. You need to show some sort of proof that the statement the other made was wrong. Your statement that immigrants have a net positive effect is simply not useful in the debate about strictly illegal immigration. We are not talking about the whole universe of immigrants but only of those people that are not in the country legally. Can you show that illegal immigrants have a net positive effect? Even if you could show proof that the totality of immigration has a net positive effect that would be irrelevant to the effect that illegals have. As a matter of fact if one has to rely on total immigration to show a positive net effect it might be reasonable to assume that there is a likelihood that the effect of the legal immigration is so positive that it outweighs the very negative effect from illegal immigration and produces a small net positive that would be a huge net positive minus the lawbreaking.

2) The US is something like a socialist country in that government partially controls the means of production. It is not a lot like a socialist country in that the government has not yet taken complete control of the means of production and in that coercive force has not yet been used to make people comply with socialist ideology.

 

[Ringo84]

Or that scary brown people traveling in groups somehow constitutes an "invasion" or "emergency".
Ringo

 

[grasping the after wind]

It most definitely is a humanitarian crisis. The WOW! is that only a 35-foot concrete monolith from coast to coast will resolve it.

No a strawman will not ever solve a crisis.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Yes illegal immigration is a national emergency
Climate change is not an emergency
free healthcare is not an emergency

No it's not ,clean environment and healthcare is more of a emergency. Than illegals ,that over stay their visa. Or people, cross the Mexican border .

 

[grasping the after wind]

Or that scary brown people traveling in groups somehow constitutes an "invasion" or "emergency".
Ringo

Don't you get tired of trying to make everyone that doesn't think a border is a bad thing into a racist?

 

[Ringo84]

1) You cannot just assert that immigrants have a net positive effect on the economy and jobs a as a proof of a wrong statement by someone else. You need to show some sort of proof that the statement the other made was wrong. Your statement that immigrants have a net positive effect is simply not useful in the debate about strictly illegal immigration. We are not talking about the whole universe of immigrants but only of those people that are not in the country legally. Can you show that illegal immigrants have a net positive effect? Even if you could show proof that the totality of immigration has a net positive effect that would be irrelevant to the effect that illegals have. As a matter of fact if one has to rely on total immigration to show a positive net effect it might be reasonable to assume that there is a likelihood that the effect of the legal immigration is so positive that it outweighs the very negative effect from illegal immigration and produces a small net positive that would be a huge net positive minus the lawbreaking.

How immigrants can make the economy — and the nation — stronger
3 Reasons Why Immigrants Are Key To Economic Growth
https://psmag.com/social-justice/more-research-finds-that-immigrants-increase-economic-growth

These U.S. industries can't work without illegal immigrants
Ringo

 

[Ringo84]

Don't you get tired of trying to make everyone that doesn't think a border is a bad thing into a racist?

Talk about a leading question.

I never said that "everyone who wants a border is a racist". I said that thinking that a few thousand people walking in a caravan is super scary and an "emergency" and ripping migrant children from their families in a cruel attempt at 'deterrence' is racist. And it is.
Ringo

 

[Speedwell]

Don't you get tired of trying to make everyone that doesn't think a border is a bad thing into a racist?

When you consider that the only illegals the Right seems to be concerned with are Latino refugees from Central America, it seems a reasonable inference.

 

[New Birth]

No it's not ,clean environment and healthcare is more of a emergency. Than illegals ,that over stay their visa. Or people, cross the Mexican border .

I would hope you then are doing your part. Electric car dont use straws, dont fly in planes, pick up trash along the highways, sponsor families and pay for their health care etc. Im sure you do all this right? Build the Wall.

 

[mark46]

The WOW is that no ONE dollar should be spent on a physical barrier. The WOW is that believing that any amount of concrete wall, or other physical barrier, wouldn't stop those who are trying to illegally cross to seek asylum.
=======
The easiest way for the Democrats to lose this issue is to continue to focus on a 35 ft concrete wall from coast to coast.
========
CONSIDER
1) The Border Patrol studies its data with regard to the 1000 crossing illegally every day, and decide that 110 miles of concrete wall and/or physical barrier would help and give the locations.

Congress has approved the monies for 55 miles of physical barrier at locations which they chose. The concrete wall money (or money for a physical barrier at other locations) would come from the transferred drug monies.

QUESTION
Will the 110 miles of wall (concrete and fence) help reduce the number of those illegally crossing to try to seek asylum? You suggest Congressional action as a better alternative. That isn't happening at the moment. So, will the fencing and wall reduce the number crossing illegally?

As an aside, the total number of those who are accepted as asylum seekers won't be affected. That total would be reached at the legal border, or the illegal border, or both.

It most definitely is a humanitarian crisis. The WOW! is that only a 35-foot concrete monolith from coast to coast will resolve it.

 

[New Birth]

When you consider that the only illegals the Right seems to be concerned with are Latino refugees from Central America, it seems a reasonable inference.

I think the largest quantity of illegals cross the southern border, hence the concern.

 

[Speedwell]

The easiest way for the Democrats to lose this issue is to continue to focus on a 35 ft concrete wall from coast to coast.

The only way that Democrats can lose this issue is if such a wall is built. Anything else is a win for the Democrats.

 

[Speedwell]

I think the largest quantity of illegals cross the southern border, hence the concern.

Wrong. The largest quantity of illegals enter the country legally and overstay their visas.

 

[grasping the after wind]

No it's not ,clean environment and healthcare is more of a emergency. Than illegals ,that over stay their visa. Or people, cross the Mexican border .

We have a cleaner environment now than we have had in my lifetime and well before my lifetime. No US emergency there. If you live in China or India or one of the other countries that are pouring toxins into the atmosphere there is very little the US can do to stop that. Health care? I thought ACA fixed that? Where is the emergency in health care? What now, let the same guys that did not fix things with ACA make things even worse buy taking health care over completely? I'm not buying any of these emergencies. None of these things is a crisis but I cannot blame Trump for noticing how effective it has been for others as they have pushed through things by saying it is a crisis that needs fixing right now or Armageddon . He is using a different avenue but the excuses for injudiciousness and haste are the same ones.