Discussion Judas, Ananias and Sapphira, where are they now?

[GoldenKingGaze]

Looking at Judas, Jesus disciple, and Ananias and Sapphira, they all sinned directly to God. But is this a sin with no return or was it only the loss of life from the body? Obviously, Peter the Apostle knew.

Are they in Heaven or Hell?

We must not lie to God or gamble with God. What are other such wickedness?

 

[New Birth]

they are dead in the ground awaiting the resurrection and judgement.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

they are dead in the ground awaiting the resurrection and judgement.

So their spirits sleep in the grave for now?

 

[New Birth]

So their spirits sleep in the grave for now?

I think so.

 

[lismore]

I don't believe A+S were born again to begin with.

Obviously someone who tries to lie to God does not really believe in God. Atheists playing a charade.

The believer knows, nothing you do is hidden from God's sight and God is no man's debtor. Whatever you do for the Lord you will be paid in full.

They could have kept the property, they could have sold it and kept some of the money, the one thing they could not do was lie to God.

God Bless

 

[Francis Drake]

But they were not long before, cut to the heart and repentant, baptized. It seemed they were lying to Peter not God and had the right to keep some of their money. It creates a fear of God.

Scripture says they were lying to God.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Scripture says they were lying to God.

Yes they were but did they know what they were doing?

 

[Francis Drake]

Yes they were but did they know what they were doing?

Lying to God means they knew exactly what they were doing.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I'd say Judas was gambling with the Messiah, expecting him to get away as before.
God was strict with Ananias. Where do you think he is now?

 

[Svt4Him]

With Jesus there is life. Without, the wrath of God.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

We can only make guesses as to where they are, but since we are not God, we don't really know.

 

[goldenboy]

I'd say Judas was gambling with the Messiah, expecting him to get away as before.

I've heard this line of thought, but, I don't see any reason to subscribe to it.

We do know that Judas negotiated with the Temple to get money to betray Jesus.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Looking at Judas, Jesus disciple, and Ananias and Sapphira, they all sinned directly to God. But is this a sin with no return or was it only the loss of life from the body? Obviously, Peter the Apostle knew.

Are they in Heaven or Hell?

We must not lie to God or gamble with God. What are other such wickedness?

I believe judgement takes place in two ways. One, of course, is spiritual salvation. You believe the gospel and are born again. The other is natural or physical salvation. You can be born again and completely saved spiritually.. but because of sin you may forfeit aspects of your physical salvation.
Assuming Ananias and Sapphira were believers and born again (no reason to think they were not) then they were heaven bound when they died. They did sin, but that sin resulted in their physical death.

• They "sinned a sin not unto (spiritual) death" and lost their natural life because of it. 1 John 5
• They sowed corruption in the flesh and reaped corruption in the flesh. Gal 6
• They were turned over to satan for destruction of the flesh that their souls be saved. 1 Corn 5
• They received a "just recompense of reward" for their deed. Heb 2

I think many instances of condemnation in the NT are referring to physical suffering and even death, and not spiritual death. I am not saying that spiritual death is not possible. From 1 John 5 alone.
So, assuming A and S were born again... I believe they were heaven bound.
Judas was different. He was not born again because nobody was born again before the actual death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. I think if he had not committed suicide he, like Peter, could have repented and been born again.

 

[Francis Drake]

I believe judgement takes place in two ways. One, of course, is spiritual salvation. You believe the gospel and are born again. The other is natural or physical salvation. You can be born again and completely saved spiritually.. but because of sin you may forfeit aspects of your physical salvation.
Assuming Ananias and Sapphira were believers and born again (no reason to think they were not) then they were heaven bound when they died. They did sin, but that sin resulted in their physical death.

• They "sinned a sin not unto (spiritual) death" and lost their natural life because of it. 1 John 5
• They sowed corruption in the flesh and reaped corruption in the flesh. Gal 6
• They were turned over to satan for destruction of the flesh that their souls be saved. 1 Corn 5
• They received a "just recompense of reward" for their deed. Heb 2

I think many instances of condemnation in the NT are referring to physical suffering and even death, and not spiritual death. I am not saying that spiritual death is not possible. From 1 John 5 alone.
So, assuming A and S were born again... I believe they were heaven bound.

An excellent answer.
The reason judgement seems so harsh on these two is because they were involved in a brand new powerful move of God, yet still chose the path of deception. They of all people should have known better.

This is very similar to the judgement on Achan in Joshua7 after God revealed what he had done.-

Josh7v19So Joshua said to Achan, “My son, give glory to the LORD, the God of Israel, and make a confession to Him. I urge you to tell me what you have done; do not hide it from me.”

20“It is true,” Achan replied, “I have sinned against the LORD, the God of Israel. This is what I did: 21When I saw among the spoils a beautiful cloak from Shinar, two hundred shekels of silver, and a bar of gold weighing fifty shekels, I coveted them and took them. They are hidden in the ground inside my tent, with the silver underneath.”

22So Joshua sent messengers who ran to the tent, and there was the cloak, hidden in his tent, with the silver underneath. 23They took the things from inside the tent, brought them to Joshua and all the Israelites, and spread them out before the LORD.
24Then Joshua, together with all Israel, took Achan son of Zerah, the silver, the cloak, and the bar of gold, his sons and daughters, his oxen, donkeys, and sheep, his tent, and everything else he owned, and brought them to the Valley of Achor.

25“Why have you brought this trouble upon us?” said Joshua. “Today the LORD will bring trouble upon you!” And all Israel stoned him to death. Then they stoned the others and burned their bodies. 26And they heaped over Achan a large pile of rocks that remains to this day. So the LORD turned from His burning anger. Therefore that place is called the Valley of Achor to this day.

Joshua had seen Jericho destroyed by a miracle move of God, and like Ananias and Sapphira chose the path of deception.

 

[Francis Drake]

Judas was different. He was not born again because nobody was born again before the actual death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. I think if he had not committed suicide he, like Peter, could have repented and been born again.

A little outside the theme of the thread, but in my view, all believers, both New and Old Testament were born again by the Spirit of God.
If they were not born again, then the miracles of the prophets, and the writing of the scriptures, were all done in the flesh.
But, maybe a discussion for elsewhere.

 

[Blade]

I would have to say...please...like I have never LIED to God? Sarah lied to God. What I don't know is.. did they both KNOW the Holy Spirit? Knowing they would be lying to Him? Or just .. lying about keeping some of the money? We forget GOD has not changed. Things like this STILL happen today. Not as fast.

Judas? I truly don't know.. I don't think anyone can. He was sorry.. and to kill your self.. your mind is sick.. as your body gets also. But.. sorry to GOD? I don't know. Be easy for us to answer this today. But then.. well Judas saw things only a GOD can do.. and wow as John said "I dont think there are enough books to hold all He has done". Judas saw all that.. and still turned Him in for money. How did Christ still knowing this treat him? With so much love.. gave him ever choice.. hmm

Praise GOD.. I get no say in anyones life when this is all over. His mercy is forever.