The Holy Bible Teaches Globe Earth.

[A_Thinker]

Here, maybe you can set this guy straight then. He's conducting live streams asking anyone to prove from the scriptures the earth is round and moving. I have to warn you though, he's using the Bible, not the opinions of others concerning their interpretation of the Bible. He should be doing a third live stream tonight.

The Bible says, nowhere, that the earth is flat ... not even metaphorically.

Prove me wrong.

There ... and it didn't take a 2 1/2 hour video ...

 

[SeventyOne]

The Bible says, nowhere, that the earth is flat ... not even metaphorically.

Prove me wrong.

There ... and it didn't take a 2 1/2 hour video ...

Wow, you're just so good. All this from a guy who gets on my case when I point out the people I try to discuss this topic with on other threads don't show even the understanding of the most basic concepts of FE, then he looks at a curve calculator and can't read it properly for observational curve measurements. Incredible. First rate. Kudos.

Join that live stream or don't. Careful though, you might actually learn something on the topic.

 

[A_Thinker]

Wow, you're just so good. All this from a guy who gets on my case when I point out the people I try to discuss this topic with on other threads don't show even the understanding of the most basic concepts of FE, then he looks at a curve calculator and can't read it properly for observational curve measurements. Incredible. First rate. Kudos.

These are all claims ... which you never bother to try to prove.

Rather, your modus operandi is to DISAPPEAR for a time when you're presented with challenging information.

Again, I offer to you the opportunity ... prove to me how I am misreading the curve calculator ...

 

[FEZZILLA]

Here, maybe you can set this guy straight then. He's conducting live streams asking anyone to prove from the scriptures the earth is round and moving. I have to warn you though, he's using the Bible, not the opinions of others concerning their interpretation of the Bible. He should be doing a third live stream tonight.

He's misinterpreting Scripture based on the radical opinions of 21st century apostates. I have gone by the Apostolic Succession which cannot be refuted by any Christian lest that person stray from 2000 years of sound doctrine.

I probably debated that guy before anyway. None of them can win because their heresies have no root in Christianity. The Christian Church has always taught globe earth. That's end of debate right there.

 

[Speedwell]

“And when the seasons, in their circling course,
Winter and summer, spring and autumn, each
Should come, according to well-ordered plan;
Out of a confused heap who didst create
This ordered sphere, and from the shapeless mass
Of matter didst the universe adorn;--
Grant to me life, and be that life well spent,
Thy grace enjoying; let me act and speak
In all things as Thy Holy Scriptures teach”
(Ante-Nicene Christian Library, Vol.1).

And the Holy Scriptures taught Clement about the spherical shape of the earth!

Also, you are not reading the works of Clement of Alexandria. I did not snag this quote from somewhere on the internet. I typed it in from the book. Clement also has a work called Exhortation to the Greeks where Clement refutes the pagan beliefs of the Greeks. Clement of Alexandria was not born a Christian. He was born in Athens and, like all gentiles of this period of history, found Christ. He didn't have to become a Jew first in order to accept Christ either.

You argument against Clement of Alexandria fails on two accounts:

1.) Gentiles were and still are allowed to accept Christ as their Savior (See Isaiah 60:3).

2.) Clement of Rome also read spinning globe from Scripture and he was a close companion of the Apostles; appointed by the Apostle Peter to lead the growing church in Rome; was mentioned favorably by the Apostle Paul in Philippians 4:3, and mentioned by the church fathers after him favorably.

The globular readings of Scripture is how all the ancient Christians and Jews understood the verses discussed. The Christians didn't borrow anything from the Greeks because the entire Old Testament is older than the first recorded Greek thought about the spherical shape of the earth which was 500 B.C.

Here are a few globe earth verses from the Bible from the 4th century Latin Vulgate and the best English translation for each verse.

2000 B.C

Job 26:10,

Latin Vulgate: "terminum circumdedit aquis usque dum finiantur lux et tenebrae."

Word: circumdedit, from H2328 חוּג chûwg

Latin Definition
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...u6Xw5sCqPm6AjCvyh0C9lqu_HvcahSEHNHo2glgTwtYpg

English: "He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end" (Strong's H2328: חוּג chûwg; -- KJV).

Job 37:12,

Latin Vulgate: "quae lustrant per circuitum quocumque eas voluntas gubernantis duxerit ad omne quod praeceperit illis super faciem orbis terrarum"

Word: Orbis, from H8398 תֵּבֵל têbêl

English Definition
Orb definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

Latin Definition
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...TfVc6P3TWfpYKZkRKQan5Q-h4h1CRu06dNzISfm3fFy0o

English "Being turned by his guidance to their doing all that he commanded them upon the face of the habitable globe of the earth" (Strong's H2015 הָפַךְ hâphak, H4524 מֵסַב mêçab, H8398 תֵּבֵל têbêl, H776 אֶרֶץ ʼerets -- 1876 Julia E. Smith Bible).

1000 B.C.,

Psalm 89:11,

Latin Vulgate: "tui sunt caeli et tua est terra orbem terrae et plenitudinem eius tu fundasti"

Word: Orbem, from H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl

LOrb, English Definition
Orb definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

Latin Definition
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...TfVc6P3TWfpYKZkRKQan5Q-h4h1CRu06dNzISfm3fFy0o

English "The heauens are thine, the earth is thine: thou hast layed the foundation of the rounde world, and al that therin is" (Strong's H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl -- 1537 Matthew's Bible).

900 B.C.

Proverbs 8:31,

Latin Vulgate: "ludens in orbe terrarum et deliciae meae esse cum filiis hominum"

Word: Orbe, from H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl

English Definition of Orb
Orb definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

Latin Definition of orb
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...TfVc6P3TWfpYKZkRKQan5Q-h4h1CRu06dNzISfm3fFy0o

Best English Translation: "As for the rounde compase of his worlde, I make it ioyfull: for my delyte is to be among the chyldren of men" (Strong's H8398 תֵּבֵל têbêl -- 1537 Matthew's Bible).

700 B.C.

Isaiah 34:1,

Latin Vulgate: "accedite gentes et audite et populi adtendite audiat terra et plenitudo eius orbis et omne germen eius"

Word: Orbis, from H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl

Orb, Latin Definition
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...TfVc6P3TWfpYKZkRKQan5Q-h4h1CRu06dNzISfm3fFy0o

English: "Come ye Heithen & heare, take hede ye people. Herken thou earth & all that is therin: thou rounde compasse & all that groweth there vpon" (Strong's H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl -- 1537 Matthew's Bible).

Isaiah 40:22,

Latin Vulgate: "qui sedet super gyrum terrae et habitatores eius sunt quasi lucustae qui extendit velut nihilum caelos et expandit eos sicut tabernaculum ad inhabitandum"

Word: Gyrum (aka, Gyrus), from H2329: חוּג chûwg

Latin Definition
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...fuJ5Yqfy56OL3kEEqaB7yygnhV9hqiWyZtVB_Zzi78sJg

English: "It is he that sitteth upon the globe of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as locusts: he that stretcheth out the heavens as nothing, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in" (Strong's H2329: חוּג chûwg, -- Douay Rheims Bible).

600 B.C.

Jeremiah 10:12,

Latin Vulgate: "qui facit terram in fortitudine sua praeparat orbem in sapientia sua et prudentia sua extendit caelos"

Word: Orbem, from H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl

Orb, Latin Definition
Orb definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

English: "But (as for oure God) he made the earth with his power, and with hys wysdom hath he fynished the whole compasse of the worlde, wyth hys discrecion hath he spred oute the heauens" (Strong's H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl -- 1537 Matthew's Bible).

Jeremiah 51:15,

Latin Vulgate: "qui fecit terram in fortitudine sua praeparavit orbem in sapientia sua et prudentia sua extendit caelos"

Word: Orbem, from H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...TfVc6P3TWfpYKZkRKQan5Q-h4h1CRu06dNzISfm3fFy0o

Greek Philosopher Pythagoras, 500 B.C.
___________________________________________________________________
Hebrew Lexicons for H2328 & H2329, חוּג Chuwg

The New Strong’s Expanded Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible,

H2328. חוּג Chuwg, kloog; a prim. root [comp.2287]; to describe a circle:--compass [1x]."

H2329. חוּג Chuwg, khoog; from 2328; a circle:--circle [1x], circuit [1x], compass [1x].".
View attachment 250292

Gesenius' Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon, H2329: "חוּג m. a circle, sphere, used of the arch or vault of the sky, Pro.8:27; Job 22:14; of the world, Isa.40:22."


Chuwg: circle, circuit, compass, sphere.
____________________________________________________________________
Hebrew Lexicons for H8398 תֵּבֵל têbêl,

The New Strong's Exhaustive Expanded Concordance of the Bible. H8398

"8398. têbêl, tay-bale'; from H2986; the earth (as moist and therefore inhabited); by extension, the globe; by implication, its inhabitants; specifically, a particular land, as Babylonia, Palestine:—world [35x] habitable part, [1x].

The word signified, first, the solid material on which man dwells, and that was formed, founded, established, and disposed by God; and secondly, the inhabitants thereof. See TWOT 835h; BDB--385c, 1061d."

Gesenius' Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon
View attachment 250293

Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament.

TWOT 835h תֵּבֵל têbêl, tay-bale'; world.

"This noun is used in three basic situations. First, the noun is employed to represent the global mass called earth, including the atmosphere or heavens (cf. Ps.89:12; II Sam 22:16; et al.). têbêl is often in parallelism or apposition with 'eres (I Sam 2:8; Isa.26:9; 34:1; et al.) when 'eres is used in its broadest sense of "the world." The "world" was created by God, not false gods (Jer.10:12; Ps.93:1) and it belongs solely to him (Ps.24:1). God's eternality is illustrated by his existence before the creation of "world" (Ps.90:2) and his wisdom (perhaps a personification of Christ) was present prior to the world's creation (Prov. 8:26, 31). Creation itself gives a "worldwide" witness to God's glory (Ps.19:4 [H 5]) which should result in Yahweh's praise (Ps.98:2). Yahweh will judge this "world," making it empty (Isa.24:4), though in the millennium God will cause Israel to blossom and fill the whole world with her fruit (Isa.27:6).

Second, têbêl is sometime limited to "countries" or "the inhabitable world." This meaning is more closely related to the root meaning. It refers to the world where crops are raised. This is observed in the judgment message against the king of Babylon (not Satan) for violently shaking the "world" or "inhabitable world" (Isa.13:11; 14:17). Lightning is said to enlighten the "world"---undoubtedly referring to a limited land area (Ps.77:18 [H 19]; 97:4).

Third, têbêl may also refer to the inhabitants living upon the whole earth. This is demonstrated by the parallelism of têbêl with I' umim (Ps.9:8 [H 9]) and 'ammim (Ps.96:13; 98:9). The context of these references is Yahweh's judgment upon the world's inhabitants---a judgment both executed in righteousness and instructive of Yahweh's righteousness (Isa.26:9; 34:1).

In several passages the sense of têbêl as the globular earth in combination with its inhabitants is clearly observed. Everything belongs to Yahweh as his creation (Ps.50:12). Yahweh alone controls this world (Job 34:13; Nah 1:5) and his power is over all the earth which always responds to his presence (Job 37:12; Ps.97:4)".

New International Dictionary of Old Testament Theology & Exegesis, Volume 4:

"9315. têbêl תֵּבֵל Nom. fem., world (#9315).

OT Found 36x exclusively in poetic texts, the word conveys the cosmic or global sense in which 'eres is also sometimes used; i.e., the whole earth or world considered as a single entity. It sometimes occurs in parallelism with 'eres (Jer.10:12; Lam.4:12). Twice it is used together with 'eres, either to express "the whole earth" (Job 37:12), or perhaps in the sense of the inhabited earth (Prov.8:31). It is used frequently in contexts that associate it with Yahweh's creative act and that, as a result, express the stability or durability of the earth (1 Sam.2:8; Ps.89:11 [12]; 93:1; 96:10). It is used when the whole population of the world is referred to (Ps.24:1; 33:8; 98:7; Isa. 18:3; 26:9; Nah.1:5). Isaiah uses têbêl more than any other prophet, mostly in the context of universal judgment (Isaiah 13:11; 24:4; 34:1; cf. Ps.96:13; 98:9).

Land, earth: --> damd (ground, piece of land, soil, realm of the earth, #141); --> 'eres (earth, land, #824); --> têbêl (world, #9315)."
_______________________________________________________________
Summary of Hebrew Lexicons on H8398: תֵּבֵל têbêl,

Strong's: "; by extension, the globe;"

Gesenius': ",the habitable globe,"

TWOT: "First, the noun is employed to represent the global mass called earth" <---AND ---> "In several passages the sense of têbêl as the globular earth in combination with its inhabitants is clearly observed."

New International: "the word conveys the cosmic or global sense in which 'eres is also sometimes used; i.e., the whole earth or world considered as a single entity."
______________________________________________
QUESTION: Why Can't I Find "round world" In My Bible?

ANSWER: The Geneva scholars removed the "round world" verses from the Bible because they thought William Tyndale was too Catholic. The Geneva scholars, while sincere in their intentions, were not as experienced in Hebrew and Greek as William Tyndale, who's 1537 Matthew's Bible is still the most overall accurate English translation of the Bible.
The Anglican Church, under the instructions of Queen Elizabeth I, authorized the 1568 Bishop's Bible. The Bishop's Bible scholars managed to restore some of the lost "round world" verses but by then the Geneva Bible had already gained mainstream acceptance by Puritan Protestants.
In 1611, King James, once again, authorized a new Bible for the church. The KJV scholars, while not as well seasoned in Hebrew and Greek as William Tyndale or Thomas Cranmer, had removed the "round world" verses from the Bible. While there is much positive to be said about the KJV scholars, they followed the Geneva Bible too much, and by doing so lost many globe earth verses which said the earth is a globe. Unfortunately, by this time in history, all the most qualified Hebrew and Greek scholars were executed.
The summary of Lexicons above prove that Tyndale was correct, and removing "round" from "round world" loses the meaning of têbêl, entirely.

Tyndale was correct.

So what's your point? That humans first learned of a spherical Earth from the Bible and not from science?

 

[Speedwell]

He's misinterpreting Scripture based on the radical opinions of 21st century apostates. I have gone by the Apostolic Succession which cannot be refuted by any Christian lest that person stray from 2000 years of sound doctrine.

I probably debated that guy before anyway. None of them can win because their heresies have no root in Christianity. The Christian Church has always taught globe earth. That's end of debate right there.

It may have done, but does the Bible teach it? Do you understand the difference between,

1. It is possible to conclude from the Bible that the biblical authors may have believed in a spherical Earth, and

2. The Bible teaches a spherical Earth.

 

[FEZZILLA]

So what's your point? That humans first learned of a spherical Earth from the Bible and not from science?

My point is simply that the flat earth allegations made towards the Bible are wrong. The Bible teaches globe earth, exclusively. My other point is that the Christians didn't borrow from the Greeks. Christianity began as a Jewish movement in Judea and the knowledge of Scripture was passed on to the Gentiles who also knew Hebrew. The three most common languages spoke in the region of Judea was Latin, Greek, and Hebrew. In fact, in Luke 23:38 says this:

"And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, This Is The King Of The Jews."

 

[FEZZILLA]

It may have done, but does the Bible teach it? Do you understand the difference between,

1. It is possible to conclude from the Bible that the biblical authors may have believed in a spherical Earth, and

2. The Bible teaches a spherical Earth.

This is why we have history. Jewish Historian Josephus isn't going to mess up on basic doctrine, and the shape of the earth in the Bible and words like chuwg & tebel. The early church fathers aren't going to mess it up either. Its not about future prophecy too hard for them to fully comprehend. Its about how to read simple Hebrew words like chuwg and how to understand simple verses like Isaiah 40:22. So any Christian studying this will see the early church fathers on this and be convinced. But atheists will always reject all Christian information, no matter how reputable the source.

 

[Speedwell]

This is why we have history. Jewish Historian Josephus isn't going to mess up on basic doctrine, and the shape of the earth in the Bible and words like chuwg & tebel. The early church fathers aren't going to mess it up either. Its not about future prophecy too hard for them to fully comprehend. Its about how to read simple Hebrew words like chuwg and how to understand simple verses like Isaiah 40:22. So any Christian studying this will see the early church fathers on this and be convinced. But atheists will always reject all Christian information, no matter how reputable the source.

And you seem unable to answer even the simplest question about it.

Do you really think chwug only and unequivocally means sphere? Your lexicons and other sources don't support that claim.

Do you really think that Isaiah's comment about "the circle (or sphere) of the Earth" constitutes a teaching that the Earth is a sphere?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

and what I was taught in school about Columbus discovering the round shape of the earth was not true.

This was and is true. Just because the real believers knew/know from Scripture something, does not mean that people of the world cannot "discover" it.

 

[Speedwell]

This was and is true. Just because the real believers knew/know from Scripture something, does not mean that people of the world cannot "discover" it.

I'm sorry that you were fed such guff in school about Columbus. In fact, the Earth has been known to be a sphere for upwards of two millennia. In the third century BC the Greek mathematician Eratosthenes calculated the diameter of the Earth within 10% of its actual value. The thing with Columbus was that he insisted on doing the calculations for himself and was off by a factor of two, which is why everybody else thought it was too far to go and why he thought he was in Japan when he got to the Bahamas.

 

[FEZZILLA]

And you seem unable to answer even the simplest question about it.

Do you really think chwug only and unequivocally means sphere? Your lexicons and other sources don't support that claim.

Do you really think that Isaiah's comment about "the circle (or sphere) of the Earth" constitutes a teaching that the Earth is a sphere?

Isaiah 40:22, חוּג chûwg

Outline Of Discussion:
Hebrew Masoretic Text
Corpus Of English Translations
A Brief Explanation
Hebrew Lexicons
Bible Commentaries
Chuwg: How It Was Understood By The Ancient Church
________________________________________________________
Hebrew Masoretic Text:

הישׁב על חוג הארץ וישׁביה כחגבים הנוטה כדק שׁמים וימתחם כאהל לשׁבת
________________________________________________________
Corpus Of English Translations:

"Which sittith on the cumpas of erthe, and the dwelleris therof ben as locustis; which stretchith forth heuenes as nouyt, and spredith abrood tho as a tabernacle to dwelle" (1382 Wycliffe Bible).

"That he sytteth vpon the Circle of the worlde, and that all the inhabitours of the worlde are in coparison of him, but as greshoppers: That he spredeth out the heaues as a coueringe, that he stretcheth them out, as. a tent to dwell in" (1535 Coverdale Bible).

"That he sytteth vpon the circle of the worlde, and that al the inhabytours of the worlde are in comparison of him, but as greshoppers: That he spredeth out the heauens as a coueryng, that he stretcheth them out, as a tent to dwell in" (1537 Matthew's Bible)

"that he sytteth vpon the circle of the worlde, and that all the inhabitoures of the worlde are in comparyson of him, but as greshopers. That he spredeth out the heauens as a couerynge, that he stretched them out, as a tent to dwell in" (1539 Great Bible).

"He sitteth vpon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grashoppers, hee stretcheth out ye heauens, as a curtaine, and spreadeth them out, as a tent to dwell in" (1560 Geneva Bible).

"It is he that sitteth vpon the circle of the world, whole inhabiters are [in comparison of him] but as grasshoppers: *he spreadeth out the heauens as a couering, he stretcheth them out as a tent to dwell in" (1568 Bishop's Bible).

"It is he that sitteth upon the globe of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as locusts: he that stretcheth out the heavens as nothing, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in" (Douay-Rheims Bible).

“It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in” (KJV).

"He sitting upon the circle of the earth, and its inhabitants as locusts; he stretching out the heavens as fine cloth, and he will extend them as a tent to dwell in" (1876 Julia E. Smith Bible).

“It is He who sits above the circle of the earth,
And its inhabitants are like grasshoppers,
Who stretches out the heavens like a curtain,
And spreads them out like a tent to dwell in” (NKJV).

“It is He who sits upon the circle of the earth,
and the inhabitants are as grasshoppers,
who stretches out the heavens as a curtain,
and spreads them out as a tent to dwell in” (MEV).

“God sits above the circle of the earth.
The people below seem like grasshoppers to him!
He spreads out the heavens like a curtain
and makes his tent from them” (NLT).

“It is he who sits above the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers;
who stretches out the heavens like a curtain,
and spreads them like a tent to dwell in” (RSV).

“It is he who sits above the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers;
who stretches out the heavens like a curtain,
and spreads them like a tent to dwell in” (ESV).

"God is enthroned above the circle of the earth;
its inhabitants are like grasshoppers.
He stretches out the heavens like thin cloth
and spreads them out like a tent to live in" (HCSB).

"He who is sitting on the circle of the earth, And its inhabitants [are] as grasshoppers, He who is stretching out as a thin thing the heavens, And spreadeth them as a tent to dwell in" (YLT).
_____________________________________________
A Brief Explanation:

The English word “circle” is the Hebrew “Chuwg,” which means to describe a circle, circuit---compass, as in a compassing circle (as in a globe shape, 3D circle).Therefore chuwg (or khug) is used to describe a circle that compasses itself. The English word compass used as a verb means to surround; to encircle; to environ; to stretch round, while encompass (also used as a verb) is to form a circle around; to encircle. As a noun the word compass means a magnetic or electronic device used to determine the cardinal directions (usually magnetic or true north). The flat earth conspiracists reject the four cardinal directions in their flat earth model. Flat earthers reject the reality that the polar regions (North and South) exist.
Chuwg had always meant to be understood as a 3D circle -- a globe, sphere, orb.
Compass vs Encompass - What's the difference?
The earth also looks circular from space.
_____________________________________________
Hebrew Lexicons:

The New Strong’s Expanded Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible,

H2328. חוּג Chuwg, kloog; a prim. root [comp.2287]; to describe a circle:--compass [1x]."

H2329. חוּג Chuwg, khoog; from 2328; a circle:--circle [1x], circuit [1x], compass [1x].".

Gesenius' Hebrew-Chaldee Lexicon, H2329: "חוּג m. a circle, sphere, used of the arch or vault of the sky, Pro.8:27; Job 22:14; of the world, Isa.40:22."
Genesis 1:1 (KJV)

Chuwg: circle, circuit, compass, sphere.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bible Commentaries:

Jamieson, Fausset & Brown: Commentary on the Whole Bible,

“It is he--rather, connected to the last verse, Have ye not known?--have ye not understood Him that sitteth...? (vs.26) [MAUDER]. Circle--applicable to the globular form of the earth, above which, and the vault of the sky around it, above it, He sits. For “upon” translate “above.” as grasshoppers--or locusts in His sight (Num.13:33), as He looks down from on high (Ps.33:13, 14; 113:4-6).”

Matthew Henry's Commentary,

"Now that which is here said of God is (1.) That he has command of all creatures. The heaven and the earth themselves are under his management: He sits upon the circle, or globe, of the earth, v. 22. He that has the special residence of his glory in the upper world maintains a dominion over the lower world, gives law to it, and directs all the motions of it to his own glory. He sits undisturbed upon the earth, and establishes it. He is still stretching out the heavens, his power and providence keep them still stretched out, and will do so till the comes that they shall be rolled together like a scroll. He spreads them out as easily as we draw a curtain to and fro, opening these curtains in the morning and drawing them close again at night. And the heaven is to this earth as a tent to dwell in; it is a canopy drawn over our heads, et quod tegit omnia coelum --- and it encircles all. --Ovid. See Ps.104:2 (2.) That the children of men, even the greatest and mightiest, are as nothing before him. The numerous inhabitants of this earth are in his eye as grasshoppers in ours, so little and inconsiderable, of such small value, of such little use, and so easily crushed. Proud men's lifting up themselves is but like the grasshopper's leap; in an instant they must stoop down to the earth again. If the spies thought themselves as grasshoppers before the sons of Anak (Num.13:33), what are we before the great God? Grasshoppers live but awhile, and live carelessly, not like the ant; so do the most men. (3.) That those who appear and act against him, how formidable soever they may be to their fellow-creatures, will certainly be humble and brought down by the mighty hand of God."

The Bible Knowledge Commentary (1985 Edition)

“God’s sovereign control over the world (40:21-26). 40:21-22. From His sovereign position in heaven God watches over His created universe. You (used four times in v.21) refers to people in general. The force of the first question, for example, is “Doesn’t everyone know this?” (cf. v. 28) The Lord is like a king sitting enthroned above the circle (hug, “horizon,” which is circular; cf. Job 26:10: Prov.8:27) of the earth and over His people who by comparison seem like mere grasshoppers. The heavens (the sky) are pictured as spread out like a tent for Him to live in (cf.Ps.104:2). Isaiah was not presenting a detailed idea of God’s abode. He was merely using imagery that his readers would easily understand.”

Henry Morris Study Bible,

“40:22 circle of the earth. Hebrew khug, translated “compassed” in Job 26:10 and “compass” in Proverbs 8:27. All three, in context, clearly refer to the spherical shape of the earth.
40:22 stretcheth out the heavens. This phrase is possibly a reference to the expanding universe, as envisioned by modern astronomers. There are numerous references in Scripture to the “stretching-out” or “spreading-out” of the heavens (space) when God created the universe. See, for example, Job 9:8; Psalm 104:2; Isaiah 42:5; 44:24; 51:13; Jeremiah 10:12. Alternatively, the “heavens” referred to here may refer simply to the atmospheric heavens, spread out like a curtain or “tent to dwell in” around a circle of the earth. This atmospheric “tent”, refracting and spreading light over the hemisphere, is sharply distinct from the darkness outside.”
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Chuwg: How It Was Understood By The Ancient Church

Here is 4th century Bishop Ambrose giving a reading from Isaiah 40:22.

"And further on: 'Who sitteth upon the globe of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as locusts, who stretcheth out the heavens as an arch?' Who, then, ventures to put his knowledge in the same plane with that of God?” (St.Ambrose, "Hexameron" The Fathers Of The Church series translated by John J. Savage, p.231).

† Jerome's Latin Vulgate,

"qui sedet super gyrum terrae et habitatores eius sunt quasi lucustae qui extendit velut nihilum caelos et expandit eos sicut tabernaculum ad inhabitandum."

The Latin word gyrum (also gyrus) translates as circle/globe/orb in English.
https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/t...8dce02c00388566751dfd448c6814ee23d104cb1.html

The Douay-Rheims Bible is an English translation of Jerome's Latin Vulgate:

"It is he that sitteth upon the globe of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as locusts: he that stretcheth out the heavens as nothing, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in" (Douay-Rheims Bible).

The English "circle" is meant to be understood as a 3D circle as seen from space.

 

[A_Thinker]

The English "circle" is meant to be understood as a 3D circle as seen from space.

This is, so obviously, true.

The mous operandi of flat earthers is to contend that the Bible writers had to write like mathematicians and astrophysicists ...

 

[Tinker Grey]

n/m

 

[Speedwell]

So I give up.

I can't tell if Fezzilla is trying to prove that flat-Earthism is an atheist plot to make biblical Christians look stupid by persuading them that the Bible teaches a flat Earth,

or he is trying to prove that the Bible taught a spherical Earth before science found out about it.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So I give up.
I can't tell if Fezzilla is trying to prove that flat-Earthism is an atheist plot to make biblical Christians look stupid by persuading them that the Bible teaches a flat Earth,
or he is trying to prove that the Bible taught a spherical Earth before science found out about it.

Is it important if a poster , any poster, tries to prove something ?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

How It Was Understood By The Ancient Church

Or "Ekklesia" as they were called for thousands of years -

Scripture clearly reveals what people of faith (and many/most people of the world also) believed for thousands of years also - a globe, a stationary globe.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I'm sorry that you were fed such guff in school about Columbus.

Oh, no worry. I was only replying to someone's own statement about Columbus. I don't remember whatever they taught in school, and don't know what they teach today.

 

[Speedwell]

Is it important if a poster , any poster, tries to prove something ?

Fezzilla has gone to a lot of work assembling his sources for some reason. I would like to know why.

 

[FEZZILLA]

The big problem modern people are having today with Isaiah 40:22 is that all they see is that verse as being the most quoted verse. All the verses containing tebel were mistranslated by the Geneva scholars so there is a dozen or more globe earth verses missing from all our modern translations. Had people gone by Tyndale's renderings over the KJV we would not be having this discussion.

Furthermore, as the English language changed, so also did words like circle lose its poetic meaning. In Old English, the word circle was used to express roundness...like the roundness of a globe. But as we reached the 21st century the use of the word circle to describe a globe became obsolete. Because of this, the word chuwg should be translated to globe in all modern Bibles. Sure, the word translates circle, but that is the old fashioned use of the word which meant globe, which, again, has now become obsolete in 21st century English. So this is a big problem. Our 21st century definition of circle no longer supports the classical usage to express a globe. But chuwg is an ancient Hebrew word, translated into ancient Latin, and also into ancient English---all the while maintaining a globular meaning. But as circle gradually faded into a strict 2D meaning, our English Bibles became outdated. It is not wrong to translate the meaning of a word if the literal rendering is misleading in the sense that the true meaning of the word is lost in translation. A good example is Isaiah 40:22. The word chuwg means globe but translates to circle. But circle in English no longer accommodates the globular meaning, so chuwg is better translated to globe and every serious Bible scholar agrees with this.