Was King David Saved While He Committed His Sins of Adultery and Murder?

[Neogaia777]

I thought about it and do not do it. I do not judge anyone on here saved or not. Never occurs to me.

Good, glad to hear it,

God Bless!

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Dear friend in Christ, What is meant by abiding and living in repentance is the same as abiding and living in Love, Peace Joy and He Himself... they are all one. We do not live in love consistently but we are told to. Just because we fail and sin does not mean we are no longer His anymore than failing implies we are not His and do not love Him. After any use grace as an excuse to justify and keep on sinning they are clearly living outside of Him. We are told to abide and continue in Him and die daily to our selfish ways and sin. We must grow and strive to enter into His way and that is active not passive for our entire walk. The disrespect is in labeling others and being so quick to do so and so quick to know what everyone is meaning.... Seek first to Understand Ask and Love and BE in the Spirit and His Way then you can be more prepared to be used to question correct and rebuke and make sound judgements.

Most people here are pretty good communicatiors of what they think so I do not need to spend a lot of time trying to figure it out. You read my post and were very quick to assume you know what I mean. Did you live up to the standard you set there? I did not detect any Understanding Asking or in Loving or Being in the Spirit and His Way there. And it is the recepient who has the stronger case in determining this although that is not 100% always right if one hits a nerve the recepient does not like.

OTherwise I got the information I was asking about.

 

[DeeR.]

I thought about it and do not do it. I do not judge anyone on here saved or not. Never occurs to me.

I do not believe it is your intention DorothyMae. It is just lacking kindness and gentleness to say one is OSAS and you know that kind and all they believe and it is wrong. You said Llewellyn was saying/meaning things that were not said also. Ask questions in Love to help and understand, not comments that presume. You are loved and are meant to be love first and foremost. Be gentle and humble and it will be evident to all.

 

[DeeR.]

Most people here are pretty good communicatiors of what they think so I do not need to spend a lot of time trying to figure it out. You read my post and were very quick to assume you know what I mean. Did you live up to the standard you set there? I did not detect any Understanding Asking or in Loving or Being in the Spirit and His Way there. And it is the recepient who has the stronger case in determining this although that is not 100% always right if one hits a nerve the recepient does not like.

OTherwise I got the information I was asking about.

It all sounds good my friend, but as I can see you are not open to any of this. I will leave this alone and give you sincere love and peace to be yours.

 

[mark kennedy]

But you know, can anyone be recruicified? I mean how would this be done? It is like asking if any can again have their head chopped off.

I answered this in the second response.

Of course not, that's the whole point. Romans 6:6 says outright Jesus cannot die again. The Hebrews 6:4-6 the issue is different but the principle is the same, to lose salvation and then to have repentance restored would require Christ to be crucified again which is impossible.

Doing a nice job in the thread by the way, you seem to have a goid handle on things.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[DeeR.]

Of course not, that's the whole point. Romans 6:6 says outright Jesus cannot die again. The Hebrews 6:4-6 the issue is different but the principle is the same, to lose salvation and then to have repentance restored would require Christ to be crucified again which is impossible.

Doing a nice job in the thread by the way, you seem to have a goid handle on things.

Grace and peace,
Mark

Very well put

 

[Dorothy Mae]

We are not here for an intellectual discussion but one of the Spirit led by the Spirit not with Human wisdom, understanding or knowledge. It becomes unfair when you label people & judge their motives and meanings & are incorrect. that is not of the Spirit it is legalistic and offensive. You are called by Him to Love and be gentle with much Grace and you are not giving that to others in these comments. I would be glad to praise you if you were humble in all of this.

If you turn your mind off because you are not here for an intellectual discussion (which means the mind is engaged) then you will not be led of the Spirit, at least not the Holy Spirit. IF you think that there are no commonalities in what people believe, people who sat under the same teachers because you do not engage your mind, you will not come to understand people at all.

Now your last sentence is judging and attacking me personally. Do you see that? You want to be led of the Spirit and not judge and then judge me attacking my character. There was no grace and no love at all.

First take the log out of your own eyes before you attempt splinter removal.

 

[mark kennedy]

HEre it is full:or as touching those who were once enlightened and tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the age to come, 6 and [then] fell away, it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Where does this say that Christ cannot be recrucified? I do not see "crucified again" or "recrucified" in that.

What is says is that they subject, not Christ, has crucified to THEMSELVES, not Christ, the Son of God afresh. In fact, it says that Christ is "recruficied" to that person, the opposite of your claim. Do you see that? Christ, according to this verse, is recrucified to that person.

It's just a matter of speaking, repentence is inextricably linked to the death of Christ for our sins. Now that's not to say you can't repent of something, none of us would stand much of a chance. It's saying conversion like the crucifiction was a one time event. Once enlightened to the truth of the gospel, to fall away from the faith is fatal spiritually. Hebrews 10:12 is another related verse specifically stating the death of Christ was a once and for all sacrifice.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Of course not, that's the whole point. Romans 6:6 says outright Jesus cannot die again.

No one can outright die again. That is absurd. Paul was certainly not saying that because no one can die again and again.

The Hebrews 6:4-6 the issue is different but the principle is the same, to lose salvation and then to have repentance restored would require Christ to be crucified again which is impossible.

No it does not. Have you never read where John wrote that if we sin and repent we can be forgiveni? If John believed as you do, he would have told them not to repent because Jesus cannot be again crucified for them.

Doing a nice job in the thread by the way, you seem to have a goid handle on things.

Grace and peace,
Mark

Thanks, you too.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It's just a matter of speaking, repentence is inextricably linked to the death of Christ for our sins. Now that's not to say you can't repent of something, none of us would stand much of a chance. It's saying conversion like the crucifiction was a one time event. Once enlightened to the truth of the gospel, to fall away from the faith is fatal spiritually. Hebrews 10:12 is another related verse specifically stating the death of Christ was a once and for all sacrifice.

I think you are making a link that the Bible does not make nor does experience. It seems that while the start is at a point in time, the converting of a heart in a man goes over much longer time periods. So I do not see that conversion is a one time in the past event, not for those walking with Him. To fall away from the faith is spiritually and eventually physically fatal, true. The death of Christ was once and need not be repeated. Does not mean it was for all men all the time and for all sins in the future. HE died once. Does not mean we repent only once.

 

[mark kennedy]

No one can outright die again. That is absurd. Paul was certainly not saying that because no one can die again and again.

It takes a while to let that one sink in, it's really just that Christ died for our sins once and for all.

No it does not. Have you never read where John wrote that if we sin and repent we can be forgiveni? If John believed as you do, he would have told them not to repent because Jesus cannot be again crucified for them.
Thanks, you too.

Now wait, of course you can repent of a particular sin, we all do on some level. Just the idea that a sin can make you lose salvation is unknown in the New Testamenr. When a person is saved is because they realized God is righteous and we are hopeless sinners beyond hope without grace. That is at conversion where repentance isn't some sin in particular it's sin itself in all it's ugly corruption. Totally surrendered you recieve justification by grace through faith and are baptised into Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit. You are crucified with Christ vicariously. The Holy Spirit then begins the sanctification process not fully complete until you are finally raised bodily in the likeness of Christ.

Of course your going to continue to repent of whatever sin you are brought under conviction for, repentance is a life long struggle. You don't lose your salvation unless you abandon Christ, not the first time you make a mistake.

 

[mark kennedy]

I think you are making a link that the Bible does not make nor does experience. It seems that while the start is at a point in time, the converting of a heart in a man goes over much longer time periods. So I do not see that conversion is a one time in the past event, not for those walking with Him. To fall away from the faith is spiritually and eventually physically fatal, true. The death of Christ was once and need not be repeated. Does not mean it was for all men all the time and for all sins in the future. HE died once. Does not mean we repent only once.

There is a fundamental difference between repentance when you come to Christ and when some particular sin is brought to light. You hear the gospel, believe and recieve the Holy Spirit of promise. Now that does include repentance but in a much broader, even ultimate sense then turning away from our misdeeds.

Don't try to digest all this in one sitting, you'll get it. Paul goes on for three chapters about the struggle of the believer with sin, Romans chapters 6-8 explain this at great length. Keep digging, you'll get there, we are talking about repentance in the ultimate sense and some sin in particular, they are not the same thing.

 

[Neogaia777]

And please DorothyMae do not continue this any more. Let us just end it. It is much appreciated.

Does it hurt you like it hurts me sometimes...?

At least for me, I don't know if they realize the "pain" involved, trying to save them...? (only) By leading them to Christ "in the way that we must" or being how we must, or doing how we must, sometimes with them...? And how we view that as so very unfortunate... And, can't, or isn't, or can't that be exhausting draining, or even hurt sometimes...? Or is that just me...?

God Bless!

 

[DeeR.]

Does it hurt you like it hurts me sometimes...?

At least for me, I don't know if they realize the "pain" involved, trying to save them...? (only) By leading them to Christ "in the way that we must" sometimes, with them...? And how we view that as very unfortunate... And, can't, or isn't, or can't that be exhausting draining, or even hurt sometimes...? Or is that just me...?

God Bless!

As you can see it does hurt. It is not kind or gentle loving or putting another first, so that is not you or me but simply not in the Spirit. God hurts and I feel His hurt in me but he understands us all and rains His Love down continually and tells us to do so to everyone. I myself have known what it is to be upset and act in my own ways regardless of how it hurts others and I know He has forgiven me for it, so I choose to give that as well and Hope it will grow.

 

[redleghunter]

Read English. It plainly states that it is impossible to renew them to repentance SINCE/BECAUSE they are crucifying/shaming Christ. Now just what part of that do you fail to understand? It states nothing at all regarding the atonement. It says what it says. If you choose not to heed it - your choice.

The English is clear. The subjects were going elsewhere for atonement. That’s the subject.

 

[redleghunter]

Why do you even consider the "lead up" when the VERSE ITSELF gives the reason. In doing so, you violate the golden rule of hermeneutics which states, When the meaning of a verses makes plain sense, seek no other sense,

Because verses have context.

 

[Neogaia777]

As you can see it does hurt. It is not kind or gentle loving or putting another first, so that is not you or me but simply not in the Spirit. God hurts and I feel His hurt in me but he understands us all and rains His Love down continually and tells us to do so to everyone. I myself have known what it is to be upset and act in my own ways regardless of how it hurts others and I know He has forgiven me for it, so I choose to give that as well and Hope it will grow.

What I am trying to say also is... I'm not "proud" of it, basically, any of this on here, or when I hurt other people sometimes either justly or unjustly... I think that we all do a bit of both sometimes... But, if I feel it is for their gain...? Or sometimes I might feel it is for their gain...? But then, I sometimes think and just "who am I" anyway, I wonder sometimes, and just wonder if I'm not just losing my cool or my temper sometimes... Anyway, I'm not proud of it though...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

What I am trying to say also is... I'm not "proud" of it, basically, any of this on here, or when I hurt other people sometimes either justly or unjustly... I think that we all do a bit of both sometimes... But, if I feel it is for their gain...? Or sometimes I might feel it is for their gain...? But then, I sometimes think and just "who am I" anyway, I wonder sometimes, and just wonder if I'm not just losing my cool or my temper sometimes... Anyway, I'm not proud of it though...

God Bless!

IOW's all my righteous acts/actions/behavior/deeds, my "works"... I count it all but lost, as refuse, as dirty filthy wasted worthless rags... Most or a lot of the time done in vain, especially in the past, but I'd like to try and change some of that now...

God Bless!

 

[Dorothy Mae]

There is a fundamental difference between repentance when you come to Christ and when some particular sin is brought to light. You hear the gospel, believe and recieve the Holy Spirit of promise. Now that does include repentance but in a much broader, even ultimate sense then turning away from our misdeeds.

Don't try to digest all this in one sitting, you'll get it. Paul goes on for three chapters about the struggle of the believer with sin, Romans chapters 6-8 explain this at great length. Keep digging, you'll get there, we are talking about repentance in the ultimate sense and some sin in particular, they are not the same thing.

Uh, I have been "digesting" this for some 40 years. I think I "got it" pretty well. There is another method to understand the struggle with sin and that is to struggle with sin and overcome by the blood of the lamb.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

IOW's all my righteous acts/actions/behavior/deeds, my "works"... I count it all but lost, as refuse, as dirty filthy wasted worthless rags... Most or a lot of the time done in vain, especially in the past, but I'd like to try and change some of that now...

God Bless!

I can to tell you how. Obey the HOly Spirit in your life. Those are not filthy rags.