Levels of EvC belief

[dad]

I know with a reasonable but not absolute degree of certainty.

Me too, except add a million times the certainty.

 

[Strathos]

Me too, except add a million times the certainty.

The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.

 

[Brightmoon]

Lol

 

[dad]

Correct. His ways are not man's ways.

1 Corinthians 1:31 so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

2 Corinthians 10:17 But HE WHO BOASTS IS TO BOAST IN THE LORD.


Psalm 44:8 In God we have boasted all day long, And we will give thanks to Your name forever. Selah.

Psalm 20:7 Some boast in chariots and some in horses, But we will boast in the name of the LORD, our God.

Romans 15:17 Therefore in Christ Jesus I have found reason for boasting in things pertaining to God.


By the way, believing God created all things is not the way of the fool.

 

[Strathos]

Correct. His ways are not man's ways.

1 Corinthians 1:31 so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."

2 Corinthians 10:17 But HE WHO BOASTS IS TO BOAST IN THE LORD.


Psalm 44:8 In God we have boasted all day long, And we will give thanks to Your name forever. Selah.

Psalm 20:7 Some boast in chariots and some in horses, But we will boast in the name of the LORD, our God.

Romans 15:17 Therefore in Christ Jesus I have found reason for boasting in things pertaining to God.


By the way, believing God created all things is not the way of the fool.

No, but believing in a mysterious 'changed state' that somehow presents the consistent illusion of billions of years of false history across multiple converging lines of evidence is pretty foolish if you ask me.

 

[dad]

No, but believing in a mysterious 'changed state' that somehow presents the consistent illusion of billions of years of false history across multiple converging lines of evidence is pretty foolish if you ask me.

Your circular, religious 'multiple lines of evidence' is really a multiple conflation of beliefs. The great time is total religion also.

The fact that the future and heaven, and even the far past in the bible are different than the nature we live in today is undeniable. The fact science doesn't know either way is crystal clear. What is left for you then? It seems alluding to the religious myths of stuck in the mud science is about all that remains?

 

[Strathos]

Your circular, religious 'multiple lines of evidence' is really a multiple conflation of beliefs. The great time is total religion also.

The fact that the future and heaven, and even the far past in the bible are different than the nature we live in today is undeniable. The fact science doesn't know either way is crystal clear. What is left for you then? It seems alluding to the religious myths of stuck in the mud science is about all that remains?

God is not the author of confusion and would not plant false history to deceive us. You are the one who is inventing new ideas about space and time out of whole cloth.

 

[RealityCheck01]

It s based on the belief that the past was the same in that there was still radioactive decay actually.

14 May 2018 dad: A lie that there is only a belief in past radioactivity.

For others:
Radiocarbon dating is checked against other methods of dating (historical records, tree rings, etc.). Different radiometric methods are used to check each other. Luminescence dating can be used to check radiometric dating. There is the simple fact that layers of rock have older layers with depth as confirmed by the fossils they contain and radiometric dating shows that the lower layers are older. Also see Natural nuclear fission reactor.

 

[RealityCheck01]

The different former nature allowed fast fast deposition.

14 May 2018 dad: Give your evidence that there the "different former nature allowed fast fast deposition".

Stating that time just goes faster would be delusional because the Sun exists ! The Sun has a rate of energy release that heats the Earth to a habitable temperature. Double the rate by making time faster and the Earth doubles in temperature and life vanishes.

Also remember that we have radiometric dates of meteorites, etc. of 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years and that radioactivity releases heat. Release that heat a million time faster and you have to show that the surface of the Earth does not turn into lava.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Nope. Only now in this nature is it one per year. Your religion is showing.

14 May 2018 dad: Deep ignorance about seasons and a "religion is showing" lie.
It is during summer that dust is deposited in snow and compacted into those 55,000 dark layers we see by eye in ice cores. Summer happens once a year.
The dust includes volcanic dust from historical recorded volcanic eruptions. The dust includes volcanic dust from volcanic eruptions dated by other methods. The ice cores include gas bubbles and pollen that show variations in climate.

 

[dad]

For others:
Radiocarbon dating is checked against other methods of dating (historical records, tree rings, etc.).

It is checked against nothing except same state past belief based items of faith.

Tree rings? If trees grew in weeks the rings did not obliviously represent years in that different nature past. Historical records? How about the records where spirits ruled Egypt and lived with men, and Sumer life spans were recorded as being many many centuries? History records are in my back pocket.

Different radiometric methods are used to check each other.

Only when each is first subjected to rigorous adherence to your same state past religion. Belief based and circular. 100%

Luminescence dating can be used to check radiometric dating.

"The burial age is calculated as a ratio of the equivalent dose (total energy accumulated during burial) and the dose rate (energy per year delivered by radioactive decay): Age (yr) = Equivalent dose (Gy)/Dose rate (Gy/year)"

What is Luminescence Dating?



So let's get this straight, you use the assumption of a same state past with it's radioactive decay to 'check' radioactive decay dates!!!!? Ha. That is't even funny it it so ridiculously circular and religious.

There is the simple fact that layers of rock have older layers with depth as confirmed by the fossils they contain and radiometric dating shows that the lower layers are older.

Of course older layers would generally be...well, older. You kidding? You thought that helped you? The thing is...how much older?

Also see Natural nuclear fission reactor.

I like that fable. Especially the part where, for no apparent reason, and with no evidence...the sites of the reactors were dunked miles under just at the right time. Then, eons later, for some strange reason, they all resurfaced, so the same state past reactions could complete!!!! What a farce.

 

[dad]

It is during summer that dust is deposited in snow and compacted into those 55,000 dark layers we see by eye in ice cores. Summer happens once a year.
The dust includes volcanic dust from historical recorded volcanic eruptions. The dust includes volcanic dust from volcanic eruptions dated by other methods. The ice cores include gas bubbles and pollen that show variations in climate.

Yes it IS now during summer that we get a certain dark layer. So let me guess, you believe that all seemingly dark layers had to have gotten there in this present nature and in summer!? Ha.

 

[dad]

Stating that time just goes faster would be delusional because the Sun exists ! The Sun has a rate of energy release that heats the Earth to a habitable temperature. Double the rate by making time faster and the Earth doubles in temperature and life vanishes.

Wrong. We do not double anything. By the way, what has the sun to do with layer deposition exactly? Be clear on your beliefs.

Also remember that we have radiometric dates of meteorites, etc. of 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years and that radioactivity releases heat.

Wrong.
We have isotopes in meteors that you assume all got there in this nature. So you religiously assign dates based on this belief...and only this belief, and nothing else.

Release that heat a million time faster and you have to show that the surface of the Earth does not turn into lava.

If there was no radiation, then where did the heat come from? I think what we actually have is a pattern of isotopes that you think all got there in this nature with our forces and laws.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Yes it IS now during summer that we get a certain dark layer....

15 May 2018 dad: A fantasy that summer only happens now !
We know that summers happened in the past, e.g. through historical records. It would be insane to think that the Earth stopped orbiting the Sun. It would be a bit less insane to think that Earth's inclination changed to eliminate seasons. So reasonable people know that summers have occurred every year. Summers are hot ! Heat produces dust. That dust makes dark layers in ice. Thus 1 dark layer per year and we see 55,0000 layers by eye and lots more unsnag instruments (700,000 is the record from memory).

Read the Bible. There is no mention of no summers or many summers per year.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Wrong. We do not double anything....

15 May 2018 dad: How a fantasy of time changing to make layer deposition faster is deluded.

Your fantasy is that time magically changed rate in the past. That has physical consequences such as the Sun's energy output changing. Double the rate of time to make the rate of layer deposition twice as fast and the Sun gets twice as hot. That should kill life on Earth.

But it is much worse than that for young earth creationists. Condensing millions of years of sedimentary rock deposition into a few thousand years gives a Sun that is thousands of times hotter !

Ditto for the heat released from radioactivity where increasing the rate of radioactivity might turn the surface of the Earth into lava. That lava is also sterilized by the actual radiation!

 

[RealityCheck01]

...So you religiously assign dates based on this belief...and only this belief, and nothing else.

15 May 2018 dad: A "religiously assign dates" lie about radiometric dates of meteorites.
The radiometric dates are scientific calculations.

 

[RealityCheck01]

...If there was no radiation,

15 May 2018 dad: An unsupported fantasy of no radiation at all in the past?
We observe that radioactive materials are radioactive and there is no evidence that this changed in the past.

15 May 2018 dad: How a fantasy of time changing to make layer deposition faster is deluded.

 

[RealityCheck01]

It is checked against nothing except same state past belief based items of faith....

15 May 2018 dad: An "items of faith", etc. lies.
Science is not based on faith. Science is based on evidence.

15 May 2018 dad: A delusion of trees growing in weeks producing tree rings.
Tree rings are caused by seasonal changes. A tree that became full grown (and then died) in weeks would have no rings.

15 May 2018 dad: Some "Historical records? " gibberish.
Historical records exist . Some historical records record the dates when living entities became non-living, e.g. when people were buried, when trees were cut down. Radiocarbon dating those samples can be compared to the historical records.

 

[RealityCheck01]

....I like that fable.

15 May 2018 dad: A couple of lies about the Oklo natural nuclear fission reactor.

The natural nuclear reactor formed when a uranium-rich mineral deposit became inundated with groundwater that acted as a neutron moderator, and a nuclear chain reaction took place. The heat generated from the nuclear fission caused the groundwater to boil away, which slowed or stopped the reaction. After cooling of the mineral deposit, the water returned and the reaction restarted, completing a full cycle every 3 hours. The fission reaction cycles continued for hundreds of thousands of years and ended when the ever-decreasing fissile materials no longer could sustain a chain reaction.

It is a real natural nuclear reactor. The rest is basically a lie because the source of the water moderating the reaction is as above.

The Oklo reactor thread from 2015 has a "There is not proof of such a magic elevator ride that I have yet seen" lie about the irrelevant movement of the uranium deposits.

Natural Nuclear Reaction Powered Ancient Geyser (2004) had the ending comment

He explained that, after the fission process had finished, a geological shift caused the Oklo reactor to sink a few miles below the surface - where it was preserved from erosion. A few million years ago, another shift brought the uranium deposits back to the surface.

Other posts at Disemboweling Oklo from 2011.

So that makes:
15 May 2018 dad: 7 years of total failure of showing that the Oslo natural nuclear reactor was not a natural nuclear reactor.
Repeating the deep ignorance that science has to "proven" does not debunk the Oslo natural nuclear reactor.
Demands that we do the work he should have done does not debunk the Oslo natural nuclear reactor.

 

[dad]

[QUOTE="RealityCheck01, post: 72664706, member: 317334"
Science is not based on faith. Science is based on evidence.[/quote]

Not origin sciences. That is 100% faith and faith alone.