The Church's Problem with Singleness

[$pirit]

Because the married leadership did not fare well durning their own single years, or were not even believers themselves then.

So all they have are the tired old legalistic ideas that never worked in the first place.

Good point.

 

[Dave-W]

Good point

And it actually makes me angry on behalf of all my single brothers and sisters.

Believe me, I pray for you guys frequently.

 

[Dave-W]

And it actually makes me angry on behalf of all my single brothers and sisters.

Believe me, I pray for you guys frequently.

IS there anything I could say that you singles would want to hear - any message you would want your congregational leaders, your married friends, your denominational powers-that-be to hear?

 

[$pirit]

Thanks for asking. This may be a tough one, but I would like to hear a message about the gift of singleness vs. the lonlines of it. Everyone’s experience is different and some truly are content. Others were probably content for a season and now they’re not. Like we mentioned before, most of the time when the church brings up singleness they try to shame singles into not wanting a partner by assuming everyone is “gifted” to remain this way. Or by assuming they don’t struggle with sexual desire. So maybe a series on it about comparing the two and how each person should pray based on their situation.

 

[Dave-W]

Thanks for asking. This may be a tough one, but I would like to hear a message about the gift of singleness vs. the lonlines of it. Everyone’s experience is different and some truly are content. Others were probably content for a season and now they’re not. Like we mentioned before, most of the time when the church brings up singleness they try to shame singles into not wanting a partner by assuming everyone is “gifted” to remain this way. Or by assuming they don’t struggle with sexual desire. So maybe a series on it about comparing the two and how each person should pray based on their situation.

Ok. That sounds practical. Let me think on it some.

Where should I start that thread?

BTW, I especially appreciated your use of the word "assuming." It carries a double reason why it is false.

1. It is the same thing as presumption, which is a false version of faith.
2. We used to say in my design engineer days "Do you know how to spell assume?"

 

[$pirit]

I’m still pretty new to this site, so I’m not sure where the best place to start it is.

 

[Dave-W]

This is just something that's been really bothering me lately regarding a so-called "gift of singleness." I understand that there a plenty of people who are happy being single, but a great many more are not. They would like to be married (including myself) yet most churches are doing little to nothing to help them along with that. If man was designed to be content in God alone, Eve would not have been necessary.

HisPrincess, do you concur with $pirit on what we need to address? As the OP, do you want that discussion here in this thread?

 

[Dave-W]

I will post this much here as it directly answers issues in the OP.

THERE IS NO "GIFT OF SINGLENESS."

There is a gift of celibacy, which is different. Celibacy is a permanent state, a life-long gift and choice. That gift was first mentioned by our Lord:

Matt 19:9
And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
10 The disciples *said to Him, “If the relationship of the man with his wife is like this, it is better not to marry.” 11 But He said to them, “Not all men can accept this statement, but only those to whom it has been given. 12 For there are eunuchs who were born that way from their mother’s womb; and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men; and there are also eunuchs who made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to accept this, let him accept it.”​

Note the bolded phrase. It indicates a gift that is rather rare. The Greek word for "given" indicates a normal gift. Also note it is immediately linked to being a eunuch. That is a man who has had his male-ness removed and is not capable of normal marital functions or procreating. That is permanent and irreversible. And such a person was prevented from entering the Temple to worship God. (Deut 23:1)

Now let us note what Paul said:

1 Cor 7:2
But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband. 3 The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband. 4 The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does; and likewise also the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. 5 Stop depriving one another, except by agreement for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer, and come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 6 But this I say by way of concession, not of command. 7 Yet I wish that all men were even as I myself am. However, each man has his own gift from God, one in this manner, and another in that.​

Again note the bolded phrase. Paul uses a different word for "gift" here. It is charisma, the same word he uses a few chapters later to describe prophecy, healing, miracles. It is a gift of Grace from the Holy Spirit. And Paul says EVERYONE has this gift, grace from the Holy Spirit, one way or the other. Putting these statements together, we see everyone has a gift as to their marital status and it is empowered by the Holy Spirit; but most have the gift of marriage and NOT the gift of celibacy. Indeed, celibacy should be rare.

And that means that probably 90% (my guess) of us have the OTHER gift - that we need to be married. So we fall into the same category that God put Adam in at creation: "It is not good for the man to be alone." (Gen 2:18)

Churches need to start believing the scripture that it is NOT GOOD to be alone. They often REFUSE to recognize the intense loneliness, the longing to hold (and be held by) someone; and what kind of psychological damage can be done by that, as well as the spiritual damage done as people try to make up their own coping mechanisms (which are by definition a work of the flesh).

 

[Dave-W]

Because the married leadership did not fare well during their own single years, or were not even believers themselves then.

So all they have are the tired old legalistic ideas that never worked in the first place.

I wrote that in post #20. It brings up a point about discipleship that UMJC Rabbi Dan Juster once pointed out: That the practice of discipleship faded away centuries ago and no one today has a clue of how it is actually done.

Discipleship means you have been trained in what to do and you in turn train others.

But how many church leaders had a successful Christian singlehood where they REDEMPTIVELY handled the intense loneliness and hornyness until they got married; without putting up fleshly coping mechanisms? Probably zero.

 

[Rivga]

Proceeding through marriage just to aid against sexual temptation? That is hardly going to last and we cannot just marry any old body..

It is an interesting point,

When I was in Uni, A friend of mine asked me to help him with some statistical analysis. He wanted a second pair of eyes on the data, 1 because I have a talent for statistics and 2 because he is himself religious he did not want to look at the data just through his own view point of the world.

He had been provided with a load of data about religion and ethnic background and divorce rate.
An a obvious pattern emerged, as you looked through the religion and the different views on divorce the expected correlation came out. The more the religion dislike, the lower the divorce rate.

We took a second set of statistics and it largely followed the same pattern, with the exception of the Non-religious. Even as an atheist it was not what I'd expect, so we started to look at other research that exists and it again confirmed this pattern.

The data we had was restrictive and as younger students we did not managed to draw any concrete reasoning to why this maybe.

A quick internet search again confirms this - This time not the UK (which I first became aware of the pattern) but US figures from the religious tolerance website.

Variation in divorce rates by religion:
Religion % have been divorced
Jews 30%
Born-again Christians 27%
Other Christians 24%
Atheists, Agnostics 21%

It is a pattern seen in most places when there is no stigma/punishment for divorce.

I'd guess that pre-martial sex, and age of marriage being linked and then divorce rates to follow from that. I'd guess the non-religious ae more likely to have pre-marital sexual relations.
Although my personal experience coming from a family split between Christianity, Atheists and a few Muslims that they where all as equally pro pre-martial sex, the split was more about age than anything else.

 

[Rivga]

If you responded to those lustfull desires by masturbting, you were considered demonically possessed.

Seriously?

When I was in school I had 2 weeks of sharing a room with my Cousin, and the only way we both survived was plenty of very cold showers and hanging a picture of the Queen up in our bedroom.
We both noted that we become a lot more aggressive by the end of the two weeks.

 

[Dave-W]

Seriously?

Yes. They sent morality police around a few times a year to check up on you, and ask a lot of hard questions. If you admitted to the big M, you were referred to the Elder board for discipline and exorcism.

the only way we both survived was plenty of very cold showers and hanging a picture of the Queen up in our bedroom.

LOL!!!

We both noted that we become a lot more aggressive by the end of the two weeks.

I wonder why ... ... ???

 

[Rivga]

Now I’m nearly 30 with no prospects to speak of. The “gift of singleness” doesn’t always feel like a gift. Sometimes it feels like a prison.

Full disclosure I am obviously an atheist, male and come form a background and place where I could only be single out of choice. I say all this to highlight that it is hard for me to know how you are feeling as I have little personal experience, but this does not mean that I don't have empathy and I can clearly feel pain behind the post.

I do have a few questions,
1) I assume that there is about equal male:female population in your congress or society ? Are all the males partnered off?

2) Are all the people calling Singleness a gift, male and/or partnered off themselves?

3) Do you feel your religion is holding you back, for instance if you lost your faith now, do you think it would be easier/harder to find a partner - or is it just that it is failing to provide confit/answers to this issue? or both?

 

[FireDragon76]

It just annoys me that American christianity is bemoaning the state of marriage yet aren't doing much about it. The fact is, marriage has always been a given in every society. This is probably the only time in history where it has not been, and we're already paying the consequences.

In the past some people did not marry till later in life. It's a myth everybody settled down immediately into marriage. Some people never married because they could never find someone they wanted to marry.

Perhaps the issue is that some Christians focus too much on sexual temptation and not a more holistic view of sin.

If you really want to marry, you need to work on knowing yourself and knowing what you can live with and what you can't. Emotional intelligence is important to relationships. It's not specifically a religious quest and religious communities cannot always help you there because many of the leadership are emotionally immature themselves in many churches. And alot of religious teachings can even hurt your chances in dating and relationships because they are too fear and purity based.

 

[Dave-W]

When I get married, I don’t want to forget what it was like for me. No one should be ashamed or embarrassed about it.

I totally agree.

I hate that "don't make an idol out of it." It is a judgement and an automatic assumption of sinful behavior.

Instead, church leadership should provide avenues for singles to meet, encourage relationships, etc. "It is not good for the man [or woman] to be alone" is just as true today as it was in Genesis.

 

[Dave-W]

2) Are all the people calling Singleness a gift, male and/or partnered off themselves?

Almost all are, yes.

 

[Dave-W]

In the past some people did not marry till later in life.

Late 2nd temple period (NT times)? Most were married in their early teens.

And alot of religious teachings can even hurt your chances in dating and relationships because they are too fear and purity based.

All too true, sadly.

The fear and purity angles of that are usually based on pure legalism.

Matthew 23:4
They tie up heavy burdens and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.​

 

[$pirit]

Full disclosure I am obviously an atheist, male and come form a background and place where I could only be single out of choice. I say all this to highlight that it is hard for me to know how you are feeling as I have little personal experience, but this does not mean that I don't have empathy and I can clearly feel pain behind the post.

I do have a few questions,
1) I assume that there is about equal male:female population in your congress or society ? Are all the males partnered off?

2) Are all the people calling Singleness a gift, male and/or partnered off themselves?

3) Do you feel your religion is holding you back, for instance if you lost your faith now, do you think it would be easier/harder to find a partner - or is it just that it is failing to provide confit/answers to this issue? or both?

1. All the men within my Christian circles have been partnered off or too old. I am not looking for men outside of the church. I know couples who met their partners while one was a Christian and the other wasn’t, then became one after. As of now, I haven’t been led in that direction. Not saying it can’t happen.

2. Most people call it that. I mostly hear it from married women. I’ve actually seen my pastor set up a couple people successfully. He’s the only one who encourages it as far as I know.

3. My faith has held me back from the wrong relationships, which I’m grateful for. If I lost my faith now, it would be harder for me to discern things. God can see into people’s hearts and knows their intentions. I defintiely NEED him in my search for a mate. I’m just frustrated that the process is taking this long and the lack of support from some Christians.

 

[Rivga]

Yes. They sent morality police around a few times a year to check up on you, and ask a lot of hard questions. If you admitted to the big M, you were referred to the Elder board for discipline and exorcism.

Wow that comes firmly under the definition of a Cult, I wish they had that where I grow up, only to see what the hell they'd have done to someone like one of my Older Cousins, lets call him Paul.

The family was at a Christening and the Catholic Priest had joined us for the party afterwards.
They somehow got onto the subject of a girl cousin dating, and the Priest was giving it out about what she should and should not do, Paul put his arm around her and clearly stated:

"You should not take advice off this man, he's never been in a relationship in his life"
and
"If you need any advice about this stuff you should come to an expert" with the word export he thumbed at himself and then to make matters worse he gave the Catholic priest the wink and a gun.

We should put this in context Paul was 16, and had had one sexual encounter at this point. He got himself into so much trouble, and it was a good job he still had his girl friend at that point as he needed to move in with her for 3 weeks until his very Catholic mother calmed down.

As ill advised as his actions was, and as rude as it was he made a fair point.

The above moral police would have just shot him, I imagine.

 

[FireDragon76]

Late 2nd temple period (NT times)? Most were married in their early teens.

I was thinking of the middle ages in Europe. And I'm not talking about monasticism. The same struggles people have today existed back then. Not nearly as widespread but they were not unheard of.

Though it doesn't fit our idealized image, quite a few Protestants did not marry back in the day, for the same reasons people don't now days. They had difficulty with relationships or just couldn't find anybody they liked to settle down with. Especially as the cultures became more individualistic in the 19th century, this tendency only increased.