Why no evidence FOR creation/ID?

[Speedwell]

No Sir, that's not what I asked. You all assert that the universe and earth and life on earth happened randomly and by chance, so I asked if this is a fair statement.

Does matter + Energy + Entropy (randomness) = Life?

That oversimplifies the situation almost to the point of unintelligiblilty, but you would be more correct to say, matter + energy + decreasing entropy = life.

The other problem is that I don't know exactly what you mean by "randomly and by chance."

 

[tas8831]

How about you answering my question? You guys haven't answered it, and I'm beginning to find that a bit odd...
That's not all I have, lol.

What question was that?

Did you ever pick 1 of Wyatt's claims and defend like I asked you a few days ago?

Beginning to find that a bit odd...

 

[gaara4158]

Ok, then let's begin here...

Entropy isn’t exactly randomness, but in any case, your equation isn’t specific enough to be considered true or false, nor do we know enough about the origin of life to say if there was anything else involved, so... your equation isn’t meaningful. It’s like asking if ingredients plus heat equals KFC’s famous chicken. Could you pose your question another way?

 

[Ophiolite]

No Sir, that's not what I asked. You all assert that the universe and earth and life on earth happened randomly and by chance, so I asked if this is a fair statement.

If any of my fellow evolutionists have asserted that then they can meet me outside the bar, jackets and glasses off, zimmer frames to the side, in ten minutes.

The formation of stars and galaxies was a direct and inevitable consequence of the fundamental constants, four forces and overall character of spacetime. The particular way these developed was a matter of chance.

The origin of life was determined by the abundance and concentration of elements necessary for organic life, whose properties, abundance and concentration were determined by the aforementioned "laws of nature". Chance influenced when and how (and perhaps how often) this occured.

The evolution of life has a random element (mutation and whether that bus hit your or missed you) and a non-random one: natural selection.

 

[Divide]

That oversimplifies the situation almost to the point of unintelligiblilty, but you would be more correct to say, matter + energy + decreasing entropy = life.

The other problem is that I don't know exactly what you mean by "randomly and by chance."

Whaaat?! The assertion being made in this thread is that The universe and life did not happen by a designer (God), and that it happened randomly, by first there was a big Bang and then the planets came from that, and then abiogenesis brought life forth on earth and that evolved into mankind. Is this your position?

Let's establish your exact position, and then we can get to your detailed somewhat answer to my question.

 

[Speedwell]

Whaaat?! The assertion being made in this thread is that The universe and life did not happen by a designer (God),

No, it is not. The assertion being made in this thread is that it happened as science is finding out, whether God was involved with it or not.

 

[Divide]

What question was that?

Did you ever pick 1 of Wyatt's claims and defend like I asked you a few days ago?

Beginning to find that a bit odd...

We're past that and back to topic now. It's established that you don't believe anything about Wyatt, so let's on to something more constructive. I'm not going to answer anything about Wyatt anymore.

 

[Divide]

Entropy isn’t exactly randomness, but in any case, your equation isn’t specific enough to be considered true or false, nor do we know enough about the origin of life to say if there was anything else involved, so... your equation isn’t meaningful. It’s like asking if ingredients plus heat equals KFC’s famous chicken. Could you pose your question another way?

Well how about chance? Another poster said something about not entropy but chance. SO how about

Matter + Energy + Chance = Life...Is that a fair statement for your position?

 

[Divide]

No, it is not. The assertion being made in this thread is that it happened as science is finding out, whether God was involved with it or not.

Well, geez. That's about all they've been doing is taking me to task for talking God and evolution is bunk because I supposedly can not prove God.

So what's your position.

You guys are getting vague on me now, lol.

Either you guys believe in something or you don't, and you can back it up with facts or you can't...

 

[Speedwell]

Well how about chance? Another poster said something about not entropy but chance. SO how about

Matter + Energy + Chance = Life...Is that a fair statement for your position?

No. Life may well be an inevitable emergent property of the universe, in accord with the natural laws which govern it.

 

[Divide]

I'm trying to establish a foundation here. A base from which to proceed into a discussion....Little help?

 

[Speedwell]

Well, geez. That's about all they've been doing is taking me to task for talking God and evolution is bunk because I supposedly can not prove God.

So what's your position.

You guys are getting vague on me now, lol.

Either you guys believe in something or you don't, and you can back it up with facts or you can't...

You're just not paying attention. Of course you can't prove God. The existence of God is an unfalsifiable proposition.

 

[Divide]

No. Life may well be an inevitable emergent property of the universe, in accord with the natural laws which govern it.

Ok. I tell ya' what. How about if you give me 5 sentences, to summarize what is it your position, if it is not one which includes God, as a designer/creator. Fair enough?

 

[Divide]

You're just not paying attention. Of course you can't prove God. The existence of God is an unfalsifiable proposition.

Oh it is not. I can do it and you're being difficult to make it hard for me. Because you're not sure what I'm about to hit you with, lol

 

[Speedwell]

Oh it is not. I can do it and you're being difficult to make it hard for me. Because you're not sure what I'm about to hit you with, lol

Bring it on.

 

[Divide]

Entropy isn’t exactly randomness, but in any case, your equation isn’t specific enough to be considered true or false, nor do we know enough about the origin of life to say if there was anything else involved, so... your equation isn’t meaningful. It’s like asking if ingredients plus heat equals KFC’s famous chicken. Could you pose your question another way?

So in other words...you don't even know what you believe?
How about 5 sentences from you that summarizes your beliefs on the origin of life?

 

[Divide]

Bring it on.

Ok brother, let's do it. Let's start with 5 sentences from you like I asked for a foundational base?

You set 'em up, and I'll knock 'em down, lol.

 

[Divide]

There's plenty of evidence. God knew that the world would be in this shape so He left it possible to prove it in these days.

 

[Speedwell]

There's plenty of evidence. God knew that the world would be in this shape so He left it possible to prove it in these days.

So prove it. Don't be so coy. I believe in God and His authorship of the universe already, and believe that can only be known through faith, not science, but I would be interested to see what you've got.

 

[Divide]

So prove it. Don't be so coy. I believe in God and His authorship of the universe already, and believe that can only be known through faith, not science, but I would be interested to see what you've got.

Well what do you believe? that God created the world Himself?
That it happened by chance?
What?