New Jerusalem?
- Thread starter Markwsmith2020
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Where is it now?
Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
How is it contrasted it to Mount Sinai?
Heb 12:18 For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
Heb 12:19 And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
Heb 12:20 (For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:
Heb 12:21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
When does Peter say it will come here?
Peter was looking for the New Heavens and the New Earth on the day of the Lord, when He comes as a thief. Therefore, it is a Second Coming event.
I am looking for the same thing.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
Rev_3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
I have been to many funeral services where the preacher talked about Christ going to prepare a place for us.
He built us a new house out of two pieces of wood and a handful of nails.
It is our final destination, instead of this rotten, sin-cursed world.
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No it is here now, and has been for 2000 years, it is the church the kingdom of God the new and eternal covenant!
Matthew 6:33
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
How can you seek something that does not exist?
Matt 3:1
In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
And the best verse if all!
Gal 4:26 But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother.
How can she be our mother if she does not exist?
Matthew 6:33
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
How can you seek something that does not exist?
Matt 3:1
In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
And the best verse if all!
Gal 4:26 But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother.
How can she be our mother if she does not exist?
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Christ exists in heaven now and so does the New Jerusalem.
You seem to be headed down the road of Full-Preterism.
If you are, please know that many here consider it to be a heretical doctrine.
I would be one of them.
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All I gave was the Bible, you can put it in any category you like, but only the church (apostles) have authority to declare something heretical
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Your statement found below did not come from the Bible, based on the following scripture.
"How can she be our mother if she does not exist?"
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Heb 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
Rev_3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
Rev_21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
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Thank you those scriptures prove my point, the new Jerusalem is the church the bride of Christ! Our Mother!
Rev_21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
How can John say this if it did not actually happen? It is the church founded by Jesus Christ on Peter and the Apostles!
One, Holy, Catholic (universal) and apostolic!
Rev_21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
How can John say this if it did not actually happen? It is the church founded by Jesus Christ on Peter and the Apostles!
One, Holy, Catholic (universal) and apostolic!
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How can Jeremiah state that a New Covenant was to come in Jeremiah 31:31-34, hundreds of years before Christ revealed that He would bring in this New Covenant in Matthew 26:28?
John was given a prophecy about things to happen in the future.
In Galatians 4:26 Paul said New Jerusalem is above.
Are you going to tell us that New Jerusalem came down in 70 AD?
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Where does the Bible say it is a prophecy?
Rev 1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
Must shortly come to pass!
The time is at hand!
Rev 1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
Must shortly come to pass!
The time is at hand!
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The things written to the seven first century churches did apply during their time.
When do you think the New Heavens and the New Earth that Peter was looking for came to fruition?
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January, 3019.
We will be looking out of it from a window seat as it lands on earth.
It should be quite the sight.
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If you are not joking...
Thus you are predicting that Jesus will return on the Earth to establish His 1,000 years reign with His Saints [Revelation 20:4-6] in January 2019 ...is that right ?
Revelation 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] the souls of them that had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus, and for the word of God, and such as worshipped not the beast, neither his image, and received not the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand; and they lived, and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 The rest of the dead lived not until the thousand years should be finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: over these the second death hath no power; but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
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+319
3019
Jesus will return
We all return together in New Jerusalem, after the thousand years are finished.
"And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
“Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb.”
And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, having the glory of God, its radiance like a most rare jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal.
“Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb.”
And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, having the glory of God, its radiance like a most rare jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal.
Dave Likes This.
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Revelation 20:4-6 tell us who are those that will be part of the 1,000 years reign..none of them have been raptured to Heaven while they were alive....ooops!
+319
3019
Jesus will returnon the Earthto establish His 1,000 years reign with His Saints.
We all return together in New Jerusalem, after the thousand years are finished.
"And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
“Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb.”
And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, having the glory of God, its radiance like a most rare jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal.
Dave Likes This.
Revelation 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] THE SOULS of them that had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus, and for the word of God, and such as worshipped not the beast, neither his image, and received not the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand; and they lived, and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 The rest of the dead lived not until the thousand years should be finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: over these the second death hath no power; but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
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I can't figure out what you are talking about, wait, I remember, you think that the 6th seal is the START of the tribulation.
"The fig tree sheds its winter fruit when shaken by a gale.
At the end of the tribulation, we are out of here. Anyone else that missed the boat is in serious trouble here. You don't have to go Home, but you can't stay here. There's only going to be two kinds of people at the end of the tribulation, those who have refused the "mark", and those who have taken it. The sheep are taken into the air, and the grapes that remain are harvested into the wine press.
That's all she wrote.
I'm sorry Riberra.
Whenever you've got the time, I would recommend this seminar. If you can't tolerate the whole 47 minutes, watch or listen up until the first 16 minutes where he deals with the events at the 7th trumpet. I can't see how you could argue with the logic.
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In Fact You can't figure out what is clearly written in Revelation 20:4-6 ...about the 1,000 years Reign of Jesus ...
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You crack me up Riberra. You, BaBs and Keras will go at it like this for weeks. It reminds me of slapstick comedy, like the Three Stooges and Keystone Cops. I should hold my hand up between my eyes as a guide or protector for when the attempt comes to poke them out.
This is a reference to the end of the tribulation and the start of the literal thousand years. It doesn't say that it's going to be on earth.
You might not have to go Home, but you can't stay here.
You are doing the same thing that everyone before you has done. You are assuming that the events in the OT eschatology will take place during a thousand years on earth. This comes from mixing the OT end time prophecies with the Daniel/Revelation story.
We were given 70 weeks to, among other things, seal both the vision and the prophet. During the Babylonian exile God had three prophets in operation at the same time: Daniel, Ezekiel and Jeremiah. But these three prophets were being given two different end time schematics. Though technically Daniel is an OT book, it really is a sealed relative to Revelation's story and doesn't mix well with the OT end time scenario. With the exception of Daniel, is there any OT mention of a second coming?
The original plan was for the Jews to accept their Messiah, then Jesus would have began the Kingdom of God on earth right away because it really was "at hand" at that time. A second coming would not have been required. John the Baptist would not have died the way that he did, "lest I come and strike the land with a decree of utter destruction". Jesus would have sent disciples out from Jerusalem to invite anyone who wanted to be saved to come and live there in the 1st century. Jerusalem would have eventually grown to such a huge population that it's walls could no longer contain it.
Then, after some time, Lucifer in the guise of Gog Magog would attempt to attack the unwalled Holy City but Jesus would destroy him and his army where they stood and we would spend the next seven years burying them and burning their wooden weapons. And the wolf would lay down with the lamb and we could watch an infant stick his hand into a viper's den while we built Ezekiel's Temple.
But now instead, Paul gets knocked off his horse, the NT and Revelation gets written, Daniel gets unsealed for the final generation, we get an end time Babylon, Antichrist, mark of the beast, two witnesses of 144,000, Jesus makes His Second Visitation and we have a brand New Jerusalem with an end time variation on Gog Magog.
Does this describe how the crucifixion occurred?:
Him Whom They Have Pierced
“And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn. On that day the mourning in Jerusalem will be as great as the mourning for Hadad-rimmon in the plain of Megiddo. The land shall mourn, each family by itself: the family of the house of David by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Nathan by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Levi by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the Shimeites by itself, and their wives by themselves; and all the families that are left, each by itself, and their wives by themselves.
Or is this describing the original method of how Jesus would have been sacrificed in the Temple by the Priest if humanity had not turned Him over to the enemy?
It's looking to me like everything that has taken place in the world since 1535 has been so that Israel would become a nation again in 1948. The Ottoman empire, WW1, WW2, 1948 and all the trees. But the one and the only reason for all this to happen was so that Israel could capture Jerusalem and then in 1969 create a reason for the Knesset to make an official decree to "restore and build Jerusalem".
"Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks.
This was written 2600 years ago and at that time there may not have been a second coming required. The Jews might have cooperated and accepted their Messiah in the first century. Jesus would have come one time only and never ascended back to heaven, making a second coming unnecessary. Daniel 9 had to be written in such a way to include both the primary visitation of Jesus AND the possibility of a secondary visitation in a compact and simultaneous fashion.
"Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes,
[there will be seven 'sevens,'] and [sixty-two 'sevens.']
[there will be seven 'sevens,'] and [sixty-two 'sevens.']
Primary Visitation [and] Secondary Visitation
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