Neo-Darwinian evolution is in trouble INSIDE the scientific community

[Ronald]

"The TOE implies that nature has a mind, intelligence to select beneficial mutations over time, sort them out and choosing one."
That's a misunderstanding; nothing about natural selection requires a mind.

"The organism would die of the thousands of harmless and deadly mutations before it got a chance to choose a good one (if it could)."
That's a misunderstanding. Harmless mutations don't cause an organism to die. Most deleterious mutations don't cause an organism to die, either; they just make organisms less likely to survive and reproduce. Natural selection can easily be observed to produce adaptive evolution from beneficial mutations, and to weed out deleterious mutations. We can observe it happening in the lab and in the wild -- and you tell us it can't happen? Yeah, that's a pretty big misunderstanding.


From God. What the heck does that have to do with evolution?

Order requires an organizer. Design requires a Designer. All organisms have a unique design with a genetic code and this did not come about by mindless natural causes -- impossible. You want to attribute an incredibly complex process that contains vast amounts of information to nature (the environment and organisms themselves) that by itself, develops into beautiful and intelligent beings or even cute puppy dogs by an unintelligent, unknowledgeable blind force. At least be honest, this process has to be able to decipher genetic codes, build proteins and amino acids, duplicate cells and create new ones that form into tissues, bones and organs and complex systems simultaneously and all of this without intelligent guidance or knowledge? "Oh ... just happens like a fire eats up a forest". No, that's mindless. Water flowing is mindless. But hey, nice try Darwin. After 160 yeas only 9% believe in your theory. Of course you did manage to confuse almost half of the Christians in to believe in some theistic evolution. At least the Devil won't get them for that. But the others will join you.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Order requires an organizer. Design requires a Designer. All organisms have a unique design with a genetic code and this did not come about by mindless natural causes -- impossible. You want to attribute an incredibly complex process that contains vast amounts of information to nature (the environment and organisms themselves) that by itself, develops into beautiful and intelligent beings or even cute puppy dogs by an unintelligent, unknowledgeable blind force. At least be honest, this process has to be able to decipher genetic codes, build proteins and amino acids, duplicate cells and create new ones that form into tissues, bones and organs and complex systems simultaneously and all of this without intelligent guidance or knowledge? "Oh ... just happens like a fire eats up a forest". No, that's mindless. Water flowing is mindless. But hey, nice try Darwin. After 160 yeas only 9% believe in your theory. Of course you did manage to confuse almost half of the Christians in to believe in some theistic evolution. At least the Devil won't get them for that. But the others will join you.

What are you talking about? Worldwide most Christians accept the fact of evolution. Even in the U.S. the number is over 40%. And no "organizer" is necessary to make a snowflake. Or a quartz crystal.


Once again, you are trying to fight the theory with a lack of knowledge. You can't win that way.

 

[Ronald]

Ahhh, so everyone here only has a few months before the end of things? Got it.

Well, if I have to miss the in-house chemist conference here at work no harm-no foul. It's down in California and it'll be hot there even in a few months.

No, the very possibly the beginning of the end of the world as we know it. It won't be too difficult to recognize. Of course if an asteroid(s), a super-volcanic eruption(s), nuclear war, etc. occurs, you won't attribute it to Judgment Day, you'll just blame nature or man. But then if you see Jesus return and "every eye will see Him", then you will know.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No, the very possibly the beginning of the end of the world as we know it. It won't be too difficult to recognize. Of course if an asteroid(s), a super-volcanic eruption(s), nuclear war, etc. occurs, you won't attribute it to Judgment Day, you'll just blame nature or man. But then if you see Jesus return and "every eye will see Him", then you will know.

You do realize that every Christian that has ever made such a prediction has been shown to be wrong, don't you?

 

[sfs]

Order requires an organizer.

Stuff and nonsense. Fine, you don't know biology, but are you also unaware of physics and chemistry? Order arises all the time in all kinds of ways without an organizer. Where are you getting these ideas from?

 

[majj27]

Have you heard of LOGOS?
"In the beginning was the WORD and WORD was with God and the WORD was God ... Through Him all things were made; without Him nothing was made. In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in darkness, but the darkness has not understood it." John 1:1-4
"God said, let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground." Gen. 1:26
If you seek God, you will find Him. If you argue against His existence, you will not.

Here's something you can jot down, a prophetic scripture written about 1922 years ago, Rev. 12:1. It is positioned right in the middle of what the Bible calls the Great Tribulation Period/Judgment Day. This is a period of time with the most devastating catastrophic events occurring ever before that will destroy 2/3 of the population. This scripture describes a constellation that will appear on 9-23-17. It is Virgo, clothed by the sun, with the moon at her feet and a crown of 12 stars around her head. It's a rare occurrence that hasn't happened since the birth of Christ. The Wise Men followed a star ... you know the story. Well it most likely was the planet Jupiter, call the King planet, that moves into Virgo's womb, moves around for about 9 months then exists down through her legs. You see, symbolically the woman is Israel and the child is Jesus in scripture but literally it is a sign in the heavens. The Bible uses the sun, moon and stars for not only days, months and years but also for signs. (Gen. 1:14)
So 9-23-17 falls within the Feast of the Trumpets, a Jewish holiday that ends on the Day of Atonement. Maybe this will be the evidence ya'll need ... of course it might be too late?

Nah, there's no reason to think that Virgo is what is meant by "a woman in the sky". It looks like this:

...and that sure doesn't look like any woman I've ever known. If you take Revelation literally, it says nothing about "stars in the vague sort of shape of a woman" it says "woman". Besides, if 9/23/17 is halfway through this Tribulation time, it's been an awfully laid-back sort of catastrophic thing, as far as these sort of things go.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Besides, if 9/23/17 is halfway through this Tribulation time, it's been an awfully laid-back sort of catastrophic thing, as far as these sort of things go.

Perhaps Trump's impeachment

 

[Ronald]

What are you talking about? Worldwide most Christians accept the fact of evolution. Even in the U.S. the number is over 40%. And no "organizer" is necessary to make a snowflake. Or a quartz crystal.


Once again, you are trying to fight the theory with a lack of knowledge. You can't win that way.

Wow, there you go again. You guys will bring up fire, a snow flake or a crystal and say this doesn't take an intelligent Designer. Please, you can't compare these things to living organisms. The fact that no two snowflakes are alike is kind of unique though. The beauty in creation is fascinating and also evidence for design. Why beauty? Why are living things esthetically pleasing and very desirable? God also designed you with an empty compartment that only He can fill. People try to fill this missing piece in their lives with everything from fancy cars, education, jobs, money, people, drugs or alcohol but they never can. Only God can satisfy. You will not be satisfied with your life, something will be missing.

 

[Obliquinaut]

No, the very possibly the beginning of the end of the world as we know it. It won't be too difficult to recognize. Of course if an asteroid(s), a super-volcanic eruption(s), nuclear war, etc. occurs, you won't attribute it to Judgment Day, you'll just blame nature or man. But then if you see Jesus return and "every eye will see Him", then you will know.

OK. (You are right about the nuclear war. I'd definitely blame that on man. Asteroids and super-volcanoes I'd blame on nature. So Jesus is going to have to step in so that we may see him. Ecce Homo. I'm not going to change my schedule in the meantime, though. I've personally lived through more than one ends of the world and so far I still have to go into work the next day.)

I just got back from Crater Lake. It's pretty neat! A gigantic volcano that erupted and collapsed and resulted in an event 100X larger than Mt. St. Helens! It's really some neat geology to see. You can actually hike down into the caldera and you can see the various layers from different flows that occured in Mt. Mazama before the giant collapse about 7,700 years ago. (And there were actually native Americans in the area who may have witnessed it! Some of their oral traditions match up with some of the stuff we know from geology!)

 

[Obliquinaut]

No, the very possibly the beginning of the end of the world as we know it. It won't be too difficult to recognize. Of course if an asteroid(s), a super-volcanic eruption(s), nuclear war, etc. occurs, you won't attribute it to Judgment Day, you'll just blame nature or man. But then if you see Jesus return and "every eye will see Him", then you will know.

Hey, did YOU write this book?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004PLNH8C/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

 

[majj27]

No, the very possibly the beginning of the end of the world as we know it. It won't be too difficult to recognize. Of course if an asteroid(s), a super-volcanic eruption(s), nuclear war, etc. occurs, you won't attribute it to Judgment Day, you'll just blame nature or man. But then if you see Jesus return and "every eye will see Him", then you will know.

So if 9/17 passes by and nothing happens, what then?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Wow, there you go again. You guys will bring up fire, a snow flake or a crystal and say this doesn't take an intelligent Designer. Please, you can't compare these things to living organisms. The fact that no two snowflakes are alike is kind of unique though. The beauty in creation is fascinating and also evidence for design. Why beauty? Why are living things esthetically pleasing and very desirable? God also designed you with an empty compartment that only He can fill. People try to fill this missing piece in their lives with everything from fancy cars, education, jobs, money, people, drugs or alcohol but they never can. Only God can satisfy. You will not be satisfied with your life, something will be missing.

Please, you made the comment that demonstrated your lack of knowledge. Don't complain when a simple example shows that you are wrong.

And there is no "evidence of design". But then you do not understand the nature of evidence. Most creationists don't. They can't afford to learn what is and what is not evidence.

You still have plenty of time to learn.

 

[Obliquinaut]

Wow, there you go again. You guys will bring up fire, a snow flake or a crystal and say this doesn't take an intelligent Designer. Please, you can't compare these things to living organisms. The fact that no two snowflakes are alike is kind of unique though.

The point about crystals is that, like the chemicals in living organisms, the atoms follow very set rules of which will react with which and the ultimate form is dictated by straightforward chemical rules.

Just like DNA and RNA. The chemistry that causes these things to function as they do is based on the shape of the molecules and hydrogen bonding. Chemical affinity provides structure.

The beauty in creation is fascinating and also evidence for design. Why beauty? Why are living things esthetically pleasing and very desirable?

Behold the beauty of nature!

God also designed you with an empty compartment that only He can fill.

I looked for Him for a LONG time but that compartment never seemed to be filled.

People try to fill this missing piece in their lives with everything from fancy cars, education, jobs, money, people, drugs or alcohol but they never can.

Well, I mean...

You will not be satisfied with your life, something will be missing.

Well, if I had that Lambo at least I could distract myself while missing the key pieces. Vrooom Vrooom.

 

[Obliquinaut]

So if 9/17 passes by and nothing happens, what then?

Is that Ronald's prediction?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Is that Ronald's prediction?

It seems to be. He has been a bit coy and the preview of his book did not seem to even hint at that date.

Not the best of sellers. No reviews as yet.

ETA: Nice find by the way.

 

[Ronald]

You do realize that every Christian that has ever made such a prediction has been shown to be wrong, don't you?

Yes. But I don't make predictions, the Bible does.
We just interpret them correctly, read the signs or err.
The major sign: "And this gospel of the kingdom will preached to the entire world as a testimony to all nations and then the end will come" Matt. 24:14, has recently just been accomplished and never before in any other generation could they claim this.
Israel becoming a nation in 1948 is another prophetic sign of the final generation that cannot be attributed to any other time either.(see Ezek. 37:21; Zeph. 2:1-3; Jer. 16:15)
According to King David, one generation is 70 years.(Psalm 90:10) Add that to 1948.
With the Middle East on fire with ISIS, North Korea and Iran gearing up for war, Russia exercising their muscles with Ukraine and testing European countries and the stress this country is facing with division and massive debt, I'd say we are at the precipice and Judgment Day is on the horizon. If nothing happens, fine I will resign from posting and admit I was wrong -- give me just a few months though, I've been anticipating this for twenty years.

 

[Ronald]

Its nocturnal movement would be very similar to the Sun's movement. The stars can only tell us which way is north and a very rough latitude.

No, the planets revolve around the sun and then the sun revolves around the galaxy and the galaxy around the universe. So Jupiter moves more than the sun.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes. But I don't make predictions, the Bible does.

Sorry, that is what others have claimed too. If you put a date or even a time limit of any sort out there, you made a prediction.

We just interpret them correctly, read the signs or err.
The major sign: "And this gospel of the kingdom will preached to the entire world as a testimony to all nations and then the end will come" Matt. 24:14, has recently just been accomplished and never before in any other generation could they claim this.
Israel becoming a nation in 1948 is another prophetic sign of the final generation that cannot be attributed to any other time either.(see Ezek. 37:21; Zeph. 2:1-3; Jer. 16:15)
According to King David, one generation is 70 years.(Psalm 90:10) Add that to 1948.

Sorry, you have conflated a "generation" with the average lifespan of a man. A generation is the average time from birth to reproduction. Or about 25.5 years:

How long is a generation? Science provides an answer - ISOGG Wiki

How does that affect your interpretation?

With the Middle East on fire with ISIS, North Korea and Iran gearing up for war, Russia exercising their muscles with Ukraine and testing European countries and the stress this country is facing with division and massive debt, I'd say we are at the precipice and Judgment Day is on the horizon. If nothing happens, fine I will resign from posting and admit I was wrong -- give me just a few months though, I've been anticipating this for twenty years.

Will you promise to try to learn, since you will obviously have some more time on your hands when that happens? As you see if you were relying on a 70 year generation your prophesy has already faied.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No, the planets evolve around the sun and then the sun evolves around the galaxy and the galaxy around the universe. So Jupiter moves more than the sun.

You mean revolve. And yes, it moves more than the Sun, but not noticeably It takes years to shift positions and you had what days? weeks? months? Night to night its movement is very similar to the Sun's during the day.

 

[Ronald]

So if 9/17 passes by and nothing happens, what then?

9-23-17 but let's give it to Oct 1, since Sept. 30 is the Day of Atonement. If nothing starts by then, then my daughter will be married on Oct. 4th and I will celebrate for more than her marriage. I will be pleased if I don't see the wrath of God in my lifetime and pleased if I was wrong - thank you very much. I will also be 62 in November so would like to also enjoy a decade or so of retirement. Oh, I will openly apologize for being misleading and wrong about my interpretations.