Were the Disciples more informed than us today?

[I'm_Sorry]

Take demons for example.

The disciples seem more equipped than we are today?

e.g.

"And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting." Mark 9:29

What is "this kind"?

 

[timewerx]

It is an entity that manifests both spiritually and physically.

The prayer is to defeat the spiritual aspect and the fasting is to defeat the physical aspect.

Fasting is form of disinfection, in this case, disinfecting the body.

The disciples definitely knew more because they had Jesus to explain stuff to them. What I have is a process of trial and error, see which one works.

 

[I'm_Sorry]

It is an entity that manifests both spiritually and physically.

The prayer is to defeat the spiritual aspect and the fasting is to defeat the physical aspect.

Fasting is form of disinfection, in this case, disinfecting the body.

The disciples definitely knew more because they had Jesus to explain stuff to them. What I have is a process of trial and error, see which one works.

Does that mean "this kind" was to be cast out by the person oppressed through their own prayer and fasting.

Jesus delivered Him immediately.

And the spirit cried and he were as if dead.

 

[I'm_Sorry]

How do we identify "this kind" from another "kind"?

 

[Serving Zion]

Take demons for example.

The disciples seem more equipped than we are today?

e.g.

"And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting." Mark 9:29

What is "this kind"?

That is a defiant one. The fasting is more of the sort described in Isaiah 58:5-10, Matthew 6:16-18, Matthew 5:38-39, Romans 12:20-21 and the prayer is to connect with God in the moment, for wisdom and instruction about how to act and what to say. When they have exhausted attempting to provoke you to sin and you have not fallen from grace (James 4:6-7), The Holy Spirit will have healed them and freed them through your ministry - where you have been a vessel of The Holy Spirit without blemish, and He has acted as The Wonderful Counsellor through your representation.

Yes, this knowledge has been overshadowed by myriads of false teachings (John 10:10, John 12:35, 2 Peter 2:1-2, Daniel 9:26).

 

[I'm_Sorry]

That is a defiant one. The fasting is more of the sort described in Isaiah 58:5-10, Matthew 6:16-18, Matthew 5:38, Romans 12:20-21 and the prayer is to connect with God in the moment, for wisdom and instruction about how to act and what to say. When they have exhausted attempting to provoke you to sin and you have not fallen from grace (James 4:6-7), The Holy Spirit will have healed them and freed them through your ministry - where you have been a vessel of The Holy Spirit without blemish, and He has acted as The Wonderful Counsellor through your representation.

Yes, this knowledge has been overshadowed by myriads of false teachings (John 10:10, John 12:35, 2 Peter 2:1-2, Daniel 9:26).

Hi Brother,

Couple of questions.

1) defiant? what do you mean?
2) Can you elaborate on the false teaching.


IF I understand you correctly true fasting and prayer of the unblemished can cast that "kind" out?

How do we identify the kind?

E.g. Is it an anti-social personality or a schizophrenic?

Definitions have changed by behavioural studies of what use to be called "spirits"

 

[stuart lawrence]

Take demons for example.

The disciples seem more equipped than we are today?

e.g.

"And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting." Mark 9:29

What is "this kind"?

Some Christians believe they are more informed than were the Apostles who wrote the New Testament!

There is academic head knowledge and spirit filled truth. The two are very different. The Apostles were much blessed with the latter.

 

[SeventyOne]

Paul told the church at Ephesus to recall that Jesus said that it is more blessed to give than to receive (Acts 20:35). That's not found in the gospels, meaning both Paul and those in Ephesus had knowledge of words of Jesus that we do not.

 

[I'm_Sorry]

Paul told the church at Ephesus to recall that Jesus said that it is more blessed to give than to receive (Acts 20:35). That's not found in the gospels, meaning both Paul and those in Ephesus had knowledge of words of Jesus that we do not.

The word of Christ managed to came through Paul and into our hands in the bible.

But why not demonology?

The different kinds and how to identify them.

E.g. See this, its a cow. Then see here, its a lion. They are different kinds of animal.

An animal was created by God, you can read it in Genesis.

A demon on the other hand, we don't have such knowledge yet the disciples did.

 

[Another Lazarus]

For this kind we need to search the history of demons be4 the great inundation, God called them evil spirits that dwell on earth.
The Book of Enoch: The Book of Enoch: Chapter XV
8. And now, the giants, who are produced from the spirits and flesh, shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, and on the earth shall be their dwelling. 9. Evil spirits have proceeded from their bodies; because they are born from men, ⌈⌈and⌉⌉ from the holy Watchers is their beginning and primal origin; ⌈they shall be evil spirits on earth, and⌉ evil spirits shall they be called. [10. As for the spirits of heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their dwelling.]

 

[Serving Zion]

Hi Brother,

Hey bro! nice to see you thriving and in good spirit

Couple of questions.

1) defiant? what do you mean?

It does not depart at a command.

2) Can you elaborate on the false teaching.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:3, St. Paul has determined that the early church could maintain it's dominance amidst the vastness of false teachers. Other writings mention the same struggle (eg 2 Peter 2:1-3, Jude 1:4, Philippians 2:21): that basically, many shallow-rooted (Matthew 13:6) converts had found a successful talent or charisma to teach Christianity, but did not have the strength or stamina to really do the will of The Father (Matthew 7:21). They had fallen to the temptations of self ambition (Jude 1:8) and had become persecutors of the saints (2 Timothy 4:14-15, John 16:2-3).

IF I understand you correctly true fasting and prayer of the unblemished can cast that "kind" out?

It drives them out, because the only grip it has on the host, is the host's non-repentance. Why does somebody yield themselves to sin rather than to love? Maybe it is distrust, resentment, selfish desire. These are all spells of the mind that are rooted in beliefs, which our words of love are able to free them from, if we can lead them to recognise and receive the truth. Our fasting is required in these cases, so that the devil does not have an opportunity against us through any sort of offence we might trigger - regardless if we are within our rights (hence the term "fasting"). (Ephesians 4:27, Matthew 10:16).

How do we identify the kind?

These ones are defiant.

E.g. Is it an anti-social personality or a schizophrenic?

Definitions have changed by behavioural studies of what use to be called "spirits"

It is impossible to serve two masters. Those terminologies are given either by experts who refuse to yield gracefully to The Holy Spirit's dominion, or by lukewarm Christians in their ignorance.

 

[Serving Zion]

The word of Christ managed to came through Paul and into our hands in the bible.

But why not demonology?

Luke 8:10, 1 Corinthians 2:7-8.

 

[I'm_Sorry]

It does not depart at a command.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:3, St. Paul has determined that the early church could maintain it's dominance amidst the vastness of false teachers. Other writings mention the same struggle (eg 2 Peter 2:1-3, Jude 1:4, Philippians 2:21): that basically, many shallow-rooted (Matthew 13:6) converts had found a successful talent or charisma to teach Christianity, but did not have the strength or stamina to really do the will of The Father (Matthew 7:21). They had fallen to the temptations of self ambition (Jude 1:8) and had become persecutors of the saints (2 Timothy 4:14-15, John 16:2-3).

It drives them out, because the only grip it has on the host, is the host's non-repentance. Why does somebody yield themselves to sin rather than to love? Maybe it is distrust, resentment, selfish desire. These are all spells of the mind that are rooted in beliefs, which our words of love are able to free them from, if we can lead them to recognise and receive the truth. Our fasting is required in these cases, so that the devil does not have an opportunity against us through any sort of offence we might trigger - regardless if we are within our rights (hence the term "fasting"). (Ephesians 4:27, Matthew 10:16)..

Ok understood, so much preparation of us the faithful must be undergone (if it's God's will) to cast "this kind"

These ones are defiant..

In other words they don't "come out" under the Authority of Christ through a blemished believer at their position in their walk?

My question, could the least in the kingdom cast out the defiant? or is that impossible?

It is impossible to serve two masters. Those terminologies are given either by experts who refuse to yield gracefully to The Holy Spirit's dominion, or by lukewarm Christians in their ignorance.

I'm referring to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders which is studies of behavioural traits in humans.

We can use the term OCD or PTSD and most will understand what it means through the description of behaviour.

So my point is that what science calls a psychopath could be the biblical term for reprobate.

The diagnosis exists in common categories through all the behavioural studies

 

[I'm_Sorry]

Luke 8:10, 1 Corinthians 2:7-8.

So its a mystery for a reason?

demonology. One we cant understand but must accept in faith?

 

[I'm_Sorry]

For this kind we need to search the history of demons be4 the great inundation, God called them evil spirits that dwell on earth.
The Book of Enoch: The Book of Enoch: Chapter XV
8. And now, the giants, who are produced from the spirits and flesh, shall be called evil spirits upon the earth, and on the earth shall be their dwelling. 9. Evil spirits have proceeded from their bodies; because they are born from men, ⌈⌈and⌉⌉ from the holy Watchers is their beginning and primal origin; ⌈they shall be evil spirits on earth, and⌉ evil spirits shall they be called. [10. As for the spirits of heaven, in heaven shall be their dwelling, but as for the spirits of the earth which were born upon the earth, on the earth shall be their dwelling.]

I understand what Enoch wrote concerning them, but its not scripture.

I seek similar information in the Biblical cannon.

To minimise confusion.

 

[Serving Zion]

Ok understood, so much preparation of us the faithful must be undergone (if it's God's will) to cast "this kind"

In other words they don't "come out" under the Authority of Christ through a blemished believer at their position in their walk?

Our "blemishes" indeed may give an opportunity for the devil. Such as for instance, I overlooked your greeting where you said "Hi bro!", and that gave you an impression that my response was a bit harsh. It is nice that you remembered me, and I remembered you too. (I'm Sorry bro, please bear with me.. I did edit it just moments too late!)

Pay attention to that though: Love is not easily offended

My question, could the least in the kingdom cast out the defiant? or is that impossible?

In what sense do you mean to say that someone is a lesser one in the kingdom? Is there a verse you have in mind here?

I'm referring to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders which is studies of behavioural traits in humans.

We can use the term OCD or PTSD and most will understand what it means through the description of behaviour.

So my point is that what science calls a psychopath could be the biblical term for reprobate.

The diagnosis exists in common categories through all the behavioural studies

I understand that psychiatry is considered to be an alternative treatment method for controlling psychological conditions, whereas counselling is a method of treatment toward cure that in the hands of an expert, is very effective to achieve reversal. In fact, the sort of exorcism we are discussing can be well understood as a form of counselling - but operating under the jurisdiction of God's power.

So between psychiatry and Christianity there is an automatic conflict of interest.

So its a mystery for a reason?

demonology. One we cant understand but must accept in faith?

It is more that knowledge in careless hands can be destructive (Matthew 11:25), and whatever knowledge we manifest into the world is then existing in the world, whereas this knowledge does belong to God.

Do pay attention to the contest over your own spirit though, because I have actually not withheld from you what you have asked for (Matthew 7:7).

 

[I'm_Sorry]

Our "blemishes" indeed may give an opportunity for the devil. Such as for instance, I overlooked your greeting where you said "Hi bro!", and that gave you an impression that my response was a bit harsh. It is nice that you remembered me, and I remembered you too. (I'm Sorry bro, please bear with me.. I did edit it just moments too late!)

Pay attention to that though: Love is not easily offended

Ok got that, it makes for some tough work with the Lord to help those oppressed by the defiant spirit.

If its His will.

I'm sure He'd prepare those He calls for such a task.

Oh and its all good brother, but I didn't realise it was you until you liked my status then. Oh! now I get it

In what sense do you mean to say that someone is a lesser one in the kingdom? Is there a verse you have in mind here?
.

Matthew 5:19

I was inferring to having a blemish therefor no authority in Christ to cast the "defiant kind"

So between psychiatry and Christianity there is an automatic conflict of interest.

I agree, one denies God. However the "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders " does describe human behaviour well, I feel we just need to attach an "evil spirit" to some of the common "kinds" of behaviours.

It is more that knowledge in careless hands can be destructive (Matthew 11:25), and whatever knowledge we manifest into the world is then existing in the world, whereas this knowledge does belong to God.

Do pay attention to the contest over your own spirit though, because I have actually not withheld from you what you have asked for (Matthew 7:7).

I understand your point.

I'm happy to leave it to God as a matter of trust in Faith.

I'd prefer to distance myself from it "demonology" as it just boggles my mind having read Enoch 15

Your opinion on Book of Enoch Chapter 15?

 

[Serving Zion]

Ok got that, it makes for some tough work with the Lord to help those oppressed by the defiant spirit.

If its His will.

I'm sure He'd prepare those He calls for such a task.

Oh and its all good brother, but I didn't realise it was you until you liked my status then. Oh! now I get it

Thanks! .. Great to see you again

Matthew 5:19

I was inferring to having a blemish therefor no authority in Christ to cast the "defiant kind"

That's interesting. I'll have to think about that.

I agree, one denies God. However the "Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders " does describe human behaviour well, I feel we just need to attach an "evil spirit" to some of the common "kinds" of behaviours.

Each to his own, I reckon.

I understand your point.

I'm happy to leave it to God as a matter of trust in Faith.

I'd prefer to distance myself from it "demonology" as it just boggles my mind having read Enoch 15

Wise decision! (James 4:8)

Your opinion on Book of Enoch Chapter 15?

That is a demonic spirit, not The Holy Spirit. 2 Corinthians 11:14, 1 John 4:1.

 

[I'm_Sorry]

Thanks! .. Great to see you again

That's interesting. I'll have to think about that.

Each to his own, I reckon.

Wise decision! (James 4:8)

That is an angelic spirit, not The Holy Spirit. 1 John 4:1.

Thanks brother

You've been of great help here!

Appreciate your work in Jesus.

Thank you, I feel some peace about it all.

 

[Another Lazarus]

I understand what Enoch wrote concerning them, but its not scripture.

Please dont hesitate, even Apostle Jude has quoted the book of enoch :
Jude 1:14 Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied about them: "See, the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones

Please note Peter also learned from the book of Enoch :
2 Peter 2:4 4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment.

This is the only Book revealing what happened in the world be4 the Inundation, more precious than gold.

The evil spirit that dwell on earth came from those giants which haunted places and cause victims.