Is Freedom of Religion next?

[Genersis]

Eh. I doubt Trump will do much.

Maybe criticise the Pope and certain folk in the Church, and maybe very rarely, the Church as a whole when it comes to certain issues; but in the end he needs the votes of Catholics.

So he's only going to criticise the Church in ways that the majority of Republican voting Catholics would agree with. So that would be on immigration for sure, maybe labor laws and social safety nets also.

I very much doubt Trump would take any action against the Church. But if he did, it would be on an issue Catholic voters generally agree with him on over the Church.

 

[Genersis]

It's good that you know these are possibilities, but I would recommend against worrying about it until see evidence of things heading that way.

Keep your worries proportionate, if that makes sense.
If you can obviously; it can be difficult to fend off worries.

 

[Martinius]

But wait... it gets better. Check out this little gem tweeted by his vice president in December 2015.

View attachment 188943

Yes, Pence has sold out so he could be VP, and probably President in the near future. Too bad, but that is the world of politics. Paul Ryan is doing the same.

 

[Martinius]

Eh. I doubt Trump will do much.

Maybe criticise the Pope and certain folk in the Church, and maybe very rarely, the Church as a whole when it comes to certain issues; but in the end he needs the votes of Catholics.

So he's only going to criticise the Church in ways that the majority of Republican voting Catholics would agree with. So that would be on immigration for sure, maybe labor laws and social safety nets also.

I very much doubt Trump would take any action against the Church. But if he did, it would be on an issue Catholic voters generally agree with him on over the Church.

You have more faith and trust in Trump and his alt-right advisors than I do. The Church provides a lot of services paid for by the federal government. He could just cut them off, which of course would not harm the Church but instead harm the people they serve. But what else is new?

 

[Martinius]

It's good that you know these are possibilities, but I would recommend against worrying about it until see evidence of things heading that way.

Keep your worries proportionate, if that makes sense.
If you can obviously; it can be difficult to fend off worries.

Well, if the ALL the bishops of the U.S., in their conference, just issued a plea to all Catholics to contact Trump and their congress people about this, I think it may be time to worry. I am not a worrier, very optimistic, but knowing history and observing Trump's statements and actions, I don't think we can sit around and wait.

 

[Hank77]

But wait... it gets better. Check out this little gem tweeted by his vice president in December 2015.

View attachment 188943

What would Pence tweet now, a 14 mths later and beholden to Trump?

 

[Genersis]

Well, if the ALL the bishops of the U.S., in their conference, just issued a plea to all Catholics to contact Trump and their congress people about this, I think it may be time to worry. I am not a worrier, very optimistic, but knowing history and observing Trump's statements and actions, I don't think we can sit around and wait.

I guess I just haven't been convinced yet that Trump would overtly(rather than the subvert "I'm on your side" in words, and against in practice) turn on one of his own voting blocks.

But I wouldn't rule anything out. Especially if Trump's ego is as fragile as it ofttimes seems.

 

[tadoflamb]

I hope not because Native Americans did not have religious freedom until the American Indian Freedom of Religion Act of 1978. That was less than 40 years ago. It took 202 years after America was founded for Indians to finally be given this freedom.

I would submit that what is happening at Standing Rock is an assault on the freedom of religion. After all, Native American spirituality is inextricably linked to the environment, so the efforts by the current administration to push through DAPL isn't just a violation of people's right to clean water, but a denial of their religious liberties.

The attack on religious freedom is already well on it's way.

 

[dqhall]

With more and more Catholic bishops standing up for the rights and lives of immigrants and undocumented workers, and opposing Trump's plans for a wall and deportations, it may not be long before the American Catholic Church is in his crosshairs. Trump already considers the Press (a pillar of our republic) to be "the enemy", and he already has issues with a Pope who speaks truth from the Gospel. He is already going after Muslims, so I don't think it would take much for him to go after Catholics or any religious group that opposes these plans and policies.

So be prepared for the onslaught of verbal and other kinds of attacks. As Catholic bishops, religious, laity and organizations appear in the spotlight and in the news, I would not be surprised to see increased vandalism and bombings of churches. At our parish, in an area that is mostly Trump supporters, the pastor has added security, in the building and in the parking lot, on weekends and when activities are happening. He didn't say exactly why and some people thought we might be a target of Islamic terrorists. I said that it was more likely the home grown punks and alt-right loonies he was concerned about.

What do you think? Could our Church and religious freedoms be threatened? Are we next?

If you cannot see the differences between Muslims and Catholics, I pity you. Why are people not complaining about Saudi Arabia lacking religious freedom and tolerance of non-Muslim people? Why not complain about how the Muslim nations have treated Catholics? We have a right to be free from terrorism. These Islamic nations discriminate against non-Muslim people. Quid pro quo.

 

[tadoflamb]

Again, if we use Standing Rock as our (for lack of a better expression) 'canary in the coalmine' we can already see legal efforts to limit the people's freedom of assembly. Consider also the call of the Trump administration and it's supporters for the opposition to'keep quiet' it's clear that freedom of speech is also under assault. The OP has already mentioned how the Freedom of the Press has been imperiled.

Given all this, it's only makes sense that Catholicism would be the next target. I suspect, like all those who will assemble in peaceful and prayerful protest will be arrested for rioting and accused as felons. Once convicted, we will lose our right to vote.

It's already happening in Standing Rock. No one should be surprised by all of this

 

[Fish and Bread]

If you cannot see the differences between Muslims and Catholics, I pity you. Why are people not complaining about Saudi Arabia lacking religious freedom and tolerance of non-Muslim people? Why not complain about how the Muslim nations have treated Catholics? We have a right to be free from terrorism. These Islamic nations discriminate against non-Muslim people. Quid pro quo.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[The Barbarian]

Trump is already discriminating against Muslim refugees and legal Muslim immigrants who hold green cards, discriminating on the basis of their religion- in his very first week in office. I wouldn't assume that Catholics are safe. I wouldn't assume that anyone is safe.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.


Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.


Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.


Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Martin Niemöller

 

[The Barbarian]

But wait... it gets better. Check out this little gem tweeted by his vice president in December 2015.

View attachment 188943

But the desire for power often weakens moral principles.

 

[Shiloh Raven]

Again, if we use Standing Rock as our (for lack of a better expression) 'canary in the coalmine' we can already see legal efforts to limit the people's freedom of assembly. Consider also the call of the Trump administration and it's supporters for the opposition to 'keep quiet' it's clear that freedom of speech is also under assault. The OP has already mentioned how the Freedom of the Press has been imperiled.

Given all this, it's only makes sense that Catholicism would be the next target. I suspect, like all those who will assemble in peaceful and prayerful protest will be arrested for rioting and accused as felons. Once convicted, we will lose our right to vote.

It's already happening in Standing Rock. No one should be surprised by all of this

Clergy and other Christians have been arrested for assembling in peaceful prayer in solidarity with the water protectors.

And there are also these articles too.

Water Protectors Arrested, Tear-Gassed for Peaceful Prayer Walk at DAPL Site

Clergy from across U.S. to stand in solidarity with indigenous ‘water protectors’ at Standing Rock

 

[RaymondG]

That sounds like a theocratic dystopian nightmare to me.

I don't want this.... it seems that most religious people do though.

 

[Martinius]

If you cannot see the differences between Muslims and Catholics, I pity you. Why are people not complaining about Saudi Arabia lacking religious freedom and tolerance of non-Muslim people? Why not complain about how the Muslim nations have treated Catholics? We have a right to be free from terrorism. These Islamic nations discriminate against non-Muslim people. Quid pro quo.

Well, actually I can't "see" the difference, unless you have preconceptions about Muslims and Catholics. The question is about attacks on religion, and given the stance of U.S. bishops and many Catholics about what Trump is doing or wants to do. He turns against and considers "the enemy" anyone or any group that opposes him. Ergo, the Catholic church, the most prominent church in America and apparently the one church taking the lead on this issue, could become a target of the alt-right (Trump's minions).

 

[Armoured]

Actually, the protection of freedom of religion was one of the pillars of Trump's campaign.

... he just banned refugees on the basis of their religion, so, um, yeah...

 

[Armoured]

Is freedom of religion what we really want? Dont we really want for everyone to be forced to be Christian and all laws to be based on Christian and biblical rules?

That's the opposite of freedom f religion

 

[Martinius]

I would like to see more priests and nuns involved with this. I know it is difficult with the reduction in both, but even a few would be nice. I think the Church has to be visible in the fight for our country and our rights and freedoms. I know some bishops are already, but the more the better. Let's show America and the world that American Catholics will be on the side of truth, justice and fairness.

 

[The Barbarian]

... he just banned refugees on the basis of their religion, so, um, yeah...

Well, only partially. He exempted people from Muslim countries in which he does business.

President Trump has signed an executive order that bans citizens from seven Muslim-majority countries in the Middle East from entering the United States for 90 days, according to the White House. His proposed list doesn’t include Muslim-majority countries where his Trump Organization has done business or pursued potential deals. Properties include golf courses in the United Arab Emirates and two luxury towers operating in Turkey.
Trump’s Immigration Ban Excludes Countries With Business Ties

Business is business, you know.