Divorce and remarriage

[OcifferPls]

You may be right. Perhaps I'm not being honest with myself...or with you, for that matter.
A pastor told me early on that my actions would determine whether or not I'd be around to watch my kids grow up.

Here is the part of your post that I was eluding to...what you responded to with "I don't know what this means".
Are you willing to share why you wrote it? it leaves far too much to speculation.

"As for me, I could not possibly be reconciled to my ex. It would end in separation unless I compromised my beliefs, which would go against my conscience and faith in God. But if I am the only male of my family left to carry on the family name, does it sound appropriate that a failed marriage is enough reason to end an entire family line? Is that something God did or would instruct? " Your quote.

I don't understand what is so difficult to understand about what I said. Unless I compromise my faith, it would end in the same situation, because those differences led to the divorce. My faith is more important to me than my former marriage, considering that the divorce wasn't what I wanted. I am not willing to compromise my faith, and I have reason to believe that I ought not, therefore, reconciliation is not possible.

 

[Grafted In]

I understand. And I get the feeling you're done sharing any more about your failed marriage.

I will say that I looked very closely at every verse regarding divorce and remarriage. Enough that , short of her death, I would be single now. Remarriage, as I understood Scripture, was not an option.
As a result we now have 2 daughters instead of one and 8 grandkids instead of 6.
That second daughter and her 2 kids have really been a blessing. I can't imagine life without them.
My situation was the result of her having an affair. But the ugly truth lying just beneath that was that I was a very abusive husband, verblally. While I did not force her into bed with him, I may as well have.
It took me about 35 years to come to grips with that.

 

[98cwitr]

Divorce, based on the teachings of Christ, is permitted in the event of adultery only. There are no grounds I find where remarriage is okay; in fact, I find scripture that condemns remarriage.

 

[mikesayen]

I would think someone would understand the idea of the covenant between the married couple. Ephesians 5 lays out the covenant for marriage, right?

"tossing a husband/wife aside"...that's really not what happens in most divorces.

"aren't all divorces about lusts of the flesh?" No, they are not.

Time to open your eyes to what the various causes of divorce are.

Full disclosure: I've been married almost 20 years and have had biblical grounds for divorce (adultery, addiction, domestic violence). I CHOSE not to divorce. However, what I chose is not what others would chose.

Good for you to stick it out, contrary to worldly opinion. But you do have two points incorrect.

1) Only the man can initiate the divorce, according to Scripture.

2) People look at Covenants like contracts. But their are "oaths" made in a Covenant. When a contract is legally made, after one person has broken its standards the other person can end the contract anytime they wish. But God gave us the example that the only reason a Christian man should divorce his wife was if she not onlycommitted fornication but refuses to repent and come back home (Jer. 3:8-9). We can't use the "get out of jail card" years after and say we are doing a godly thing.

 

[mikesayen]

Divorce, based on the teachings of Christ, is permitted in the event of adultery only. There are no grounds I find where remarriage is okay; in fact, I find scripture that condemns remarriage.

Both parties can remarry, if it was done according to Moses' concession. Neither party commits adultery in remarriage. But, scripture only allows the man to initiate the divorce according to Deut. 24:1 (this practice is still common to Israel and the Orthodox teachings o the Jews).

 

[mikesayen]

I a

I understand. And I get the feeling you're done sharing any more about your failed marriage.

I will say that I looked very closely at every verse regarding divorce and remarriage. Enough that , short of her death, I would be single now. Remarriage, as I understood Scripture, was not an option.
As a result we now have 2 daughters instead of one and 8 grandkids instead of 6.
That second daughter and her 2 kids have really been a blessing. I can't imagine life without them.
My situation was the result of her having an affair. But the ugly truth lying just beneath that was that I was a very abusive husband, verblally. While I did not force her into bed with him, I may as well have.
It took me about 35 years to come to grips with that.

sorry to hear that. But congrats on your family and extended family!!! Your kids might have turned out poorly if you chose that divorce a long time ago (statistically). You have blessed your next generation more than you will ever know!

 

[mikesayen]

As a divorcee all I have to say is, Abraham was instructed to separate from Hagar. Paul even interpreted this as having some prophetic/theological significance w.r.t. covenants, so one way to look at it is that he may not have had much of a choice. "Let not man separate..." still applies even though the gospel does not say that God cannot or does not separate. This is something I think is way too overlooked by most churches that seem dead centered in choosing the most strict of all possibilities.

As for me, I could not possibly be reconciled to my ex. It would end in separation unless I compromised my beliefs, which would go against my conscience and faith in God. But if I am the only male of my family left to carry on the family name, does it sound appropriate that a failed marriage is enough reason to end an entire family line? Is that something God did or would instruct? Maybe only according to churches who choose the strictest of all possibilities. If the truth is that it could very well be God's will for me to remarry someone else, then I may just have to wander outside of those churches like Abraham as well, and suddenly, Paul's allusion to separating from the "bondwoman" takes on new relevance for my life.

Abraham putting away Hagar is a great example but, you must remember which scripture to refer this too. Abraham did not put away his slave-wife in the likeness of Deut. 24:1 but morally in simlitude to Exodus 21:10. Abraman set Hagar his slave-wife "free" and did not sell her in accordance to this scripture. Abraham should not have done this to a free-wife. Also, remember, this was before Moses' Law was given. So, everyone did what was right in their own eyes.

 

[OcifferPls]

Abraham putting away Hagar is a great example but, you must remember which scripture Abraham is using. Abraham did not put away his slave-wife according Deut. 24:1 but according to Exodus 21:10. Abraman set Hagar his slave-wife "free" and did not sell her in accordance to this scripture. Abraham could not have done this to a free-wife. Also, remember, this was before Moses' Law was given. So, everyone did what was right in their own eyes.

If the law hadn't been given until Moses, as the narrative teaches, that doesn't really make sense.

 

[mikesayen]

Abraham putting away Hagar is a great example but, you must remember which scripture to refer this situation too. Abraham did not put away his slave-wife in the likeness of Deut. 24:1 but morally in simlitude to Exodus 21:10. Abraman set Hagar his slave-wife "free" and did not sell her in accordance to this scripture. Abraham should not have done this to a free-wife. Also, remember, this was before Moses' Law was given. So, everyone did what was right in their own eyes.

 

[mikesayen]

If the law hadn't been given until Moses, as the narrative teaches, that doesn't really make sense.

Your totally right! I was too lazy to originally fix it. Busted!!! Ha ha. Thanks, i cleaned it up. I meant to talk about the moral principles latter seen in Exodus 21:10 and not Deut. 24:1. Thank you again!

 

[akmom]

This thread is so legalistic. We are scouring the pages of the Bible for technicalities to excuse or forbid remarriage. Ironically, Christ condemned this sort of legalism.

I feel like scripture, as a whole, promotes marriage as being sacred. It seems to discourage a culture of fickle marriage, where divorce and remarriage are routine. The Jews, at the time of Christ, were justifying divorce as long as there was a writ of divorcement… essentially saying that divorce is okay as long as you meet some technical requirements. And now Christians have their own set of “grounds for divorce,” mining the scriptures for technicalities, like Paul’s teachings that were intended for brand new believers, or Christ’s mention of fornication, or Abraham’s primitive surrogacy arrangement. I don’t think these scattered scriptures were intended to justify divorce. Christ pretty clearly said that divorce was permitted because of the hardness of hearts, and not because it’s ever actually God’s will. If you’re looking for scriptures that justify divorce or remarriage, I don’t think you’re looking for God’s will, but rather a technicality to justify what you already want to do.

I think an honest question is, do you love your husband? Do you want to reconcile with him? And if you do, I think that’s pretty telling in terms of where your heart is in that relationship. Are you asking God to reconcile your marriage, or just asking if it’s okay to get a new one? I feel like the adultery incident is irrelevant. You sinned, you repented, you’re forgiven. Christ told the woman at the well, in the same situation, to “go and sin no more.”

Grafted In makes some good points. There is great value in honoring and preserving marriage and family, and that includes fixing the parts that need fixed. I loved his personal example, because it involved some biggies (fornication, abuse), but showed that God's grace is bigger than that.

 

[mikesayen]

This thread is so legalistic. We are scouring the pages of the Bible for technicalities to excuse or forbid remarriage. Ironically, Christ condemned this sort of legalism.

I feel like scripture, as a whole, promotes marriage as being sacred. It seems to discourage a culture of fickle marriage, where divorce and remarriage are routine. The Jews, at the time of Christ, were justifying divorce as long as there was a writ of divorcement… essentially saying that divorce is okay as long as you meet some technical requirements. And now Christians have their own set of “grounds for divorce,” mining the scriptures for technicalities, like Paul’s teachings that were intended for brand new believers, or Christ’s mention of fornication, or Abraham’s primitive surrogacy arrangement. I don’t think these scattered scriptures were intended to justify divorce. Christ pretty clearly said that divorce was permitted because of the hardness of hearts, and not because it’s ever actually God’s will. If you’re looking for scriptures that justify divorce or remarriage, I don’t think you’re looking for God’s will, but rather a technicality to justify what you already want to do.

I think an honest question is, do you love your husband? Do you want to reconcile with him? And if you do, I think that’s pretty telling in terms of where your heart is in that relationship. Are you asking God to reconcile your marriage, or just asking if it’s okay to get a new one? I feel like the adultery incident is irrelevant. You sinned, you repented, you’re forgiven. Christ told the woman at the well, in the same situation, to “go and sin no more.”

Grafted In makes some good points. There is great value in honoring and preserving marriage and family, and that includes fixing the parts that need fixed. I loved his personal example, because it involved some biggies (fornication, abuse), but showed that God's grace is bigger than that.

akMOM - Your right! My definition was only to say "why" he did it (he was not being mean and others are not to use that as an example concerning their free-wife). The Bible tells us the only two reason why we (for the most part) should divorce. It says the man is to divorce, if the wife is living in adultery with another person and refuses to repent or come home (Jer. 3:8-9) than you can put her away, and release her to her sin. But, of course, reconciliation and repentance is always preferable so the man should wait a while before he remarries. Or, if you are a believer (man or woman) and your unbelieving spouse has initiated a divorce against you already. Paul is saying, do not fight it but allow the divorce to happen. Non contested "no fault" divorces are a relative new thing in America. And since this, co-habitation has risen 100'rd fold since the 70's and divorce has been on the rise ever since (with those who do end up marrying)! AkMom, I always say that Jesus said divorce was allowed because of the hardness of the heart, but as believers we have a new heart and a new spirit, the mind of Christ and should not feel a need to put away a repentive wife. Matter of fact, the way we judge our spouse will be the same judgement that God holds against us. And if we retain the sins of any (those who repent and ask forgiveness), God will retain our sins.

 

[Grafted In]

Both parties can remarry, if it was done according to Moses' concession. Neither party commits adultery in remarriage. But, scripture only allows the man to initiate the divorce according to Deut. 24:1 (this practice is still common to Israel and the Orthodox teachings o the Jews).

Nooooooo.

 

[mikesayen]

Nooooooo.

 

[mikesayen]

Nooooooo.

This is true. It is also supported in the New Testament. This is a very common practice for Jewish Religious leaders.

 

[Grafted In]

I disagree.

 

[mikesayen]

I disagree.

I am opened to talk scriptually and the Jewish customs sorrounding it, if you would like.

 

[mikesayen]

I am opened to talk scriptually and the Jewish customs sorrounding it, if you would like.

Or, Thumb War.

 

[Dave-W]

Divorce, based on the teachings of Christ, is permitted in the event of adultery only.

And in 1 Cor 7 Paul permitted it for abandonment.

To reject the words of Paul (whom the Lord sent) is to reject the Lord also.

Matt 10.14 Whoever does not receive you, nor heed your words, as you go out of that house or that city, shake the dust off your feet. 15 Truly I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city.

40 He who receives you receives Me, and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me.

There are no grounds I find where remarriage is okay; in fact, I find scripture that condemns remarriage.

There is no purpose for divorce (which God allows) if there is no possibility of remarriage.

 

[98cwitr]

And in 1 Cor 7 Paul permitted it for abandonment.

To reject the words of Paul (whom the Lord sent) is to reject the Lord also.

Matt 10.14 Whoever does not receive you, nor heed your words, as you go out of that house or that city, shake the dust off your feet. 15 Truly I say to you, it will be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment than for that city.

40 He who receives you receives Me, and he who receives Me receives Him who sent Me.

There is no purpose for divorce (which God allows) if there is no possibility of remarriage.

Paul does not permit it. As I read 1 Cor 7, it permits the believer to allow the unbelieving spouse to leave. The believer is never to seek a divorce unless there is sexual infidelity. There is nothing in Paul's letter that would permit that.

More importantly, verse 11 is fairly grounding, and Paul is clear that divorce is not permitted.