GENTILES OR CHRISTIANS PRACTICING THE SABBATH ?

[dfw69]

Yeshua has given us a spiritual rest from sin and from striving to be justified by works. He has NOT given us physical rest from our labors. We still get tired after six days of work and must rest, but that rest is commanded to take place on the day our Creator blessed and sanctified for it (the 7th day). Also, the Sabbath rest was for the benefit of animals as well. Is it OK for farmers today to work their animals seven days a week? That is unrighteousness and merciless. The same holds true for any employer that works his laborers seven days a week.

What's the purpose for teaching Gentiles the 10 commandments to observe? Are you saying Gentiles to be truly saved must enter into covenant by observing the 10 commandments? Some say the 10 is an outline of entire 613 mitzvah ... some say the Torah is only for Jews.. must we become one with the Jews? Was that yeshua mission?

If I sound confused that's cause I am

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

all 10 commandments are fulfilled by Christ for the believers who puts their trust in him

And he give us new commandments to obey which if we obey we break none of the 10 commandments

If I love Jesus I love god
If I love my enemies I judge not and condemn not
If I love my brothers I will not sleep with his wife not steal nor kill ...see?

Yeshua said that on these hang all the law and the prophets (love God and love your neighbor). However His commandments are even stricter. Do not covet your neighbors wife...He said if it even enters you mind and heart, you are guilty of it. He never got rid of the Commandments but now gave you a way to cover your sins with His blood. By keeping Shabbat, you show you love God too, because it is also one of the Commandments. What the Apostles gave were the Noahide laws. Are you grafted into Israel?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

What's the purpose for teaching Gentiles the 10 commandments to observe? Are you saying Gentiles to be truly saved must enter into covenant by observing the 10 commandments? Some say the 10 is an outline of entire 613 mitzvah ... some say the Torah is only for Jews.. must we become one with the Jews? Was that yeshua mission?

If I sound confused that's cause I am

Those written in STONE are inscribed forever. It has nothing to do with "being saved".

 

[dfw69]

If the basic ten written in stone is not transferred into your heart, all the old or new ordinances won't mean a thing because without the foundation you will have ordinances that flap in the winds of doctrine without anchor.

Perfectly isn't the observance of legalities, but the observance of intent and heart of love towards God and our fellow man. My love for the law is a reflection of my love for God. In mediating upon the law, I learn more about the character of God and His infinite wisdom reflecting in love and mercy upon which I am to emulate as Yeshua did.

The estrangement you have for the law and Yeshua tears at the very fabric of who He is.

So the moment I accept to observe the 10 commandments to place them in my heart I become born again and I enter into the old covenant which is the renewed covenant? I become circumcised in heart? Is it only the 10 or 613?

Why the need to renew the old covenant what happened that it needs to be renewed???

 

[dfw69]

Yeshua said that on these hang all the law and the prophets (love God and love your neighbor). However His commandments are even stricter. Do not covet your neighbors wife...He said if it even enters you mind and heart, you are guilty of it.

that happens a lot that I fight the temptation of lust ..every day I'm guilty of that sin. ...do I act upon it? No!

He never got rid of the Commandments but now gave you a way to cover your sins with His blood. By keeping Shabbat, you show you love God too, because it is also one of the Commandments. What the Apostles gave were the Noahide laws. Are you grafted into Israel?

So you hold that Gentiles should obey noachide law? ...ok

I believe Christ is Israel ..if I'm one with him and Jews are one with him then we are all one ...

 

[dfw69]

Those written in STONE are inscribed forever. It has nothing to do with "being saved".

Gotta go.. peace

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

So the moment I accept to observe the 10 commandments to place them in my heart I become born again and I enter into the old covenant which is the renewed covenant? I become circumcised in heart? Is it only the 10 or 613?

Why the need to renew the old covenant what happened that it needs to be renewed???

There are no 613, there is no Temple. Why are you renewing something that has not changed?

 

[dfw69]

There are no 613, there is no Temple. Why are you renewing something that has not changed?

The Bible speaks of a new covenant.. how is it new?

 

[Steve Petersen]

The Bible speaks of a new covenant.. how is it new?

Read Jeremiah 31 thru 34. You will see numerous examples of 'better promises' there.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The Bible speaks of a new covenant.. how is it new?

Matthew 5:17-19

Hebrews 9:15-17

It is not just outwardly but now also inwardly...

 

[YouAreAwesome]

Those written in STONE are inscribed forever. It has nothing to do with "being saved".

Placement of a law does not make it moral. i am Australian. If I travel on a bus of Africans, am I now African? The Sabbath is exactly a ceremony. Look up the definition of ceremony. It's a ridiculous argument to say the sabbath is moral because of where it is placed. A commandment is moral if it is moral in and of itself!

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Placement of a law does not make it moral. i am Australian. If I travel on a bus of Africans, am I now African? The Sabbath is exactly a ceremony. Look up the definition of ceremony. It's a ridiculous argument to say the sabbath is moral because of where it is placed. A commandment is moral if it is moral in and of itself!

If you are an African on a bus full of Africans, are you now an Australian? LOL

 

[YouAreAwesome]

If you are an African on a bus full of Africans, are you now an Australian? LOL

Ok then, show me how the sabbath is moral.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Ok then, show me how the sabbath is moral.

Are the first 3 Commandments moral? Do you still follow them? If so...why?

We follow them, not because we have to but because we want to....because we love God.

"If you LOVE Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

 

[gadar perets]

What's the purpose for teaching Gentiles the 10 commandments to observe?

Because they are the heart of the law by which the Kingdom of Yahweh will be ruled. Obedience to them are how Jews and Gentiles alike are to manifest love for Yahweh and our neighbors.

Are you saying Gentiles to be truly saved must enter into covenant by observing the 10 commandments?

No. To be truly saved you must believe in the Master Yeshua. To truly be a servant who loves Yahweh with all his heart, soul, mind and strength and who loves his neighbor, you must obey the 10 commandments. To fail to obey is sin.

Some say the 10 is an outline of entire 613 mitzvah ... some say the Torah is only for Jews.. must we become one with the Jews? Was that yeshua mission?

If I sound confused that's cause I am

And confusion is off the enemy who would like nothing better than for you to fail to see straight. I would say the 10 are the heart of the 613 .... that Torah is for all who will join themselves to Yeshua ... that we are to become one with the Father and the Son and all who believe ... and that Yeshua's mission was to do the will of his Father, to save sinners (law breakers).

 

[gadar perets]

The Bible speaks of a new covenant.. how is it new?

I agree that it is a new covenant, not a renewed covenant. It is not, however, that we have a new law/Torah, but that the same Torah is administered in a new way. It is internal, written on hearts and minds, not external written on stone. The death penalty has been paid and the condemnation removed.

 

[gadar perets]

Ok then, show me how the sabbath is moral.

It is immoral to force your workers and/or animals to work seven days a week without a rest. It is immoral to fail to give Yahweh glory for His work of creation by the means He has chosen to receive such glory, that is, through His people resting on the 7th day as He did. It is immoral to remove the sign by which we know that it is Yahweh that sanctifies us. It is immoral to trample on that which Yahweh has declared holy and blessed. Look at the reverse of these immoral acts and you will see how the Sabbath is moral.

 

[YouAreAwesome]

Are the first 3 Commandments moral? Do you still follow them? If so...why?

We follow them, not because we have to but because we want to....because we love God.

"If you LOVE Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15

Now please don't avoid the question by deflecting to John 14:15. I am asking how the Sabbath is moral. Your answer so far is because of where it is placed, which isn't a reason at all.

Asking about the first 3 commandments also avoids the question. Let me explain, could I not say that first 3 commandments are about God because God is a trinity. The 4th represents all symbolic and ceremonial law pointing to Jesus, and the final 6 are about man because the Hebrew number for man is 6?

Placement is not a reason.

 

[visionary]

Now please don't avoid the question by deflecting to John 14:15. I am asking how the Sabbath is moral. Your answer so far is because of where it is placed, which isn't a reason at all.

Asking about the first 3 commandments also avoids the question. Let me explain, could I not say that first 3 commandments are about God because God is a trinity. The 4th represents all symbolic and ceremonial law pointing to Jesus, and the final 6 are about man because the Hebrew number for man is 6?

Placement is not a reason.

Moral obligations.. are you saying they only apply man to man?

 

[YouAreAwesome]

It is immoral to force your workers and/or animals to work seven days a week without a rest. It is immoral to fail to give Yahweh glory for His work of creation by the means He has chosen to receive such glory, that is, through His people resting on the 7th day as He did. It is immoral to remove the sign by which we know that it is Yahweh that sanctifies us. It is immoral to trample on that which Yahweh has declared holy and blessed. Look at the reverse of these immoral acts and you will see how the Sabbath is moral.

Summary of reasons:

1. It is immoral to force 7 days of work.

The Sabbath is a forced specific rest day. What if I want to rest on Wednesday instead? Is this immoral? Therefore, this is not a reason.

2. Immoral to not give God glory by following His command.

This reasoning would apply to the whole law including for example circumcision.

3. It is immoral to remove a sign.

Circumcision is removed and was a sign.

4. Immoral to trample on what God blessed.

Circular reasoning. You are assuming it is required first, and then using that assumption to prove that it is required.


The question remains, how is the sabbath moral?