Real time or evo time?

[TLK Valentine]

Speaking of abstract, you do realize that you see stars here near or on earth, right?

The nearest one being our own Sun -- approximately 93 million miles away.

On Earth? Clearly you mean "star" as in "celebrity." Not seeing the relevance...

 

[dad]

But the star is there. Meaning time exists there, otherwise, you wouldn't be able to see it.

False dichotomy. Because a star exists somewhere far away, does not mean it exists in our sort of time or space! Proof?

 

[TLK Valentine]

False dichotomy. Because a star exists somewhere far away, does not mean it exists in our sort of time or space! Proof?

Are you suggesting that you have some sort of miraculous ability to see things that do not exist in our space and time?

Is that anything like seeing ghosts? Goblins? Faeries?

 

[dad]

The nearest one being our own Sun -- approximately 93 million miles away.

That is not a star. You can call it a star all you like, and fit it into your idea of the universe, where stars are suns. You cannot do that with authority or knowledge though. So let's not play with words. In the bible a star was not the sun. In science, using beliefs about time existing the same and such, they have concluded that stars are huge. But if distances are not known, then sizes are sure not known. Correct?

On Earth? Clearly you mean "star" as in "celebrity." Not seeing the relevance...

You only see stars that are way out in space HERE. On or near earth. Always. There is no other point of reference for your observations at all. Ever.

 

[dad]

Are you suggesting that you have some sort of miraculous ability to see things that do not exist in our space and time?

God clued us in, no special abilities needed. Except being able to hear His word, or read it. He tells us a lot more than silly little idiotic so called science ever could.

We all have the special ability to read His word. It is science that has kept us in the dark.

 

[TLK Valentine]

That is not a star. You can call it a star all you like, and fit it into your idea of the universe, where stars are suns. You cannot do that with authority or knowledge though.

Not to you, but fortunately, your opinion on the matter carries no authority or knowledge on the matter.

So let's not play with words. In the bible a star was not the sun.

Then what would you call it, as long as you're not playing with words?

In science, using beliefs about time existing the same and such, they have concluded that stars are huge. But if distances are not known, then sizes are sure not known. Correct?

You still haven't shown that the distances aren't known... you've been going around in circles.

You still haven't shown how time is a factor in a parallax equation.

You only see stars that are way out in space HERE. On or near earth. Always. There is no other point of reference for your observations at all. Ever.

So the "stars" you see in the sky are, in fact, very close, but very tiny -- is that your opinion?

 

[TLK Valentine]

God clued us in, no special abilities needed. Except being able to hear His word, or read it. He tells us a lot more than silly little idiotic so called science ever could.

We all have the special ability to read His word. It is science that has kept us in the dark.

Is that how you're able to see the stars, in spite of your claim that they do not exist in our time or space?

 

[dad]

Not to you, but fortunately, your opinion on the matter carries no authority or knowledge on the matter.

Not to God!! Your desire to contradict Him with no proof or evidence is noted.

Then what would you call it, as long as you're not playing with words?

I would call the sun the sun. I would call stars stars.

You still haven't shown that the distances aren't known... you've been going around in circles.

Yes I have. Prove time exists in the far universe or no distances are known.

You still haven't shown how time is a factor in a parallax equation.

Yes I did. Time is part of our spacetime. It is a measure in our space and time that is used invariably for the base line! We know time exists HERE! Don't try to deny it.

So the "stars" you see in the sky are, in fact, very close, but very tiny -- is that your opinion?

No. Some are different than others in glory. So we just don't know how big they are while in space. However ones assumes that if a star falls to earth, ot would be fairly small! Now if there are some stars bigger than the sun...fine. Who knows? Size is relative apparently in deep space! Relative to space and time, and God's rules. Man doesn't know what stars are, how far, or how big.

 

[dad]

Is that how you're able to see the stars, in spite of your claim that they do not exist in our time or space?

We can see stars because God created them for us! For us to see and even to control time..or at least mark it here!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Not to God!! Your desire to contradict Him with no proof or evidence is noted.

How fortunate, then, that you are not God.

I would call the sun the sun. I would call stars stars.

I would call a poodle a dog. I would call a terrier a dog. I would call a golden retriever a dog...

Yes I have. Prove time exists in the far universe or no distances are known.

You already proved it -- you said yourself if we didn't exist in time and space, we wouldn't exist. The stars exist, therefore, they exist in time and space. If they didn't exist in our time and space, how would we be able to see them?

Yes I did. Time is part of our spacetime. It is a measure in our space and time that is used invariably for the base line! We know time exists HERE! Don't try to deny it.

And since we know stars exist, we know time exists where they are, as well. if it's not our time, how would we be able to see them?

No. Some are different than others in glory. So we just don't know how big they are while in space. However ones assumes that if a star falls to earth, ot would be fairly small!

Alas, they don't do that, so it's a moot point.

Now if there are some stars bigger than the sun...fine. Who knows? Size is relative apparently in deep space! Relative to space and time, and God's rules. Man doesn't know what stars are, how far, or how big.

You don't know -- but the rest of us know quite a bit on it. You do realize that there are people who know things you yourself do not, right?

 

[TLK Valentine]

We can see stars because God created them for us! For us to see and even to control time..or at least mark it here!

How can you use the stars to mark or even control time if, as you claim, the stars don't exist in our time?

 

[dad]

How fortunate, then, that you are not God.

His word is here for us.

You already proved it -- you said yourself if we didn't exist in time and space, we wouldn't exist.

You do not exist at the star! You exist here...as does time!

The stars exist, therefore, they exist in time and space.

That assumes time and space is all the same and you can't know that or prove that. Pipe down.

If they didn't exist in our time and space, how would we be able to see them?

For your information it is not the star that exists here, just light from the star.

And since we know stars exist, we know time exists where they are, as well. if it's not our time, how would we be able to see them?

We see them in our time here. That does not mean our time is also there.

You don't know -- but the rest of us know quite a bit on it.

Idle boasting. Your posts betray you.

You do realize that there are people who know things you yourself do not, right?

NO! Not about time in deep space!

 

[TLK Valentine]

His word is here for us.

You haven't used it once in your attempts to refute parallax.

You do not exist at the star! You exist here...as does time!

You do not exist at your computer monitor -- yet you are able to see it.

That assumes time and space is all the same and you can't know that or prove that. Pipe down.

Can we see things that don't exist in time or space? Do you usually see things that don't exist in time or space?

For your information it is not the star that exists here, just light from the star.

Are you saying that the light isn't actually coming from the star?

We see them in our time here. That does not mean our time is also there.

Sounds like you're saying that they don't exist in time, but you see them anyway.

Idle boasting. Your posts betray you.
NO! Not about time in deep space!

All you've been saying is that you see things that don't exist in your time or space... What can you see, then, that you know is actually there?

 

[dad]

You haven't used it once in your attempts to refute parallax.

Easy to show that the dream times of worldly wise men of so called science are violently against the word of God. We know when the earth was created more or less. No mystery at all. they are wrong as wrong ever could be.

You do not exist at your computer monitor -- yet you are able to see it.

Well done Sherlock. I agree, I exist and so does my screen. However, it behooves me to point out that we exist here in the time and space God gave us on earth.

Can we see things that don't exist in time or space?

Good question. Another question might be are there things in space and time we cannot see? Yet another question may be, Is time and even space diferent far far far away where n one has been? Not like you can see time, after all, or even space!

Are you saying that the light isn't actually coming from the star?

No, I am not saying that. What's up with you lately, you seem to be debating honestly? I am saying that whatever gets piped into the fishbowl is felt and seen here. We have never been anywhere else.
So, if time and space were stretched out, for example, in deep space, so that there was less time per unit of space, (or whatever) that would mean it took far far less time to do whatever a star did there. By the time we see the light of it here in the fishbowl, the light entered time and space as we know it. So anything we see here, whether atomic changes in hydrogen, or anything at all...it has started to exist in TIME. That doesn't mean there is time as we know it there! What a concept.

All you've been saying is that you see things that don't exist in your time or space... What can you see, then, that you know is actually there?

False. What we see, like photons from elsewhere, we see here, and therefore they do exist in space and time!

 

[RealityCheck01]

That is not a star.

The delusion that the Sun is not a star needs to be added to A long list of science, questions, fantasies, etc. started on 4 August 2016 for dad. !

This is the Sun, dad.
This is a star, dad.
2 September 2016 dad: A abysmally ignorant statement that the Sun is not a star!

 

[RealityCheck01]

You do realize the base line for parallax is in time and space here?

Do you realize that asking ignorant questions hints at your ignorance dad?
Space and time is everywhere in the universe. Fantasies that parallax does not work because of your imagination without any rational evidence are deluded.

 

[RealityCheck01]

Closed minded nonsense....

Another rant to add to A long list of science, questions, fantasies, etc. started on 4 August 2016 for dad. !
2 September 2016 dad: Insulting people again and stating delusions is not a rational honest argument.
If I thought you were being honest I would repeat yet again the science that establishes that stars are 1 AU to 4 light years to millions to billions of light years away from our solar system.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Easy to show that the dream times of worldly wise men of so called science are violently against the word of God. We know when the earth was created more or less. No mystery at all. they are wrong as wrong ever could be.

According to you -- not God.

Well done Sherlock. I agree, I exist and so does my screen. However, it behooves me to point out that we exist here in the time and space God gave us on earth.

But you don't know that -- and that's the point, isn't it? You and your computer monitor exist in two different spaces, and, as far as you know, two different times.

Are you in your kitchen right now? Are you sure your kitchen exists in the same space and time? Go and check -- but when you're there, how to you know Space and time are as you left it back at your computer?

This is your logic, dad -- a world where nothing that isn't where you are at this exact moment can be trusted. Nothing is stable; nothing is safe.

You can have it, dad.

Good question. Another question might be are there things in space and time we cannot see? Yet another question may be, Is time and even space diferent far far far away where n one has been? Not like you can see time, after all, or even space!

Why don't you answer the first question before going off on others.... can you be sure of anything as far as your own kitchen? If so, how?

No, I am not saying that. What's up with you lately, you seem to be debating honestly? I am saying that whatever gets piped into the fishbowl is felt and seen here. We have never been anywhere else.

But you claim to be able to see out of the fishbowl, do you not? You can see the stars which, according to you, do not exist in the same space and time as we do. How is that possible?

 

[sjastro]

Nope, you don't get to make stuff up! Prove it. The bible indicates time is not universal in a way you claim. Even if the universe did have to operate according to our peabrain little ideas somewhat, and time was required, the question would become..how much time? If time exited in a different way, that is, that there was less time needed for events in far space, then we could not use our fishbowl earth as the measure for how much time was needed! Or, if there were no time as we think of it, then no time would be needed for events, regardless of how it seems to us, and whether it was intuitive or not!! So you do not know. Face it.

Leaving aside your cheap personal shots your comment makes no grammatical or logical sense ("if time exited in a different way"), but is a crystal clear example of a strawman argument at work.

I answered your question on the basis of the Wikipedia links that you provided for light cones and events.
Neither makes any references to the Bible, nor can an event occur without time.
Also you have no idea of what I think about time.

Do you understand where this is leading to, making things up, psychological projection..........

False, your premise was just demolished, so forget the therefore...!!!

The objective of the strawman argument.

Cones? Where do we point a telescope to see one of these time cones?! Or are they imaginary? Keep us posted.

Reading comprehension skills again.
Try going back to your link on light cones and reading it carefully. The penny might drop.

Angels do not need time, as I referenced in the example of Gabriel. Since you do not know what spiritual component may exist in deep space, or what time and space mix...you simply have no way to declare time is there and a limit for events. Here in the fishbowl..yes. Obviously. Think out of the box.

Amazing, openly declaring you cannot think for yourself but telling me to think out of the box.

False. The way light behaves here in time and space of man is nothing more than the way it comes down for us here. You may not declare the universe to be the same.

You can get on your high horse and make pontifications despite being clueless about the size of your fishbowl.
Why hasn't God provided you with this information and what happens if the fishbowl is infinitely large.
Now that would be very embarrassing.

Event horizon is a buzzword for how far you can see from the fishbowl. You can't see space or time by the way! So how much time exists way out there you do not know. Period.

The best for last.
The event horizon is the maximum distance where light reaches the observer IN A FINITE PERIOD OF TIME.
Since you have admitted the horizon extends beyond the fishbowl means that time extends to the horizon as well.
If it doesn't it means you cannot define the horizon, or the horizon corresponds to the diameter of your fishbowl in which case you have the absurd scenario of compressing the entire Universe in your fishbowl!!

Congratulations you have inadvertently provided an irrefutable counterexample to your nonsense.

 

[AirPo]

Nope, you don't get to make stuff up!