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No, not according to the Urantia revelation which provides much more information than we previously had on earth about what happened. We are betrayed and confused Quatona, then we suffered from a second default when the incarnate Adam and Eve, the worlds new spiritual rulers, were outflanked (tricked) and defaulted, leading to still more of a mess. But they did repent right away, the did not fully invest in the rebellion against the fathers rule.
Rebellion? I was asking about the belief in the existence of a God since that was your original claim ("atheist").
You said it was proof that "the universe is not entirely material/mechanical". It isn't proof. Personalities are functions of brain activity. We know this because you can change a personality by changing what happens in the brain.
I guess it means 'metaphysical'...
Life is a physical process. Mind too.
No, it doesn't. It implies a material consciousness.
Biological machines like humans can.
Argument from incredulity fallacy.
The scientist is part of the universe, and the laws, mechanisms, and uniformities which the scientist discovers are descriptions of his observations of the universe, so... No.
Coo, I can agree with this.
Ah, the 'Thought Adjuster', Urantia's McGuffin; as if it somehow lends credibility...
Good grief... why does this remind me of similar nonsense in Scientology?I knew you would like it Mark.
53:4.2 "Self-assertion was the battle cry of the Lucifer rebellion. One of his chief arguments was that, if self-government was good and right for the Melchizedeks and other groups, it was equally good for all orders of intelligence. He was bold and persistent in the advocacy of the “equality of mind” and “the brotherhood of intelligence.” He maintained that all government should be limited to the local planets and their voluntary confederation into the local systems. All other supervision he disallowed. He promised the Planetary Princes that they should rule the worlds as supreme executives. He denounced the location of legislative activities on the constellation headquarters and the conduct of judicial affairs on the universe capital. He contended that all these functions of government should be concentrated on the system capitals and proceeded to set up his own legislative assembly and organized his own tribunals under the jurisdiction of Satan And he directed that the princes on the apostate worlds do the same." UB 1955
The world is a manifestation of what is on high...so...the answer to "how" evidence is is used, is that it is used the same way. And being of the world and knowing the ways of the world, you know the "how" of it. But the "what" you do not know, except that I have told you that physical evidence is physical, while spiritual evidence is spiritual. You have your example.
Our "report" and those who have gone before...is indeed, "our report." However, collectively, they are more than our report - they are an unavoidable reality of life in the world. Denying it, is selective blindness.
The blind do indeed have their own knowledge, but fall short of the truth, until the actual truth comes to light - sometimes taking millennia. You are quoting a false dichotomy.
I claim nothing - but I do point out what you have so selectively missed:
Stop beating around the bush, please. Did Lucifer believe that a God existed or didn´t he? Did he believe that a "Godless universe" existed (your personal definition of "atheist") or didn´t he?
Yes. He concluded that the God of Michael, aka Jesus, his creator brother, was a fraud. That's the God that Jesus referred to as his "Father." Lucifer came up with this idea that the unseen Father/God didn't really exist, that there was no God beyond the personalities of the universe that he did know.
I wish you'd make up your mind.ScottA said:
I'm not denying the report (as I already made clear); I'm denying that it necessarily reports reality. The plural of report isn't reality, or you'd have to acknowledge all other religious beliefs as true.
This is all rather random... I didn't quote anything, and there's no dichotomy there - false or otherwise. Are you sure you're OK?
I'm aware of the quote. Einstein's is just one of many interpretations of time held by physicists - and such a 4D block omnitemporal universe view doesn't help your case, implying, as it does, that all action is deterministic and inevitable, thus negating libertarian dualist ideas of free will. Try again.
So spiritual logic must work in the same way on spiritual evidence in the spiritual court as worldly logic does on worldly evidence in a worldly court - otherwise the world wouldn't be a manifestation of what is on high in respect of how evidence is used. Which would seem to contradict your 'simple fact' that "physical worldly logic, is different then spiritual logic".
Another example of you being completely ridiculous. I said physical and spiritual are different...and that the evidence of each is used the same - two different aspects completely. Straighten up or be ignored.
Can you not see that if you say, "...to examine said spiritual evidence could only occur in a spiritual court", and when asked about how that evidence is used, you say, "The world is a manifestation of what is on high...so...the answer to "how" evidence is is used, is that it is used the same way", you're saying that the spiritual court uses spiritual evidence the same way a worldly court uses worldly evidence? and, in a worldy court, they examine worldly evidence using worldy logic (reasoning)... the implication seems clear.
