Heaven and Hell

[bhsmte]

I could not point out any one thing. in general I just wanted to know if God was real or not and so I searched out the people who seemed most qualified.

Which people are most qualified to tell you a God exists and why?

 

[Noxot]

Which people are most qualified to tell you a God exists and why?

that was at the start of my journey since God will use anything he can to draw all as close to him as possible while they remain themselves.

from the childish perspective about God and religion I would say the people who were spiritual have been the greatest light. I had always sought out the saints that i felt were near to God and they gave me things that your everyday religious person could not. people like saint catherine of genoa has a strong impact on me, her words were full of love and direct experience of God. many of the saints were like that.

in truth various angels have always constantly been sending me things that draw me closer to God but from a naive religious sense I could say that at the first God directed me to a preacher that has that show called 'shepherds chapel' and after I was done experiencing that God sent origen to me who was one of the first theologians and deemed a heretic by many. then God let me discover books that were not counted as part of the bible such as 1 enoch, the letter of barnabas and the book called the shepherd of hermas. so basically in the end I would say that all of reality is a spiritual experience. God still sends different angels, new humans, and new things for me to learn from just like he has done for my entire life. I go to hell sometimes whilst other times I am in heaven.

i think a main turning point for me was origen. he was the one that first taught me about the different layers of the bible and the correct way to understand and study it.

 

[bhsmte]

that was at the start of my journey since God will use anything he can to draw all as close to him as possible while they remain themselves.

from the childish perspective about God and religion I would say the people who were spiritual have been the greatest light. I had always sought out the saints that i felt were near to God and they gave me things that your everyday religious person could not. people like saint catherine of genoa has a strong impact on me, her words were full of love and direct experience of God. many of the saints were like that.

in truth various angels have always constantly been sending me things that draw me closer to God but from a naive religious sense I could say that at the first God directed me to a preacher that has that show called 'shepherds chapel' and after I was done experiencing that God sent origen to me who was one of the first theologians and deemed a heretic by many. then God let me discover books that were not counted as part of the bible such as 1 enoch, the letter of barnabas and the book called the shepherd of hermas. so basically in the end I would say that all of reality is a spiritual experience. God still sends different angels, new humans, and new things for me to learn from just like he has done for my entire life. I go to hell sometimes whilst other times I am in heaven.

i think a main turning point for me was origen. he was the one that first taught me about the different layers of the bible and the correct way to understand and study it.

That's all cool, if it works for you.

You do understand, when it comes to spiritual claims, they are wide and varied the world over, with 2/3 of the world's population, having different spiritual experiences which disagree with Christianity. This tells me, spiritual experiences and or religious beliefs, are highly related to individual psyche, the culture one was brought up in, etc...

In other words, for as many people as you rely on to tell you what the truth is about the God you believe in, you will find even more that will tell you that you are wrong.

 

[Noxot]

Exactly. We all have different bias and baggage we bring to the table. So if you and I were to sit down and have a discussion about the nature of reality, what would be the best way to go about it?

I dunno... we could maybe agree to some degree on what is good and what is evil even though I think goodness is a fundamental component to reality. I don't think atheist can relate to the kinds of idea that say that reality has some kind of deep and profound meaning involving themselves.

 

[Noxot]

That's all cool, if it works for you.

You do understand, when it comes to spiritual claims, they are wide and varied the world over, with 2/3 of the world's population, having different spiritual experiences which disagree with Christianity. This tells me, spiritual experiences and or religious beliefs, are highly related to individual psyche, the culture one was brought up in, etc...

In other words, for as many people as you rely on to tell you what the truth is about the God you believe in, you will find even more that will tell you that you are wrong.

actually i am finding out that my reality and spiritual experience is consistent with a few things. one is the childishness and the lack of true spiritual experience of God within common placed religion be they hindu, christian, mulsim, ect. two is that those who really do have some measure of real spiritual experience tend to understand a underpinning commonality to religious experience.

the fact of the matter is that most atheist and religious folk are caught up in the exoteric images of religion rather than in the esoteric reality of God. things only look divided on outer levels but God is the unifying reality that gives birth to multiplicity. I don't say this by book knowledge alone, I say this due to the spiritual experiences that I and others have had. i have found God in slipknot music just as much as I have in music and that is because my soul is the temple of God.

 

[Noxot]

That's all cool, if it works for you.

You do understand, when it comes to spiritual claims, they are wide and varied the world over, with 2/3 of the world's population, having different spiritual experiences which disagree with Christianity. This tells me, spiritual experiences and or religious beliefs, are highly related to individual psyche, the culture one was brought up in, etc...

In other words, for as many people as you rely on to tell you what the truth is about the God you believe in, you will find even more that will tell you that you are wrong.

what you say is only proof for there being a universal mind rather than against it. all individual psyches are incorporated into God since they come from him and so reality becomes like a diamond with many facets. that is the entire point to theosis, to union with God.

it is your world view that colors the information for you to see it how you do.

 

[bhsmte]

actually i am finding out that my reality and spiritual experience is consistent with a few things. one is the childishness and the lack of true spiritual experience of God within common placed religion be they hindu, christian, mulsim, ect. two is that those who really do have some measure of real spiritual experience tend to understand a underpinning commonality to religious experience.

the fact of the matter is that most atheist and religious folk are caught up in the exoteric images of religion rather than in the esoteric reality of God. things only look divided on outer levels but God is the unifying reality that gives birth to multiplicity. I don't say this by book knowledge alone, I say this due to the spiritual experiences that I and others have had. i have found God in slipknot music just as much as I have in music and that is because my soul is the temple of God.

Sounds like personal opinion.

But as I said, if it works for you and your beliefs make you a better person, that is terrific.

 

[bhsmte]

what you say is only proof for there being a universal mind rather than against it. all individual psyches are incorporated into God since they come from him and so reality becomes like a diamond with many facets. that is the entire point to theosis, to union with God.

it is your world view that colors the information for you to see it how you do.

I guess then, you would have to demonstrate (with reliable evidence), that all psyches are incorporated into God.

 

[Noxot]

Sounds like personal opinion.

But as I said, if it works for you and your beliefs make you a better person, that is terrific.

but you sound like you got plenty of personal opinions yourself. that is the very nature of having a subjective mind. it is part of what makes humans human but God is certainly not having problems surmounting all souls to move and direct them to himself even with their various experiences of life as a human.

 

[Noxot]

I guess then, you would have to demonstrate (with reliable evidence), that all psyches are incorporated into God.

why is that? just because you don't see something does not mean it is not there otherwise reality would be based on what you know rather than what is.

 

[Noxot]

maybe in a few hundred years humans will learn how to detect spirits. they only recently discovered that microscopic organisms exist.

 

[Noxot]

imo humans will learn how to modify their bodies enough to better experience the spiritual world which includes heaven and hell... if they manage to not end the world for almost no reason at all first.

I think it would be cool if more atheist would take psychedelics, just go all out and lock yourself up in a dark room*. I am not guaranteeing you anything but it might be worth the effort.

 

[bhsmte]

why is that? just because you don't see something does not mean it is not there otherwise reality would be based on what you know rather than what is.

I should then just agree with you, because you say so?

 

[miknik5]

Today God speaks to us by HIS SON

 

[miknik5]

imo humans will learn how to modify their bodies enough to better experience the spiritual world which includes heaven and hell... if they manage to not end the world for almost no reason at all first.

I think it would be cool if more atheist would take psychedelics, just go all out and lock yourself up in a dark room*. I am not guaranteeing you anything but it might be worth the effort.

You are basing faith in the sensual Carnal lower senses as validation of your faith?

Or are you being facetious suggesting these unnecessary things

 

[miknik5]

maybe in a few hundred years humans will learn how to detect spirits. they only recently discovered that microscopic organisms exist.

Already being done through GOD'S HOLY SPIRIT

 

[Noxot]

I should then just agree with you, because you say so?

I would prefer that you did not. I don't know why God makes you how he does. atheist are weird but i'm sure many of them make it in heaven no problem.

 

[miknik5]

why is that? just because you don't see something does not mean it is not there otherwise reality would be based on what you know rather than what is.

Are all "psyches " in submission to The Lord?

If they were there would be no reason for the Word of Hosvto be the judger of the hidden intents of the heart and the mind and the dividing of the soul from the spirit.

All "psyches" would simply belong to Christ and there would be no enemies of the cross
And Christ then meant to say HE came to bring peace?

But that isn't what HE said.

 

[Noxot]

Are all "psyches " in submission to The Lord?

If they were there would be no reason for the Word of Hosvto be the judger of the hidden intents of the heart and the mind and the dividing of the soul from the spirit.

All "psyches" would simply belong to Christ and there would be no enemies of the cross
And Christ then meant to say HE came to bring peace?

But that isn't what HE said.

hey don't blame me, it was the stars of heaven who said "peace to all men on earth". but the night reveals a greater truth than the day does.

 

[miknik5]

hey don't blame me, it was the stars of heaven who said "peace to all men on earth". but the night reveals a greater truth than the day does.

Well if that were true that the night reveals a greater truth than the "light" that would explain why not all men bring their works into the LIGHT to discern what is wrought in God from what isn't

That's the verdict sir, a LIGHT has come into the world and God has given men the light of the knowledge of His Glory in the face if Jesus Christ

So why are you looking to Angels who would only tell you we are servants with those who hold to the testimony of JESUS.