LDS Joseph Smith's Claim of an Apostasy is a Lie

[Peter1000]

Who needs to read the entire BOM? Any Christian can read a few chapters of it and see that it conflicts with God's Word.

JS cannot restore what he was never a part of in the first place. There is plenty, an overwhelming amount of evidence in the BOM for us to call JS a fraud. So one does not need to read a lot of it. It is so different that the verses conflict everywhere.

Just give me one.

 

[Peter1000]

I bear testimony that I KNOW that the Book of Mormon is False and a lie. I know this through the teaching of the Holy Spirit. I know that I will forever know the Book of Mormon to be a lie and a false scripture. I have read the Book of Mormon and prayed to God to know if it's true or false and the Holy Spirit taught me that it is completely false by giving me no burning in the bosom and by guiding me to the Word of God and teaching me that mormonism and the book of mormon are false.

Post #762 is not a rare story. I know people that one day they were X and the next day they were being baptized into the Mormon church. One day they were not ready to join the church so the HS could not enter in, but the next day and a whole new set of circumstances and the HS could enter, and they joined the church to their utter surprise.

So never say never. That's all I can say.

 

[tickingclocker]

.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Post #762 is not a rare story. I know people that one day they were X and the next day they were being baptized into the Mormon church. One day they were not ready to join the church so the HS could not enter in, but the next day and a whole new set of circumstances and the HS could enter, and they joined the church to their utter surprise.

So never say never. That's all I can say.

However I believe hear your church teaches that the Holy Spirit can only be given to somebody by member of your Melchezedek priesthood


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[tickingclocker]

If that were true then mormons wouldn't be whining about him. I'm sure it's not true - I'm sure he sufficiently exposes the real beliefs of mormonism so that seekers see how different and strange from Christianity their real beliefs are. And I'm sure that deters people from joining the mormon religion and even leads many mormons out of their religion and to Christianity.

I think if you REALLY wanted Ed Decker's books and movies on the best seller list you would be telling ironhold to stop badmouthing him. But since you don't, it's pretty clear that your story above is just a spin that has no reality behind it.

His books are still very popular, and sell well to Mormons and non-Mormons. Even after these many years. The more they bad-mouth him, the more publicity they give him. One ex-mormon I used to know didn't read his first book, The God Makers, until they heard of him--through their church. And the rest is history. I don't agree with everything Decker reported or all his opinions on the subject, but for the most part he has the majority of the essentials down pat, regardless of his personal history.

 

[JCFantasy23]

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Thanks

MOD HAT OFF​

 

[fatboys]

I bear testimony that I KNOW that the Book of Mormon is False and a lie. I know this through the teaching of the Holy Spirit. I know that I will forever know the Book of Mormon to be a lie and a false scripture. I have read the Book of Mormon and prayed to God to know if it's true or false and the Holy Spirit taught me that it is completely false by giving me no burning in the bosom and by guiding me to the Word of God and teaching me that mormonism and the book of mormon are false.

So how was this manifest to you?

 

[tickingclocker]

... Mormons will never give up on insisting that there was an apostasy because without that their whole religion falls apart. Their occult religion relies on there having been an apostasy so that Joseph Smith could receive secrets from God (those "secrets" being freemasonry, basically).

John, eventually mormonism will fall apart. All lies do. The longer it remains, propping itself up publicly while hiding its inevitable crumbling around itself from within, the more astounded those stubborn few who remain gripped within its talons will be. Oh, how the "mighty" have fallen, and great is their fall. More and more people are increasingly walking away from it, finally disgusted by the endless lies upon lies, the wearying spiritual acrobatics they must endure to keep believing and promoting it, all while it made them feel smaller and hollower, bit by bit, day by week by month, year in and year out. When I left mormonism behind there was no concept of an ex-Mormon... anywhere. Now? The internet alone is replete with ex-Mormon sites, helping people recover from having the most enduring part of them, their spirituality, damaged. Who ever heard of ex-Mormon yearly conferences before? I didn't until recently. That astounded me! (Where have I been?) Someone must be attending them to be so needed so frequently, and its not "Christians"! There are places that can help the confused and disgusted today when there never were before.

I've often pondered just why the Lord allows such "outside-the-fringe" non-Christian religions to exist. The only consistent reasoning I keep returning to, is, in order to reveal to the Elect, those who truly desire Him, the ever-present dangers of veering off into satisfying human pride instead--and the consequences. We watch Mormons who must perpetually twist, morph, stretch, and cover up the realities of their church history, while being forced to tell half-truths they themselves are instructed with, attempt to promote its wildly imaginative, biblically unsupportable doctrines and human traditions. Believing in mormonism will forever remind me of the caught-in-the-act child who instinctively puts his hands over his eyes, truly believing, if I can't see them they cannot see me. Eventually the child grows up and learns, of course he is seen at all times, by others and by God. The key, however, is "grows up". It's so sad. There are increasingly times I cannot bear to visit this forum and watch it happen one more time.

 

[fatboys]

His books are still very popular, and sell well to Mormons and non-Mormons. Even after these many years. The more they bad-mouth him, the more publicity they give him. One ex-mormon I used to know didn't read his first book, The God Makers, until they heard of him--through their church. And the rest is history. I don't agree with everything Decker reported or all his opinions on the subject, but for the most part he has the majority of the essentials down pat, regardless of his personal history.

I watched both movies and can tell you that there is some truth in what he was saying. Very little. I sat in amazement as he stretched and twisted our beliefs into something I would be repulsed at had I knew nothing about the church. There were out right lies that would have disqualified any of the rest that may have been true. It was really poorly done. What is sad is that you hang on every word and thought that any anti Mormon teaches about the church. Why? I have spent time reading what atheist have to say about religion in general and some of which they say is true. Very little but there is some truth in what they say. Why would in beleive what they say without finding out for myself if what they are saying about Christianity to be true? As for ex Mormons who say this reason or that reason is why they left usually is totally different than reality. Usually they did not all of a sudden read something and have a epiphany. Especially those who come to these websites. They beleive that their story must have validation I order to justify the real reason they left. Over the last forty years I have spoken with ex members it only takes a few probing questions to find out the reason for leaving. For many it is that they just don't want to live the gospel. Christianity is much easier to live with much less pressure to live their life. I mean a Mormon should go to church every week to renew his/her covenants they made with God just at baptism. Which is to take upon ourselves the name of Christ. To remember him always and to obey his commandments. Mainstream Christianity sounds a whole lot easier.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Over the last forty years I have spoken with ex members it only takes a few probing questions to find out the reason for leaving. For many it is that they just don't want to live the gospel. Christianity is much easier to live with much less pressure to live their life. I mean a Mormon should go to church every week to renew his/her covenants they made with God just at baptism. Which is to take upon ourselves the name of Christ. To remember him always and to obey his commandments. Mainstream Christianity sounds a whole lot easier.

this is what Mormons project to the world, but Mormom Stories did a great survey of over 2,000 ex Mormoms and what you say is so not true. I'll try to find the video and link to it.

Please stop projecting to us your opinion. There is data and you are wrong. It is doctrine and finding out the truth.


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[ToBeLoved]

I watched both movies and can tell you that there is some truth in what he was saying. Very little. I sat in amazement as he stretched and twisted our beliefs into something I would be repulsed at had I knew nothing about the church. There were out right lies that would have disqualified any of the rest that may have been true. It was really poorly done. What is sad is that you hang on every word and thought that any anti Mormon teaches about the church. Why? I have spent time reading what atheist have to say about religion in general and some of which they say is true. Very little but there is some truth in what they say. Why would in beleive what they say without finding out for myself if what they are saying about Christianity to be true? As for ex Mormons who say this reason or that reason is why they left usually is totally different than reality. Usually they did not all of a sudden read something and have a epiphany. Especially those who come to these websites. They beleive that their story must have validation I order to justify the real reason they left. Over the last forty years I have spoken with ex members it only takes a few probing questions to find out the reason for leaving. For many it is that they just don't want to live the gospel. Christianity is much easier to live with much less pressure to live their life. I mean a Mormon should go to church every week to renew his/her covenants they made with God just at baptism. Which is to take upon ourselves the name of Christ. To remember him always and to obey his commandments. Mainstream Christianity sounds a whole lot easier.

Christianity is much lovelier. We commune with our God. We don't live for man, but by the spirit

YOU CHOOSE to live that way. No excuses please.


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[BigDaddy4]

So how was this manifest to you?

Lifeless, spiritual darkness at each turn of the page... So unlike reading the Bible, where the Spirit confirms what is written.

 

[fatboys]

this is what Mormons project to the world, but Mormom Stories did a great survey of over 2,000 ex Mormoms and what you say is so not true. I'll try to find the video and link to it.

Please stop projecting to us your opinion. There is data and you are wrong. It is doctrine and finding out the truth.


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Your kidding. All people want validation. They want to be right. No one wants to be wrong. A person that leaves any organization has a story. Some are factual but many inflate or do a right lie. I have caught to many ex Mormons in their embellishment as to why they left and of those who just left and feel they have to justify their Leaving most and I mean most do not get into anti Mormon info until after they have left. And they do so to find justification as to why they left.

 

[fatboys]

Lifeless, spiritual darkness at each turn of the page... So unlike reading the Bible, where the Spirit confirms what is written.

How did you feel?

 

[ArmenianJohn]

So how was this manifest to you?

Partly by the fact that there was no "burning bosom" as the D&C says but instead there were scriptures in the Bible that the Holy Spirit guided me to which confirmed that the BoM is a false book and that mormonism is not Christian at all.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Your kidding. All people want validation. They want to be right. No one wants to be wrong. A person that leaves any organization has a story. Some are factual but many inflate or do a right lie. I have caught to many ex Mormons in their embellishment as to why they left and of those who just left and feel they have to justify their Leaving most and I mean most do not get into anti Mormon info until after they have left. And they do so to find justification as to why they left.

People don't devote themselves to something for 20 or 30 years than walk away without a major issue. You are kidding yourself.

However, I am sad to say I am not going to continue this frustrating conversation with you because you believe your own hype.

Let's get back on topic.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Your kidding. All people want validation. They want to be right. No one wants to be wrong. A person that leaves any organization has a story. Some are factual but many inflate or do a right lie. I have caught to many ex Mormons in their embellishment as to why they left and of those who just left and feel they have to justify their Leaving most and I mean most do not get into anti Mormon info until after they have left. And they do so to find justification as to why they left.

I don't think people walk away from their entire religion than care about telling their story publicly to be right. They will get more flack for publicly speaking out. It is not advantageous for them to do so. Going against the grain is never easy.

It's much easier to just walk away and disappear. So, again you are wrong.

 

[Peter1000]

However I believe hear your church teaches that the Holy Spirit can only be given to somebody by member of your Melchezedek priesthood


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The HS can fall on anyone, any time. He has a body of pure spirit and it is his calling to enter into people and witness to their spirits that Jesus is the Christ and the Savior of the world.

The Mormons believe that there is a permanent gift of the HS that is given when people go through the process of believing in Christ because the HS told your spirit the he is the Christ, having faith in Christ, repenting of their sins, being baptized for the remission of sins, and then receiving the permanent gift of the HS by the laying on of hands by one that has the authority to give this gift. (Acts 2:37-38) (Acts 8:17 & Acts 19:2-6)

 

[BigDaddy4]

How did you feel?

I stated "Lifeless, spiritual darkness at each turn of the page". This isn't about me, though, so let's get back on target.

 

[fatboys]

I stated "Lifeless, spiritual darkness at each turn of the page". This isn't about me, though, so let's get back on target.

So you trust your feelings?