Adam was made from the dust of the ground.....

[Kenny'sID]

Not really.
There is oil in the ground because the Lord provided it. It serves no other purpose. We learned that we can get use coal for a fuel source and there is an abundance of it. Natural gas is plentiful, and accomplishes nothing underground. There are many wild berries and flowers that are edible. God knew before He created the earth what resources its people would need and all those resources have been provided. If you can look at the world around you and not see the brilliance of the Creator, then your eyes are truly blind.

That's much more well stated.

I think it was mostly the cleansing that threw me for a loop. If he expected the earth to multiply as ordered, he'd have to provide the sustenance necessary.

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

There is oil in the ground because the Lord provided it.

Ummmm....no. Oil was formed from layers of dead organisms lying on the sea floor for millions of years. The weight of sediment layers caused pressure and heat transforms the organic material.

If you can look at the world around you and not see the brilliance of the Creator, then your eyes are truly blind

There are so many things that can kill us. I wouldn't call that brilliance. I can say the garden is beautiful without believing there are fairies at the bottom of it.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Ummmm....no. Oil was formed from layers of dead organisms lying on the sea floor for millions of years. The weight of sediment layers caused pressure and heat transforms the organic material.

Then naturally the christian/I will say God had control of that, you can't prove he didn't and I can't prove to you it didn't all just happen by chance... end of argument.

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

Then naturally the christian/I will say God had control of that, you can't prove he didn't and I can't prove to you it didn't all just happen by chance... end of argument.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof

 

[KWCrazy]

God designed me so that, each day, I produce a substantial quantity of fecal material. It serves no obvious purpose. Shall I move next door to you and burn that fecal material as fuel, all the while gracing you with the wonderful aromas generated thereby?

God provided me with the means to raise pigs for the enjoyment of my neighbors. Welcome to the neighborhood.

 

[KWCrazy]

That's much more well stated.

But not as humorous.

 

[KWCrazy]

Ummmm....no. Oil was formed from layers of dead organisms lying on the sea floor for millions of years. The weight of sediment layers caused pressure and heat transforms the organic material.

Substitute pressure for time and you have the results of a global flood before your very disbelieving eyes. Actually, I'm more of a supporter of abiotic theory. There couldn't have been that much plankton in the Middle East.

There are so many things that can kill us. I wouldn't call that brilliance.

You aren't supposed to live forever. You carry a death sentence.

I can say the garden is beautiful without believing there are fairies at the bottom of it.

That's just another reminder how every day I must be thankful that I was given the opportunity to come to the Lord rather than living the hopeless, meaningless life of an atheist. Seriously, if you have nothing worth dying for, you have nothing worth living for. If you see nothing greater than yourself in this world, then your world is a pitiful place indeed. [/quote][/QUOTE]

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

KW:

All geologic evidence falsifies the flood story of the bible. You know all those sediment layers have different ages right?

My life isn't meaningless either. I have everything to live for. Your statement is projection. It wouldn't be the first time you have said something inflammatory on this forum. You're known for sneaking insults into your posts.

 

[KWCrazy]

All geologic evidence falsifies the flood story of the bible. You know all those sediment layers have different ages right?

That's what they say, but that doesn't mean they are correct. They also say the earth is 13 billion years old. They're not right about that, either.

My life isn't meaningless either. I have everything to live for.

I didn't say all atheists, nor did I say you specifically. I'm speaking in general terms here. If you are born, you live, you die, and this is all there is to life, then there is no greater meaning and no greater hope than what is. What does a man have to look forward to if there is no God; failing eyesight, a deteriorating body; a mind that grows progressively less sharp than the year before? Once we near 60 our best days biologically are behind us. Sure, we have family and retirement to look forward to, but how small a window is that break between being free to travel and being constrained by doctor appointments and medication?

No, were I an atheist diagnosed with terminal cancer I would not carry on the struggle to the bitter end. I would quite simply continue my life until I couldn't enjoy it any longer, then take my .357 and go out on my own terms. Why not? There would be no God to judge me I would be far removed from the opinions of others. Should I steal from someone to make my family wealthy? Should I engage in narcotics trafficking and "break bad?" A world without God is a world without consequence beyond the reach of man, and I would certainly be there. Were I to see a sunset without acknowledging that it is God who created beauty, what would I see? Mere refractions of light waves filtered through an evening sky?

No, my post has nothing to do with you. My post is about things beyond your comprehension; about a Creator hidden from you by your own lack of faith; about a world of meaning which no atheist can ever appreciate because to them meaning ends at the boundaries of our existence. To believe deep down that this is all there is and our existence is finite would be devastating indeed. I don't know how some people deal with it.

 

[Kenny'sID]

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof

Oh brother.

You can throw your ever so popular F word around all day long but I don't think too many of us are listening. Do you feel you've proven evolution? Do we throw that word at you constantly (maybe we do, IDK?) You do realize this is a Christian board and Christians have this Habit of believing in God/Christ? right? and we do so by faith, right? But knowing that you come here anyway and constantly tell us to prove our God...we both know that much is a fact. So, what is your purpose? Are you trying to kill our faith? Just bored? Like picking on people in general? Seriously, I just can't seem to get a good answer on that.

This is a public board, and not expecting anyone not to post so, hope you don't take that as my point...point is only.. why? And it's not just you.

You say you have a lot to live for, is doing what you do here part of your purpose in life? I think it was this thread where I made a similar post...I'll try to find it later and add the post number here if it has anything to add...please look it over too before you answer. Not sure who I was replying to when I posted it.... anyway, I'll check it out later.

 

[HitchSlap]

Then naturally

Don't you mean "supernaturally?"

the christian/I will say God had control of that,

Cool.

you can't prove he didn't

There's a lot of things I can't prove didn't happen.

and I can't prove to you it didn't

You might find it easier sticking to those things you can prove.

all just happen by chance...

Who cares if it did?

end of argument.

And just like the proverbial pigeon, he flies away.

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

They also say the earth is 13 billion years old. They're not right about that, either.

Radiometric dating is highly accurate. There are several types of radiometric dating. Potassium-argon, Uranium-lead, Uranium-thorium, Rubidium-strontium. All these methods come to the same conclusion. This is a fact. It's still a fact whether you like it or not. The Hubble telescope has observed galaxies billions of light years away. Your young earth is easily falsified.

If you are born, you live, you die, and this is all there is to life, then there is no greater meaning and no greater hope than what is.

Wishful thinking is a waste of time. Everything dies. That's just how it is. It makes life more meaningful because you only get one shot at it.

What does a man have to look forward to if there is no God; failing eyesight, a deteriorating body; a mind that grows progressively less sharp than the year before?

I'm fully aware that I am going to die. I'm fine with that. All I can do is live my life in the most positive way possible. I focus on the now because it is all I have.

No, were I an atheist diagnosed with terminal cancer I would not carry on the struggle to the bitter end. I would quite simply continue my life until I couldn't enjoy it any longer, then take my .357 and go out on my own terms.

I'm in favor of assisted suicide for those who are suffering with terminal illnesses.

Should I steal from someone to make my family wealthy? Should I engage in narcotics trafficking and "break bad?" A world without God is a world without consequence beyond the reach of man, and I would certainly be there

There is plenty of consequence for your actions without a God involved. Are you suggesting that if it was proven beyond a reasonable doubt that a God didn't exist you would just throw your morality out the window? You wouldn't last very long.

To believe deep down that this is all there is and our existence is finite would be devastating indeed. I don't know how some people deal with it.

If believing in God gives you comfort, all the power to you. It doesn't make it true though. I care about what is true not what I want to be true. I'm not convinced by truth claims about the existence of God and faith is not a virtue.

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

You can throw your ever so popular F word around all day long but I don't think too many of us are listening.

Just pointing out the fallacious reasoning. It's intellectually dishonest to ask someone to prove a negative.

Do you feel you've proven evolution? Do we throw that word at you constantly (maybe we do, IDK?)

Science doesn't deal in proofs. Proven beyond a reasonable doubt? Yes, evolution has an overwhelming amount of evidence. It's supported by an abundance of facts and contradicted by none. The majority of Christians in the world accept evolution.

Are you trying to kill our faith? Just bored? Like picking on people in general? Seriously, I just can't seem to get a good answer on that.

This is the creation-evolution portion of the forum. Evolution has nothing to do with the existence of God. Sometimes these threads go off the rails, which I am guilty of at times. Should we shift back to talking evolution. Do you accept evolution?

You say you have a lot to live for, is doing what you do here part of your purpose in life?

I enjoy the discussions that take place on these forums and there are a lot of nice people here.

 

[HitchSlap]

Your interpretation of reality is entirely subjective. Reality does not stop at the boundaries of the physical world. It includes the totality of existence. It includes things which are not testable.

If they're not testable, how do you know those "things" exist?

 

[Kenny'sID]

Don't you mean "supernaturally?"

No, naturally as in logically.

You might find it easier sticking to those things you can prove.

Might we all.

Who cares if it did?

I do if it goes against the bible, but others keep pushing it for some reason so, think it's safe to say they care as well.

And just like the proverbial pigeon, he flies away.

No, just like the person who stated the usual and logical end to any given similar conversation, nothing more and no one flew anywhere.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Just pointing out the fallacious reasoning. It's intellectually dishonest to ask someone to prove a negative.



Science doesn't deal in proofs. Proven beyond a reasonable doubt? Yes, evolution has an overwhelming amount of evidence. It's supported by an abundance of facts and contradicted by none. The majority of Christians in the world accept evolution.



This is the creation-evolution portion of the forum. Evolution has nothing to do with the existence of God. Sometimes these threads go off the rails, which I am guilty of at times. Should we shift back to talking evolution. Do you accept evolution?



I enjoy the discussions that take place on these forums and there are a lot of nice people here.

I still don think I have the "why", but I'll keep looking. Still, thanks for taking the time.

 

[Kenny'sID]

If they're not testable, how do you know those "things" exist?

Why do you care one way or the other? Or in your words who cares? Clearly you do or you wouldn't be asking..but again...why? Are you trying to save us from out stupidity?

One day I'll ask the right question and get an honest answer on this.

 

[KWCrazy]

Radiometric dating is highly accurate.

Not as accurate as the word of God. Sorry. The Creator is perfect.

Wishful thinking is a waste of time. Everything dies.

True, but some have the gift of eternal life.

I'm fully aware that I am going to die. I'm fine with that.

And then what?
Do you think that sin is without consequence?
Do you think you can lead a life of evil and not be judged for what you've done?
It's wishful thinking to say that you die and that's all there is. The reality is that there WILL be a judgment and you WILL stand before the God you claim doesn't exist.

All I can do is live my life in the most positive way possible.

That won't keep you out of Hell.

There is plenty of consequence for your actions without a God involved.

Not if you don't get caught.
Morality is contra-indicated by natural selection. The strong survive, the weak perish. Man is the only being that identifies good and evil; a throwback to those days when Adam and Eve ate the forbidden fruit and gained the knowledge of good and evil. With knowledge came responsibility.

I care about what is true not what I want to be true.

What makes you so sure that you're right?

 

[JonFromMinnesota]

Not as accurate as the word of God. Sorry. The Creator is perfect.

Radiometric dating doesn't disprove God. It disproves your young earth though. That's a demonstrable fact.

True, but some have the gift of eternal life.

That's fine that you believe that. In my opinion, it's wishful thinking for those who are terrified to face their mortality.

And then what?

What do you mean "And then what?" There is no "and then..." If there is no afterlife like you claim, then it won't matter. I just won't exist. It didn't bother me before I was born, it won't bother me after i'm dead. I won't even be aware of it.

Do you think you can lead a life of evil and not be judged for what you've done?

I don't lead a life of evil. I live my life in the most positive way I can.

It's wishful thinking to say that you die and that's all there is.

Why would I wish to cease to exist? It's just the most likely scenario. It doesn't matter if I don't like it or not. I don't find it rational to believe there is anything else afterwards. There is no evidence for an afterlife.

The reality is that there WILL be a judgment and you WILL stand before the God you claim doesn't exist.

Evidence for your claim? Even if there is a God who judges you after death, i'd imagine that he or she will recognize that i've lived a positive life and didn't harm anyone.

That won't keep you out of Hell.

Threatening someone is immoral. If there is a God and he punishes me for simply not being convinced of their existence, than I am morally superior to them and they deserve no respect.

Not if you don't get caught.

And according to Christianity, a serial killer can get away with it during his or her life and then come to Jesus on their death bed and be rewarded with paradise. They escape punishment there and in the afterlife. Meanwhile, I would be condemned for hell just for not believing. Is that moral? Is that right? It's our job to punish evil as much as we can and reward good whenever we can. Life isn't fair.

The strong survive, the weak perish.

Ummm no. Populations that produce the most offspring survive. A person with Parkinson's disease who had 5 children would be considered "more fit" than a professional basketball player who never had any children.

What makes you so sure that you're right?

I could be wrong. If you can show verifiable evidence that what you believe is true, i'd happily change my mind. Is there a possibility you could be wrong?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Why do you care one way or the other? Or in your words who cares? Clearly you do or you wouldn't be asking..but again...why? Are you trying to save us from out stupidity?

One day I'll ask the right question and get an honest answer on this.

Not your stupidity, but from your ignorance. They are not the same thing. Ignorance can be cured with education, stupidity can't be cured. The U.S. used to be on top of the world when it came to education. Creationists and their ilk are part of the huge problem that we face. If we have poorly educated children the future of our country is much bleaker than if we have well educated children.