LDS Which Church Really Saves?

[Galilee63]

Withwonderingawe,

God The Most High our Heavenly Father is our Judge; not mankind with one another regardless of the worst sins known to mankind about one another.

God our Heavenly Father gives out the measure of His Mercy according to the measure of Mercy and compassion we have given out to all others.

I do not judge God's Religious - Jesus, God and The Holy Spirit and our Blessed Virgin Mother Mary within His Holy Word and with Jesus and Mother Mary appearing to His Religious, Priests and Nuns each Century (The Saints), have taught never to judge and if having done so, to repent to Jesus in genuine remorse, one of the reasons that Jesus' Catholic Church is under attack by satan over past centuries and times, because satan does not want people/souls to repent to Jesus in order for him/satan to claim souls eternally.

satan does not want people receiving all of God's Blessed Sacraments of which are received within God's Catholic Church, nor attending Jesus/God's' Catholic Church for a number of other reasons; too lengthy to divulge at present.

Jesus and Mother Mary delivered The Most Holy Rosary to Saint Dominic in 1214 and 1260 imploring devotion be spread to people around the world to pray The Most Holy Rosary, the greatest weapon against satan of which mankind could pray, Gifted by God The Most High to our Blessed Virgin Mother Mary through Jesus and it has 15 Holy Promises gifted to mankind for those of whom pray The Most Holy Rosary for the Holy Souls in Purgatory and other causes from God Himself and our Heavenly Mother Mary. Satan knows that it was Catholics in certain centuries whom prayed The Holy Rosary against him.

When people/Catholics ceased praying The Holy Rosary in groups and individually, world war 11 broke out despite Jesus and Mother Mary warning many of God's Religious about the forthcoming war and atrocities. God of course knows these things in advance, however requires The Holy Rosary to be prayed by many people for many causes to be heard and answered by Jesus and Jesus and Mother Mary with God our Heavenly Father hear and answer The Holy Rosary on every occasion!

I have had priests, brothers and nuns in my family - all of them celibate just as Jesus was celibate. None of them have molested anyone. I was raised by Nuns and Priests as were my fellow 700 peers in both Catholic Schools I had attended in the 70s and 80s in a large City. None of the Priests and Religious I have known well all of my life have ever committed those atrocious acts. There are so many wonderful good Priests with excellent morals and values over the last century right through to date. If Catholics all prayed The Holy Rosary of which God hears and answers every time in His Holy Will and Holy Ways, then satan would give up and leave God's Catholic Church alone until Jesus appears here to stay and removes satan eternally.

All the best your sister in our Lord Jesus Christ our Merciful Saviour

 

[tickingclocker]

[QUOTE="Super14LDS, post: 69551002, member: 386231]
I won't even reference such utter nonsense. Not even a snippet. When I read it I actually thought it was some wild joke you were pulling on me. Then I looked it up. Words escaped me for a very long while, I must say.

"SCRIPTURE" DOES NOT SHOW ANYTHING OF THE SORT. This "material" of the LDS is NOT biblical by any mean, shape, or form whatsoever.

There was no "hero worship" about it. You obviously have never experienced such an utterly profound gratefulness that you bared the deepest part of your soul in gratitude toward someone, not caring what anyone thought of you? I have. The entire world fades away to nothing at that point, and you NEVER forget so much as one single second. Amazing. Amazing. That you don't get that. Your eyes have been so blinded by what JS told you it "meant" to the simple beauty within that act--which Jesus promised her would be remembered forever. And it has--by every true believer saved through His sacrifice. Jesus even plainly explains why she did it. No mention of a "wife". None. Ever. And would even Judas ever dare talk to "a revered wife of Jesus" in such a deeply scornful manner??? Its so sad that you don't see it for what it is. That poor woman's precious sacrifice, being ABUSED for JS fanciful purposes?? How can YOU stand it, never mind our horror at such blasphemy of her memory, twisting the love and Word of the Lord into something so hideously human?? This woman's love for JESUS is revealed here more than His for her. Hard to believe, but true. Why? Because He is showing Mary has truly "got it" that she was a sinner, now saved through God's grace. I'd have poured oil on Jesus' head and feet if I, too, were able to then. Notice, scripture never mentions Jesus singling Mary out for rebuke in denying that He would die soon for the sins of the world. Only the men. She knew. Of all people, by faith a woman accepted the sad truths of scripture better than men did. Mormonism abuses women so terribly. There's nothing which so profoundly shows that as it does here, in their very own words.

Of all the times I have ever read that story, never once did I ever think "hero worship", btw. (You can tell a male thought up that one.) That was the act of someone who had KNOWN all too well that they had once been PROFOUNDLY and IRREVOCABLY filthy, and been given the FREE gift of an entirely new, CLEANSED life--forever, through being washed in the saving blood of Jesus Christ. Nothing less. No wonder Mormons don't take seriously the moment of realizing their eternal salvation is a gift. No wonder. They don't have it!! My eyes filled with tears at such a cowardly loss you have in failing to fathom the absolute beauty within divine salvation. When are you ever going to wake up to the fact that most of mormonism was MADE UP as the original founders went along, to make it appear more "holy" than it ever can conceivably be? I pity Mormons from the depths of my soul.

Lord, I hope and pray Mary never hears about this LDS "material" in heaven. Let her know that even today, just as you promised, EVERY SINGLE BELIEVER in You knows exactly how she felt at that very moment. If we cannot do it by not living in Your time, we are grateful she was able to anoint You! Her joy of salvation is the experience You meant would be instantly recognized forever. May we always remember that moment moving from death to eternal life in You!

 

[Kenny'sID]

Beloved misinformed you with "That Jesus became God after He died with no sin. Before that He was not God"

We believe Jesus is Yahweh of the Old Testament. He is the Son of God/El, firstborn of the spirit, thus heir to the throne of his Father. He was ordained to Godhood by his God, see Heb 1, before this earth was created. He had the power of God to create and is called the Eternal Father of Heaven and Earth because he created it.

Actually, I don't believe Jesus was or is God, he's Gods son and don't ask me where I got that from, as I can't discuss it. I simply disagreed with another poster on another thread who claimed that Jesus/God were one in the same and gave some scripture to support it but got reprimanded by a mod. I didn't really understand why I got busted and the one who made the comment Jesus was God did not. Still not even sure what I got busted for...it was over my head.

So that's all I have to say about that.

 

[fatboys]

Actually, I don't believe Jesus was or is God, he's Gods son and don't ask me where I got that from, as I can't discuss it. I simply disagreed with another poster on another thread who claimed that Jesus/God were one in the same and gave some scripture to support it but got reprimanded by a mod. I didn't really understand why I got busted and the one who made the comment Jesus was God did not. Still not even sure what I got busted for...it was over my head.

So that's all I have to say about that.

I can understand the reason why you believe Jesus is not God. It seems that you have been thinking about this for awhile. Because it is something you have not had a lot of time to put things together for this belief you are not comfortable in shaping more details. Can I asked what started you thinking this way?

 

[tickingclocker]

Oh my gosh. Do not tell me that Jesus Christ needed to be married?

What is wrong with you people. Your entire life is delusion.

Same goes with the LDs version of the "holy ghost" being a separate divine being from God the Father and Jesus the Son? The LDS holy ghost never married, being a "spirit". Yet he became a god? Without marriage, proxy or otherwise? How did JS slip around that tricky wickett? I'm sure he made something up you must believe in order to hold onto mormonism by your fingernails.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I can understand the reason why you believe Jesus is not God. It seems that you have been thinking about this for awhile. Because it is something you have not had a lot of time to put things together for this belief you are not comfortable in shaping more details. Can I asked what started you thinking this way?

FWIW, that belief won't change so, I guess not being able to discuss it because of the incident with the mod really doesn't matter. However I do appreciate your concern.

It may have just been a forum specific offense, but until I know for sure, I'll leave it alone. Also FWIW, I'm not really complaining...much, the last forum a I hung out at, 90% of the posters here would have been already booted for simply getting into a heated discussion. Worlds apart from the beauty of generally being able to speak ones mind here, and another reason I will be careful.

 

[tickingclocker]

Mmmm never read that before so I went to FairMormon to look it up. Buerger left the Church in 1992 and he wrote this book after he left. Sooooo he's not exactly an authority I would trust being able to interpret temple ceremonies. I don't think the Church has an official stand on whether Jesus was married or not. When asked Hinckley said "Brethren it doesn't matter if the pearly gates swing or slide just as long as they open"

http://www.fairmormon.org/perspectives/publications/an-imperfect-history

"In the ordinance, a participant is anointed as a "priest and king" or a "priestess and queen", and is sealed to the highest degree of salvation available in Mormon theology. Those who participate in this ordinance are said to have their "calling and election made sure",[2][3] and their celestial marriage "sealed by the holy spirit of promise".[4] They are said to have received the "more sure word of prophecy"."... ....The church has not allowed historians to have access to second anointing records subsequent to 1941; therefore, the current frequency of anointings is obscure..... ....The "first anointing" refers to the washing and anointing part of the Endowment ceremony, in which a person is anointed to become a king and priest or a queen and priestess unto God.... ....The second anointing is given only to married couples."
---https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_anointing

It seems this was a pretty popular early LDS rite.... until it became "commonplace" even to them. It was then regulated, re-regulated, and over-regulated by LDS leaders until only Quorum wives can perform it. They also did this for dead people. How can you wash the feet of people long dead? Only in the LDS.... (More like a faint.)

Only those who have no clue at all of real mormonism bother to accept it. Once they find out?

Whoosh!

 

[tickingclocker]

I personally, didn't like it at all.

No, I didn't either. It brought me down to the same level of JS's imagination. Won't do it again.

 

[fatboys]

FWIW, that belief won't change so, I guess not being able to discuss it because of the incident with the mod really doesn't matter. However I do appreciate your concern.

It may have just been a forum specific offense, but until I know for sure, I'll leave it alone. Also FWIW, I'm not really complaining...much, the last forum a I hung out at, 90% of the posters here would have been already booted for simply getting into a heated discussion. Worlds apart from the beauty of generally being able to speak ones mind here, and another reason I will be careful.

Ok

 

[Rescued One]

Got anything regarded as officially-sanctioned material?

If only scriptures are officially sanctioned, why aren't only scriptures used in teaching the members? The lesson manuals have been approved and published and distributed by your church.

• “The elect of God comprise a very select group, an inner circle of faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They are the portion of church members who are striving with all their hearts to keep the fulness of the gospel law in this life so that they can become inheritors of the fulness of gospel rewards in the life to come” (McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 217).
  Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual, (2000), Chapter 19, Eternal life, 51–52

Election has to be earned.

 

[Rescued One]

[citation needed]

I've seen numerous quips from leaders speculating on the topic, but I've not seen anything with official weight that says so.

You ignore the truth when the citation is given; you often just become silent.

 

[withwonderingawe]

Withwonderingawe,

God The Most High our Heavenly Father is our Judge; not mankind with one another regardless of the worst sins known to mankind about one another.

God our Heavenly Father gives out the measure of His Mercy according to the measure of Mercy and compassion we have given out to all others.

I do not judge God's Religious - Jesus, God and The Holy Spirit and our Blessed Virgin Mother Mary within His Holy Word and with Jesus and Mother Mary appearing to His Religious, Priests and Nuns each Century (The Saints), have taught never to judge and if having done so, to repent to Jesus in genuine remorse, one of the reasons that Jesus' Catholic Church is under attack by satan over past centuries and times, because satan does not want people/souls to repent to Jesus in order for him/satan to claim souls eternally.

satan does not want people receiving all of God's Blessed Sacraments of which are received within God's Catholic Church, nor attending Jesus/God's' Catholic Church for a number of other reasons; too lengthy to divulge at present.

Jesus and Mother Mary delivered The Most Holy Rosary to Saint Dominic in 1214 and 1260 imploring devotion be spread to people around the world to pray The Most Holy Rosary, the greatest weapon against satan of which mankind could pray, Gifted by God The Most High to our Blessed Virgin Mother Mary through Jesus and it has 15 Holy Promises gifted to mankind for those of whom pray The Most Holy Rosary for the Holy Souls in Purgatory and other causes from God Himself and our Heavenly Mother Mary. Satan knows that it was Catholics in certain centuries whom prayed The Holy Rosary against him.

When people/Catholics ceased praying The Holy Rosary in groups and individually, world war 11 broke out despite Jesus and Mother Mary warning many of God's Religious about the forthcoming war and atrocities. God of course knows these things in advance, however requires The Holy Rosary to be prayed by many people for many causes to be heard and answered by Jesus and Jesus and Mother Mary with God our Heavenly Father hear and answer The Holy Rosary on every occasion!

I have had priests, brothers and nuns in my family - all of them celibate just as Jesus was celibate. None of them have molested anyone. I was raised by Nuns and Priests as were my fellow 700 peers in both Catholic Schools I had attended in the 70s and 80s in a large City. None of the Priests and Religious I have known well all of my life have ever committed those atrocious acts. There are so many wonderful good Priests with excellent morals and values over the last century right through to date. If Catholics all prayed The Holy Rosary of which God hears and answers every time in His Holy Will and Holy Ways, then satan would give up and leave God's Catholic Church alone until Jesus appears here to stay and removes satan eternally.

All the best your sister in our Lord Jesus Christ our Merciful Saviour

My Grandmother and her sister were orphaned and were taken to a Catholic orphanage in Lubbock Texas. My Great Aunt became a nun and a teacher there at the orphanage. My Grandmother took out her first vows but decided against it, later she married and had my mother. So I have a little background in the Church. Grandma married a communist and thus an atheist who would not let my mother be baptized but grandma did it behind his back. Later he allowed her to go to a Catholic school but not take the catechism, he deserted the family at some point and that’s when Mom started her religious education.

She found the God the sisters were teaching her about was not the God she naturally prayed to, she just rejected the Trinity even at a young age. She also rejected the need for babies to be baptized. When it came time for her first Holy Communion she just didn’t show up.

She remained prayerful and there was always a Bible next to her bed. She told me it was the Gospel of John which really brought her to that born again experience. But she could not find a church where she felt she fit in, I remember going to a lot of different churches as she searched for the one.

When I was born, on Christmas day she wanted to thank the Lord for me but did not want to have me baptized. Some Mormon friends invited her to have me blessed in their church. She thought that sounded nice so I was blessed and my name ended up on the roles of the LDS church as a child of record, but not a member.

She read the Book of Mormon at the time but thought nothing of it. Eight years later she was given an anti Mormon pamphlet and the thought came to her ‘I don’t remember reading that in the Book of Mormon’ so she dusted off her old book and began reading again. Within a few days she called the missionaries and asked to be baptized. They were a little surprised and told her she would have to take the lessons first. Any way that was 55 years ago and she has been very grateful for that anti Mormon pamphlet which brought her into the Church. My father joined 5 years after her and the whole family has remained very dedicated and active.

My mom's best friend is Catholic she's a wonderful woman who does some lay clergy kind of things. She came up to visit us at the 100th year celebration of the Cathedral of the Madeleine in Salt Lake City. The Mormon Tabernacle Choir sang for it like they had done 100 years ago. It was a wonderful experience.

 

[withwonderingawe]

"In the ordinance, a participant is anointed as a "priest and king" or a "priestess and queen", and is sealed to the highest degree of salvation available in Mormon theology. Those who participate in this ordinance are said to have their "calling and election made sure",[2][3] and their celestial marriage "sealed by the holy spirit of promise".[4] They are said to have received the "more sure word of prophecy"."... ....The church has not allowed historians to have access to second anointing records subsequent to 1941; therefore, the current frequency of anointings is obscure..... ....The "first anointing" refers to the washing and anointing part of the Endowment ceremony, in which a person is anointed to become a king and priest or a queen and priestess unto God.... ....The second anointing is given only to married couples."
---https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_anointing

It seems this was a pretty popular early LDS rite.... until it became "commonplace" even to them. It was then regulated, re-regulated, and over-regulated by LDS leaders until only Quorum wives can perform it. They also did this for dead people. How can you wash the feet of people long dead? Only in the LDS.... (More like a faint.)

Only those who have no clue at all of real mormonism bother to accept it. Once they find out?

Whoosh!

The second anointing is still done today but very rarely, it's very scared. One has to have had a certain kind of experience literally;

"Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Rev 3

"Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him." John 14:23

In the Book of Mormon there is a prophet who because of his exceeding faith sees beyond the veil

"And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, .... and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting. Wherefore, having this perfect knowledge of God, he could not be kept from within the veil; therefore he saw Jesus; and he did minister unto him" Ether 3

Yes this happens in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints,

 

[BornAgainChristian1]

Did Jesus Christ die and take on your sin so you can be reconciled back to Himself? Are you saved through Christ or is this not an Anabaptist belief? I honestly do not know.

Christ's atonement payed for all sin's of those who acknowledge Him as their Savior.


John 3 :
16 For God so loveth the world, that he hath given his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.

17 For God sent not his Son into the world, that he should condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved.

18 He that believeth in him, is not condemned: but he that believeth not, is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the Name of that only begotten Son of God.

19 And this is the condemnation, that that light came into the world, and men loved darkness rather than that light, because their deeds were evil.

20 For every man that evil doeth, hateth the light, neither cometh to light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

21 But he that doeth truth, cometh to the light, that his deeds might be made manifest, that they are wrought according to God.

So no it is not a alphabet belief but a biblical proof.

 

[BornAgainChristian1]

The mistranslated Book of Abraham that is a fraud. The papyrai contains ancient burial text.

That Book of Abraham.

The fact is the book of Abraham is a fraud should also prove the translation of those elusive missing golden tablets are a fraud knowing they were "translated" by the same charlatan Joey Smith.

 

[ToBeLoved]

If only scriptures are officially sanctioned, why aren't only scriptures used in teaching the members? The lesson manuals have been approved and published and distributed by your church.

• “The elect of God comprise a very select group, an inner circle of faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They are the portion of church members who are striving with all their hearts to keep the fulness of the gospel law in this life so that they can become inheritors of the fulness of gospel rewards in the life to come” (McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 217).
  Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual, (2000), Chapter 19, Eternal life, 51–52

Election has to be earned.

They really know how to make Jesus death and salvation look like nothing. Why they even use the name "Jesus Christ" in their name is shameful.

What's their definition of the gospel and gospel law?

 

[ToBeLoved]

The fact is the book of Abraham is a fraud should also prove the translation of those elusive missing golden tablets are a fraud knowing they were "translated" by the same charlatan Joey Smith.

Well and get this.

Little Joe didn't even look at the tablets. He put a stone in the hat and covered his eyes with the hat.

So, I"m not even sure why he made up that story with the gold plates. Someone did an article that no one during the time of Moroni ever wrote on gold plates. It doesn't exist.

 

[Super14LDS]

Actually, I don't believe Jesus was or is God, he's Gods son and don't ask me where I got that from, as I can't discuss it. I simply disagreed with another poster on another thread who claimed that Jesus/God were one in the same and gave some scripture to support it but got reprimanded by a mod. I didn't really understand why I got busted and the one who made the comment Jesus was God did not. Still not even sure what I got busted for...it was over my head.

So that's all I have to say about that.

Recently a friend pointed out how plural words are used to decribe God before the fall, switching to singular after the fall.

It would be wonderful should you choose to start a new thread or contribute freely in debate threads, so we can discuss what the bible has to say on this central subject.

 

[tickingclocker]

Election has to be earned.

Election hast o be earned ------ IN MORMONISM ONLY. State the truth of the matter. Because the Christian has no effect upon election, which is God's sole jurisdiction.

 

[BornAgainChristian1]

Well and get this.

Little Joe didn't even look at the tablets. He put a stone in the hat and covered his eyes with the hat.

So, I"m not even sure why he made up that story with the gold plates. Someone did an article that no one during the time of Moroni ever wrote on gold plates. It doesn't exist.

The question is who is this unknown angel named Moroni that only the mormons mention to justify their fallacy's.