Hey Republicans, Can We End the Red Scare Already? Liberals Aren't Communists!

[KarateCowboy]

I explained the differences between Norwegian socialism and Soviet socialism multiple times, to you. You went on ignoring them.

I recall you saying that Norway doesn't have millions dying. That's like saying "Norway doesn't have Russian as it's main language". That doesn't demonstrate any difference in the systems, much less the significance of that difference.

 

[KarateCowboy]

@KarateCowboy Let me ask you again: Doesn't it matter to you that the mass deaths you're blaming on socialism have never occurred in the kind of socialism that exists in Norway?

Doesn't it matter to you that the number dead from socialism could wipe out Norway more than 20 times over? The fact that Norwegians get by despite their dabbling in history's most evil does not warrant bringing it over here.

 

[pakicetus]

I recall you saying that Norway doesn't have millions dying. That's like saying "Norway doesn't have Russian as it's main language". That doesn't demonstrate any difference in the systems, much less the significance of that difference.

I described very major differences between Norway and the Soviet Union, North Korea, et al. in a previous post:

Socialism may be socialism, but different kinds of socialism are vastly different from each other. The fact is that mass deaths don't occur in the kind of socialism a lot of Democrats support, which is why you're only listing countries that are way different from the places we want to imitate, and not Germany, France, the U.K., Canada, Australia, Sweden, or Denmark.

Don't you recognize a pattern in the countries you listed? They tend to be totalitarian one-party states, while Germany et alii are multi-party democracies which max out measures of civil liberty. They tend to have government ownership of the means of production, while Germany idi aljai do not. They tend to have a vast neurotic hatred of minorities and dissidents, while Germany eti alyoy are no more prejudiced than other countries. Don't you think those factors might be to blame for mass deaths, and not free college, universal healthcare, collective bargaining, or paid family leave?

 

[BrianJK]

That's like asking me to prove that the Holocaust happened.

so no? Since it's pretty much the basis for all your arguments and all...

 

[BrianJK]

The fact that Norwegians get by despite their dabbling in history's most evil does not warrant bringing it over here.

Norwegians are letting people starve and die from sickness so rich people can have more stuff? Since that's the most evil in history...

 

[Deviant Writer]

@KarateCowboy Let me ask you again: Doesn't it matter to you that the mass deaths you're blaming on socialism have never occurred in the kind of socialism that exists in Norway?

If you have to ask multiple times, you've already got your answer.

 

[nightflight]

@KarateCowboy Let me ask you again: Doesn't it matter to you that the mass deaths you're blaming on socialism have never occurred in the kind of socialism that exists in Norway?

Not while they got NATO money.

 

[The Cadet]

That's like asking me to prove that the Holocaust happened.

No, it's like asking to prove that the philosophies present in Germany during the Nazi regime, particularly among the political elite, were responsible for the Holocaust. Which is pretty easy to do. Now, if I were to ask you to draw a direct line between their economic policies and the holocaust, you might have a slightly harder time, because their economic policies had distinctly little to do with the holocaust! So please, let's see it. Tie the "socialist" policies of Norway to the death of millions.

Oh, you can't? Because they have nothing to do with each other?

Again, I'm going to reiterate the same point, because some people can't figure this one out. I mean, it's not particularly hard.

This is where your absurd claim that "socialism is socialism" completely falls apart, because we are clearly talking about completely different things.

What led to the deaths of 150 million people in Russia, China, and Cambodia? There's a lot of analysis on this, but some of the most important factors include:

• Insistence on a one-party political state and the brutal suppression and murder of people who rejected the ideology
• Famines brought on by Lysenkoism, a pseudoscientific ideal that appealed to socialists
• Famines brought on by forced redistribution of farmland into the hands of people with no idea how farming worked
• Forced resettlement under cruel conditions
• Specifically in Cambodia, the political philosophy that professionals and intellectuals are "impure" and need to be purged

Here are the key policies on Bernie Sanders's plan:

• Medicare for all - universal healthcare financed by taxation
• Government-sponsored colleges, financed by taxation
• Public works projects to repair our crumbling infrastructure, financed by taxation
• Breaking up the big banks

Hm. Yes, clearly we are talking about the same thing here! When Bernie Sanders speaks of socialism, it's exactly the same thing as the political and social reforms that led to the death of millions in Russia, China, and Cambodia! Clearly there are direct parallels between Sanders wanting to make college easier to attain and Pol Pot wanting to kill everyone with an education.


And because KarateCowboy has me on ignore, if someone would like to copy-paste that into their own post so he can stop being so wrong, please, go right ahead.

 

[Armoured]

KarateCowboy said: ↑
That's like asking me to prove that the Holocaust happened.

No, it's like asking to prove that the philosophies present in Germany during the Nazi regime, particularly among the political elite, were responsible for the Holocaust. Which is pretty easy to do. Now, if I were to ask you to draw a direct line between their economic policies and the holocaust, you might have a slightly harder time, because their economic policies had distinctly little to do with the holocaust! So please, let's see it. Tie the "socialist" policies of Norway to the death of millions.

Oh, you can't? Because they have nothing to do with each other?

Again, I'm going to reiterate the same point, because some people can't figure this one out. I mean, it's not particularly hard.

This is where your absurd claim that "socialism is socialism" completely falls apart, because we are clearly talking about completely different things.

What led to the deaths of 150 million people in Russia, China, and Cambodia? There's a lot of analysis on this, but some of the most important factors include:

• Insistence on a one-party political state and the brutal suppression and murder of people who rejected the ideology
• Famines brought on by Lysenkoism, a pseudoscientific ideal that appealed to socialists
• Famines brought on by forced redistribution of farmland into the hands of people with no idea how farming worked
• Forced resettlement under cruel conditions
• Specifically in Cambodia, the political philosophy that professionals and intellectuals are "impure" and need to be purged

Here are the key policies on Bernie Sanders's plan:

• Medicare for all - universal healthcare financed by taxation
• Government-sponsored colleges, financed by taxation
• Public works projects to repair our crumbling infrastructure, financed by taxation
• Breaking up the big banks

Hm. Yes, clearly we are talking about the same thing here! When Bernie Sanders speaks of socialism, it's exactly the same thing as the political and social reforms that led to the death of millions in Russia, China, and Cambodia! Clearly there are direct parallels between Sanders wanting to make college easier to attain and Pol Pot wanting to kill everyone with an education.

And because KarateCowboy has me on ignore, if someone would like to copy-paste that into their own post so he can stop being so wrong, please, go right ahead.

 

[Audacious]

Clearly there are direct parallels between Sanders wanting to make college easier to attain and Pol Pot wanting to kill everyone with an education.

This line had me in stitches!

Edit: oh, the Cadet said it. Well it's still hilarious!

 

[Deviant Writer]

And because KarateCowboy has me on ignore, if someone would like to copy-paste that into their own post so he can stop being so wrong, please, go right ahead.

I've got Cowboy on ignore. For reasons you might have already guessed. Do you really think supplying him the correct information is going to make him change his mind and not be wrong?

 

[Thunder Peel]

It's easy to see why many think Democrats are leaning communist. After all, many communists have used systems like socialism, class warfare and biased media to further their ultimate goals. Look no further than Lenin himself:

"The goal of socialism is communism."--Vladimir Lenin

"Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism."--Vladimir Lenin

"The press should be not only a collective propagandist and a collective agitator, but also a collective organizer of the masses." --Vladimir Lenin

"Democracy is indispensable to socialism."--Vladimir Lenin

"It is true that liberty is precious; so precious that it must be carefully rationed."--Vladimir Lenin


"The way to crush the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation."--Vladimir Lenin

"When one makes a Revolution, one cannot mark time; one must always go forward - or go back. He who now talks about the 'freedom of the press' goes backward, and halts our headlong course towards Socialism."--Vladimir Lenin

"The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class are to represent and repress them in parliament."--Vladimir Lenin

"Give me four years to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted."--Vladimir Lenin

"Capitalists are no more capable of self-sacrifice than a man is capable of lifting himself up by his own bootstraps."--Vladimir Lenin


The idea that somehow the left isn't ultimately working toward this end is laughable. Whether they care to admit it or not, power is what they seek and they won't be satisfied until everyone looks, thinks and acts exactly the same. Socialism doesn't encourage betterment, nor does it reward effort. However, it does tend to have a nasty habit of morphing into something even more oppressive when given enough time.

 

[Deviant Writer]

I
The idea that somehow the left isn't ultimately working toward this end is laughable.

We aren't. You merely paste some quotes by the same person and say that describes us on the American left.

Conservatives talk all this smack about wanting small government, but when push comes to shove, who is their front-runner? Donald Trump, who's going to do nothing to decrease the size of government, who will err on the side of security.

 

[Eryk]

The idea that somehow the left isn't ultimately working toward this end is laughable.

Communists are mortal enemies of the center-left, because they preserve capitalism by making it less onerous. Read up on the far-left's opposition to the New Deal.

Unregulated capitalism is the best friend of the far left because it drives the people to revolution.

 

[Sistrin]

The Republican Party...Donald Trump...Ted Cruz...Ben Carson...Rush Limbaugh...Michael Savage...Mark Levin...Glenn Beck...Ann Coulter...The Washington Times...The New York Post...Breitbart...WorldNetDaily...RedState...NewsMax...TownHall...The Blaze...The Daily Signal...CNS News...Forbes...The Daily Caller...Fox News...Eric Bolling...Sean Hannity...Tom McInerney...Greg Gutfeld...Steve Doocy...Andrew Napolitano...Monica Crowley...Allen West...Bill O'Reilly...

But you know better than all of them.

Merriam-Webster defines communism as "a totalitarian system of government in which a single authoritarian party controls state-owned means of production"

Sounds like the modern Democrat party to me.

No one in the Democratic Party is calling for a totalitarian one-party state...

Except for all of those calling for amnesty, open borders, and arguing in support of illegal immigration. The illegal immigration issue to the Democrat party is and always has been defined by one overriding concern, bringing in as many new Democrat voters as possible. It has never been about compassion or upholding American values. It has always been about establishing Democrat control and thus a one-party state.

...or the elimination of all private property...

Federal forfeiture and seizure laws have rendered this de facto in all but a few cases.

...or a completely egalitarian stateless society...

Here you have a point. The modern Democrat party loves the state, and only seeks to expand its power.

If these major Republican figures think that's what Obama or Sanders or other Democrats advocate, their brains are broken.

During a radio interview in 2001 then Senator Obama lamented the nature of the US Constitution and the limits of power it imposes on the Government. More recently his comments following the Citizens United case were, and remain, legitimate causes for concern. Bernie Sanders core essence is that of a central government control freak. Hillary Clinton has illustrated time and again the laws of this country mean nothing to her; only power does. They may not be practicing communist, but any of them would be perfectly at home in the communist party.

On the other hand, if they're just getting the definition of communism horribly wrong, and think raising taxes on the rich....

Sanders on taxing the rich:

Bernie Sanders: A 90 Percent Tax Rate Isn't Too High

Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders, a Democratic candidate for president, thinks a 90 percent tax rate on the wealthiest Americans might not be too high.

Sanders made the remark during an interview with CNBC.

When talking about President Dwight Eisenhower's administration, Sanders said, "I think the highest marginal tax rate was something like 90 percent."

CNBC's John Harwood then said, "It was 90. When you think about 90 percent, you don't think that's obviously too high."

Sanders replied, "No.

Source: http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/Bernie-Sanders-tax-wealthy-90-percent/2015/05/27/id/647105/

You don't see that as confiscatory?

...that means they couldn't pass my high school government class.

Yeah, about that...

 

[Albion]

We aren't. You merely paste some quotes by the same person and say that describes us on the American left.

Conservatives talk all this smack about wanting small government, but when push comes to shove, who is their front-runner? Donald Trump, who's going to do nothing to decrease the size of government, who will err on the side of security.

Whoa. "Their front-runner?"

Where'd you get the idea that Donald Trump is a model of conservatism? He calls himself a conservative but immediately qualifies it by adding that he's a "common sense" conservative, meaning that he's not a down-the-line conservative like Ted Cruz who is the choice of the leading Conservative organizations.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

Whoa. "Their front-runner?"

Where'd you get the idea that Donald Trump is a model of conservatism? He calls himself a conservative but immediately qualifies it by adding that he's a "common sense" conservative, meaning that he's not a down-the-line conservative like Ted Cruz who is the choice of the leading Conservative organizations.

Trump correctly called whiny Ted a "basket case". Trump is beating the pants off cruz in the primaries, that's why Trump is the clear front-runner in the Republican primaries. He's sweeping every state! You have to admit, Trump is rather amazing the way he dwarfs dummies like weasel cruz and robot rubio. By the way, Trump just got endorsed by Chris Christie - notice that cruz and Roboto didn't get that endorsement!

 

[Albion]

Trump correctly called whiny Ted a "basket case". Trump is beating the pants off cruz in the primaries, that's why Trump is the clear front-runner in the Republican primaries.

All right, but that's not what was said in that post that I replied to or by me in my response. I even highlighted--in red--the point I was addressing.

 

[ArmenianJohn]

All right, but that's not what was said in that post that I replied to or by me in my response. I even highlighted--in red--the point I was addressing.

But aren't you amazed and impressed with how Trump is just destroying guys like cruz and roboto? Cruz is hilarious - he thinks he's well-liked and popular but he's apparently got a minority fraction of the conservative vote. He's not liked by many and in fact he's hated by many. Roboto Rubio (aka the Waterboy) is like cruz jr.

Also, cruz is probably not even going to be allowed to run - he's a Canadian and an illegal.

 

[Albion]

But aren't you amazed and impressed with how Trump is just destroying guys like cruz and roboto?

Somewhat surprised at the dexterity he's shown in this regard, but that only makes me think he probably will be quite a successful president, contrary to the wags who tried to sell the idea that Putin or other world leaders would eat him alive like some novice attempting to negotiate anything.