Failed Prophecy of the Church

[smaneck]

That is true, and is till true.

What you are not aware of is that their lifetime is not over yet. You know very well that the physical life is only part of the "lifetime", in this case, the word used is the "generation". To them, and also to everyone else, there is yet one last step to walk.

Yes, the JW are constantly revising their interpretations of scripture as well.

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

That is true, and is till true.

What you are not aware of is that their lifetime is not over yet. You know very well that the physical life is only part of the "lifetime", in this case, the word used is the "generation". To them, and also to everyone else, there is yet one last step to walk.

That is the kind of rationalization people use to somehow try to re-align their beliefs with reality and indisputable facts.

Christianity started out as a doomsday religion - and it still is, with each new generation being ABSOLUTELY sure that theirs are the final days, the signs are everywhere, and Jesus is going to come back any moment now.

 

[juvenissun]

That is the kind of rationalization people use to somehow try to re-align their beliefs with reality and indisputable facts.

Christianity started out as a doomsday religion - and it still is, with each new generation being ABSOLUTELY sure that theirs are the final days, the signs are everywhere, and Jesus is going to come back any moment now.

If you like to distort the proportion, then any religion is a doomsday religion.
The real meaning is not on the doomsday, but on what one does before the doomsday.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

"this generation" or "the next generation"

Ammmmmmh! Okay..... mmmmh!

If The Simpsons was started back in 343 B.C. and till to-date there are still Simpsons who can trace their tree roots back to that time... Would the Generation of Simpson's be still alive today? So my question is this, would the generations of the Lord's time be still Alive Today?

That's ALL!

 

[juvenissun]

Ammmmmmh! Okay..... mmmmh!

If The Simpsons was started back in 343 B.C. and till to-date there are still Simpsons who can trace their tree roots back to that time... Would the Generation of Simpson's be still alive today? So my question is this, would the generations of the Lord's time be still Alive Today?

That's ALL!

They are not physically alive. But their journey to the Heaven have not completed yet.
So were everyone since the time of Jesus. "Their generation" is not over yet.
That is why millions of people are still waiting in Rev. 6.

 

[Linet Kihonge]

new generation

Yes, each new generation right from Adam's Time believed the Promised birth of the Son of God was on the way. He still came and they barely noticed (especially Jews)!!! In fact, someone from this forum asked, "In what city Jesus would be Born?"

What do I SAY!!! Nada! None! Nothin'!

 

[Linet Kihonge]

That is why millions of people are still waiting in Rev. 6.

We're on the same page on that too... forgot they are yet to be resurrected!

 

[Hank77]

Didn't Jonah's prophecies fail? How about the one by Jesus "this generation will not pass away until you see the end of these things?"

The temple and the city was destroyed just as Jesus said it would be within that generation and some standing there did not see death before it did happen.

The first generation to read Lk 21:32 most certainly believed that they'd see Jesus return and the world end before the last of the apostles passed away. But the religion persisted beyond that point.

Do you take Jesus as a prophet? Don't you understand what does that statement mean? It is a wonderful statement and it is true.

Not one stone will be left standing. It happened in 70 AD. That word 'world' is not 'kosmos' as in the physical world. The 'world' that ended was the Jewish world, the Mosaic economy. The theocracy, with the temple worship, etc.

Acts calls him that. And I know what the first generation of Christians believed that statement meant, namely that Jesus would return in their own lifetime.

It doesn't matter what they believed, it matters what they asked. They didn't ask about the 'kosmos' but about the 'aion'. What matters is that Jesus gave a prophecy and it was fulfilled. He was not talking about the second coming and the end of the 'kosmos' but the end of the 'aion' the age/era.

 

[dlamberth]

Does your religion say anything about that?

Yes. When we see Love, Compassion and helping those in need, we see Truth and God made a reality.

 

[smaneck]

If you like to distort the proportion, then any religion is a doomsday religion.
The real meaning is not on the doomsday, but on what one does before the doomsday.

On what grounds would you call the Baha'i Faith a 'doomsday' religion?

 

[smaneck]

The temple and the city was destroyed just as Jesus said it would be within that generation and some standing there did not see death before it did happen.

That part yes, but not this part:

"And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory;
Luke 21:27
He hasn't return yet, and that generation passed away a long time ago.

 

[Hank77]

That part yes, but not this part:

"And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory;
Luke 21:27
He hasn't return yet, and that generation passed away a long time ago.

I respectfully disagree. Here is the corresponding verses from Matthew. I apologize for the long post!!

Mat 24:30 and then shall appear the sign of the Son of Man in the heaven; and then shall all the tribes [not nations] of the earth[soil, land, region] smite the breast, and they shall see the Son of Man coming upon the clouds of the heaven, with power and much glory; [ Luk 21:22 because these are days of vengeance, to fulfil all things that have been written.]
Mat 24:31 and he shall send his messengers [ministers, not angels] with a great sound of a trumpet [the Gospel], and they shall gather together his chosen from the four winds, from the ends of the heavens unto the ends thereof.

They saw His power and glory when Jerusalem fell. Luke called it the days of vengeance.
The Gospel went out into the four corners of the earth, to the ends of the heavens, and still does, declaring Salvation is of the Lord.
This is the historical interpretation of these verse in Matt., Mark, and Luke. It has only been in the last hundred years or so that these verses have been attributed to the second coming of the Lord. Darby and Scoffield spread that interpretation and tied to the Revelation scriptures.
These times are those spoken of by Daniel in chapter 9. When he said the people of the prince he did not say anything about antiChrist. Luke tells us that the army will encircle the city and so does Daniel.
Luk 21:20 `And when ye may see Jerusalem surrounded by encampments, then know that come nigh did her desolation;
Daniel 9:27....and by the wing of abominations he is making desolate, even till the consummation, and that which is determined is poured on the desolate one.'
Jesus said to them, the Jewish leaders,...
Mat 23:38 Lo, left desolate to you is your house;
This is what Titus did with the Roman armies in 70 AD.

Jesus told the absolute plain truth. THAT generation would see these things and some standing there, that He was talking to, would still not have experienced death when it happened.
Have you read Josephus' description of the fall of Jerusalem? It is heartbreaking and terrifying, too.

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

There's also the issue of these verses being written AFTER the destruction of the Temple.

 

[juvenissun]

On what grounds would you call the Baha'i Faith a 'doomsday' religion?

Do you have something which is the "final judgement"? If yes, that is what it is.

 

[ViaCrucis]

That part yes, but not this part:

"And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory;
Luke 21:27
He hasn't return yet, and that generation passed away a long time ago.

Seeing that the text here seems to be alluding quite strongly to Daniel 7 where "one like a son of man" is taken up on a cloud and presented before the Ancient of Days, I don't know that it's necessarily clear from the text that this is even referring to Christ's future coming.

It's certainly a matter of debate as to what it means. I take the position that this is referring to the Ascension. The Son of Man coming unto His kingdom, etc, refer to the ascension of Christ, and taking His seat at the right hand of the Father, being given authority and dominion.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[dlamberth]

That part yes, but not this part:

"And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory;
Luke 21:27
He hasn't return yet, and that generation passed away a long time ago.

The only way that makes sense to me is that because people are were looking for a physical return of a person, they are missing the spiritual Christ aspect of God that has been here since the moment of creation.

 

[LoAmmi]

Plenty of people did believe that it meant that those alive there would see the second coming. It sparks one of my favorite legends to laugh at.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wandering_Jew

 

[ChetSinger]

People have certainly spilled a lot of ink regarding that prophecy. The explanation I've heard that is most sensible to me is that "this generation" refers to the generation that begins seeing the signs. That is, the end-time events, once triggered, will progress quickly:

Learn this parable from the fig tree: Whenever its branch becomes tender and puts out its leaves, you know that summer is near.

So also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near, right at the door.

I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

If the fig tree truly represents Israel and the beginning of end-time events, then I would expect the end to arrive within the lifetimes of people who were alive in 1948. That is, prior to 2050 or so.

 

[ChetSinger]

...Christianity started out as a doomsday religion - and it still is, with each new generation being ABSOLUTELY sure that theirs are the final days, the signs are everywhere, and Jesus is going to come back any moment now.

It's a mixed bag. The Epistle of Barnabas, for example, dated between 70 and 215, says that the earth will last 6,000 years after which time God will "abolish the time of the Lawless One". Readers of that epistle, using the Jewish calendar as reference, would've expected the earth to remain for another 2,000 years.

 

[smaneck]

Do you have something which is the "final judgement"? If yes, that is what it is.

For us the Judgement Day is present whenever a Manifestation of God appears. That also marks the end of the Age and the beginning of a new one.