Does Science Agree With the Bible?

[redleghunter]

I'm Catholic. I take Genesis quite literally.
Genesis - which is to say B'reshiyt - is written in Hebrew pictographs, not English. The Hebrew pictographs and their overlaying meanings is rather astonishingly sharp and accurate.

But one must read it textually and literally, and that means not just reading English guesses that look at words, but in the Hebrew reading the words as themselves being hieroglyphic sentences.

The degree of compactness and complexity - of letter, word and even letter name and sound - in the text is superhuman in its tightness. And considering that the overlaying words are the simple words of a pre-scientific, nomadic and uneducated people, the insight into the actual universe at creation is quite astonishing.

But to really see that, one must set aside the English translations and engage in the letters themselves - as originally written - which is not in English, and not even in modern Hebrew, but in the most ancient pictographic Hebrew - Old Ivrit.

I am willing to do this for the curious. I am not, however, willing to do it in a forum where people are hammering and yammering and spitting at me and spewing anger and ignorance. It took me years of my life to be able to decipher the delicate flower garden that is the original Hebrew pictographs, and I am completely unwilling to let anybody into that garden who is not prepared to silently observe what he cannot himself see without a guide, or anybody who is going to start trampling the flowers.

There is an immense ocean of astonishing wonder packed into a few words, that aren't even WORDS in the traditional sense. It's all THERE, in plain ancient Hebrew, but the Hebrew of Genesis 1 is superhuman in its features.

If you want to see, we can take the discussion to one of the closed fora and discuss Genesis in an environment of quiet academic respect, where the braying dogs of atheism and angry deception are not admitted.

Please proceed. I have heard of this approach before. I look forward to your expository on the ancient Hebrew pictographs.

 

[redleghunter]

Ok, so, do we have this conversation in a private forum, or do we find an appropriate forum on one of those "Only" threads?

I am unfamiliar with the architecture of this site, having only just recently started posting here. And I am not really very curious about electronic filing cabinets or computer software, to tell you the truth. So, if you'd like to go over this, the very first, immensely helpful thing you could do is to find an electronic space here on this site where we can sit down on the grass and have a pleasant conversation without the fire ants showing up and sowing pain.

You can start a private conversation by clicking on your 'inbox' and 'start conversation.' Then invite who you choose to.

 

[redleghunter]

I sent you a private message. It should be in your inbox on the site.

Please invite me if you want me along.

 

[stephen583]

" God created the great SEA MONSTERS and every living creature that moves, which the WATERS swarmed after their kind" .. (Genesis 1:21, NAS).

Apparently Science and the Bible both agree the first life on this planet began in the seas and oceans (waters). What are the great "Sea Monsters" mentioned in Genesis 1:21 ?! In the King James Bible the words appear, "And God created the great whales". However most modern Bibles use the words "great sea creatures, or sea monsters" or some variation thereof. Why ? In the original Hebrew language the words appear as "terrible sea creatures" , (Hebrew/English Concordance 2000).

We now know great whales are neither terrible nor monstrous. These magnificent and intelligent creatures are actually quite benign. Great whales don't harm humans unless they are threatened or mistreated by man. So it's obvious Genesis 1:21 doesn't refer to great whales.
I think it refers to prehistoric marine reptiles like Kronosaurus, Liopleurodon, Dakosaurus, Plotosaurus and Nothosarus. In prehistoric times, these terrifying carnivorous marine predators teemed in the seas and oceans of the Earth.

"And God created the great sea monsters, and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarmed after their kind, and EVERY WINGED BIRD after its kind; and God saw that it was good" (Genesis 1:21, NAS).

Am I surprised Genesis 1:21 mentions these "great sea monsters" and "birds" in the same verse ? No. I'd be surprised if it didn't. Science now generally recognizes modern birds are the direct descendants of dinosaurs. In point of fact, dinosaurs are now divided into one of two major categories by science. Avian and Non Avian dinosaurs. Avian meaning those dinosaurs which share anatomical characteristics with birds, (avian bone structure, short downy pre flight feathers such as are found on micro raptors, and actual flight feathers as found on Archaeopteryx). If you're looking for a hint as to what kind of "great sea monsters" the Bible is talking about in Genesis 1:21, THERE IT IS.

"Then God said, "Let the EARTH bring forth living creatures after their kind: cattle and creeping things and beast of the earth after their kind"; and it was so" (Genesis 1:24, NAS).

Later, the EARTH (through Climate Change and environmental adaptation, after the last great extinction event that killed the dinosaurs), brings forth higher placental mammals (represented by cattle), creeping things (extant, modern insects and reptiles) that evolve contemporaneously (at about the same time). beasts of the earth ?! (a possible reference to primordial hominid creatures ?!). Again science and the Bible appear to be in complete agreement how things happened.

"Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; " (Genesis 1:26, NAS).

Finally homo sapien, sapien (modern humans) arrive last. The Bible and science present the same chronology of events in the creation of life on this planet. There is no disagreement between Science and the Bible. The disagreement is between zealot religionists and science, which is a different subject altogether.

 

[stephen583]

Although Science has proven through genetics we share DNA with primordial hominids, it has been unable as yet to produce the MISSING LINK. It appears the Bible also has it's own MISSING LINK problem in the story of Cain and Able.

Who were the wives of Seth and Cain ? In order to answer this problematic question, theologians have proposed a pretty unbiblical and illogical answer. They both married daughters of Adam. This not only ignores the biblical prohibition against incest, but also ignores the biblical fact Cain was cursed and marked as such by God. Adam nor any of his descendants were in a position to offer Cain clemency, and would have recognized Cain immediately because of the mark he received from God.

Who were the men in the land of Nod to the east, (mentioned by Cain immediately after God discovered he had slain Able and Cain was cursed by God and banished), that Cain FEARED would slay him ?! What people already lived in the land of wandering to the east ??? It appears both Science and the Bible share a MISSING LINK problem.

"And Abel was a keeper of flocks, but Cain was a tiller of the ground" (Genesis 4:2).

Interestingly, Science also observes a separation of the mile stone human advancements of agriculture and raising animals as livestock. Anthropologists have found animal livestock appeared first in Central Asia about 10,000 years ago. While Bar llan University of Israel has found people of the Ohalo II settlement on the shore of the Sea of Galilee tilled the ground and ground grain over 25,000 years ago, (Science Magazine, January 2016 issue). Again Science and the Bible seem to agree these human advancements existed seperately in different places and at different times.

 

[The Cadet]

Although Science has proven through genetics we share DNA with primordial hominids, it has been unable as yet to produce the MISSING LINK.

Science provides a new "missing" link every couple of years.

 

[Michael]

It seems to me that the "answer" to the question in the OP of this thread is that it depends *entirely* on how one chooses to selectively "interpret" the Bible.

 

[Vicomte13]

And spelling.

 

[Vicomte13]

This not only ignores the biblical prohibition against incest,

God did not give the law against incest until Mt. Sinai, thousands of years later.

 

[redleghunter]

And spelling.

LOL.

 

[Sister_in_Christ]

Science provides a new "missing" link every couple of years.

No. Science provides hypothetical transitions for certain animals. Not THE missing link. Between humans and apes.

 

[Michael]

No. Science provides hypothetical transitions for certain animals. Not THE missing link. Between humans and apes.

When and where we find transitional fossils is relatively random. We keep finding new ones all the time, but they aren't necessarily human ancestors.

 

[The Cadet]

No. Science provides hypothetical transitions for certain animals. Not THE missing link. Between humans and apes.

Yeah, see, I'm never quite sure what you mean by "THE missing link". Is it a transitional form between humans and apes? Because those are easy to find:

 

[Loudmouth]

No. Science provides hypothetical transitions for certain animals. Not THE missing link. Between humans and apes.

Funny how creationists can never list the criteria they use to determine if a fossil is transitional or not. I think we all know that they will never accept any fossil as being transitional, no matter what it looks like.

 

[Colter]

Although Science has proven through genetics we share DNA with primordial hominids, it has been unable as yet to produce the MISSING LINK. It appears the Bible also has it's own MISSING LINK problem in the story of Cain and Able.

Who were the wives of Seth and Cain ? In order to answer this problematic question, theologians have proposed a pretty unbiblical and illogical answer. They both married daughters of Adam. This not only ignores the biblical prohibition against incest, but also ignores the biblical fact Cain was cursed and marked as such by God. Adam nor any of his descendants were in a position to offer Cain clemency, and would have recognized Cain immediately because of the mark he received from God.

Who were the men in the land of Nod to the east, (mentioned by Cain immediately after God discovered he had slain Able and Cain was cursed by God and banished), that Cain FEARED would slay him ?! What people already lived in the land of wandering to the east ??? It appears both Science and the Bible share a MISSING LINK problem.

"And Abel was a keeper of flocks, but Cain was a tiller of the ground" (Genesis 4:2).

Interestingly, Science also observes a separation of the mile stone human advancements of agriculture and raising animals as livestock. Anthropologists have found animal livestock appeared first in Central Asia about 10,000 years ago. While Bar llan University of Israel has found people of the Ohalo II settlement on the shore of the Sea of Galilee tilled the ground and ground grain over 25,000 years ago, (Science Magazine, January 2016 issue). Again Science and the Bible seem to agree these human advancements existed seperately in different places and at different times.

Also, how did Noah's kids have all the other races on earth? Did they have Chinese children because of the incest they were practicing????

 

[AV1611VET]

Did they have Chinese children because of the incest they were practicing????

Wow, Colter.

Your mind's in the gutter, isn't it?

Oh, well ... you're thinking like a scientist here, I guess.

Incest wasn't "incest" until the Levitical law made close marriages off limits.

Then it was incest.

All in God's time.

And for the record, why is it called "marriage" when homosexuals do it, but "practicing" when it was done back in a time when marrying a close relative was legal?

 

[dad]

The spirit was confused, having Alzheimer's maybe while writing about the same event by two different authors centuries apart:

2 Samuel 24:1 - Anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he incited David against them, saying, "Go, number Israel and Judah." So the king said to Joab, etc. etc.

1 Chron 21:1 - SATAN stood up against Israel, and incited David to number Israel. So David said to Joab, etc. etc.

That's one example of many inconsistencies due to evolving beliefs, editing and new administrations. Bible worshipers concocted a whole field of mental gymnastics used to rationalize away the obveous. It's called apologetics. But the original authors made no such claim as today's right wingers.

God is the original, and He made lovely claims, such as having created heaven and earth. No confusion at all..just belief or unbelief.

 

[dad]

The Hebrews God concept has him flood the earth but powerless to stop iron chariots:


19And the LORD was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

False. God has all power, so whatever the reasonIsrael was limited in winning that battle has zero to do eith God lacking power.

 

[dad]

All of the prophets that the preistly authorities had originally mistreated were adopted by later generations of redactors.

Babble all you like. Seems like incoherent rubbish to me.

 

[dad]

You raised some important issues, Dad. First, who wrote the Bible? Divinely inspired or not, it carries human fingerprints all over. Meaning? God did not write Scripture in Heaven and then drop it down on our heads, on a sliver platter. Fallible humans wrote it and also decided what is Bible and what not. I realize that many hold with the notion of an inerrant Scripture. However, this is but a human-made, possibly fallible theory about how God may have been related to the writing of Scripture. Like any theory, it deserves to be tested out. Therefore, when we come to a serious study of the Bible, we should come with an open mind. We shod not blindly assume that it is all inerrant. We should take an attitude of : Maybe so, maybe not. Let us see. Know, I submit when the inerrancy theory is tested out, it does not hold waster. For one thing, there are too many contradictions in Scripture. A prime example is the Genesis account of creation. Now, I should say "accounts," as what is presented here is two contradictory chronologies written by tow different authors at tow different times in history. And as I said, what is Scripture and what not has always been a topic of debate. Jerome fist though the bible should be translated from the Hebrew, as this was the original language. Then he found this difficult and so switched to the Septuagint. Then had second thoughts on that. Then, in the end, went on the Septuagint. Then Luther came along and said that the Book of Ester should be thrown in the Danube River and that James was a "straw Epistle," which he relegated to the appendix of his translation of the Bible. So, does the Apocrypha belong in the Bible or not? What about Ester and James? you apparently brought up about unfulfilled prophecies. It is quite clear that Paul believed in an immanent end of the world and Second Coming. I also find that to be the case with the Book of Revelations.

God USES men. HE EVEN USES ANIMALS.