Refuting Sola Scriptura - Why the Bible Alone is Not Sufficient

[n2thelight]

What purpose do you'll traditions serve,besides telling be I should worship Mary.Is there any place I can read these traditions?

 

[thecolorsblend]

What purpose do you'll traditions serve,besides telling be I should worship Mary.

Tradition serves many purposes, not least of which is the Magisterium, which enables the Church to speak authoritatively to modern political, social, medical, personal and other issues about which Sacred Scripture says precisely nothing. For example, Protestants are a little hard-pressed to deduce a pro-life argument based exclusively on Sacred Scripture. Some passages come a little close but nothing outright says "Thou shalt not commit abortion" but the Church can authoritatively admonish Catholics from having, enabling or participating in abortions based on authority given by Our Lord to the Church.

Is there any place I can read these traditions?

The Catechism of the Catholic Church. I recommend it even to non-Catholics because the theology contained therein is phenomenal.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

[QUOTE="EastCoastRemnant,?

hrough the body of believers, spoken to by the Holy Spirit, taught by those with the spiritual gifts and by the fellowship and edification of each other.

Which body of believers? There are thousands of protestant denominations and many don't agree with each other on central matters of the Christian faith. I don't think that's what Jesus meant when he promised that the Holy Spirit would lead the Church into all truth.

Jesus started a single Church. When did it become OK to disagree with this Church?[/QUOTE]

I have never been commanded to pay homage to the scarlet and gold covered woman... only the woman clothed in white.

 

[Thursday]

Which body of believers? There are thousands of protestant denominations and many don't agree with each other on central matters of the Christian faith. I don't think that's what Jesus meant when he promised that the Holy Spirit would lead the Church into all truth.

Jesus started a single Church. When did it become OK to disagree with this Church?

I have never been commanded to pay homage to the scarlet and gold covered woman... only the woman clothed in white.[/QUOTE]

What are you talking about?

 

[Rick Otto]

So, for 18 years you worshipped Mary, you were an idolator. And in those 18 years no one ever told you or you never heard or read that you don't worship Mary but ask for her intercession on your behalf?...I mean there is a difference that even a Protestant such as myself can understand.

That issue was pre-empted totally by my personal access to the throne, not to mention a lack of any scriptural example of such prayer to follow, and personal transgressions were coerced, so I rebuke any charge of negligence, but consider you a brother for the conscientious challenge.
Good question, well put.

 

[n2thelight]

Tradition serves many purposes, not least of which is the Magisterium, which enables the Church to speak authoritatively to modern political, social, medical, personal and other issues about which Sacred Scripture says precisely nothing. For example, Protestants are a little hard-pressed to deduce a pro-life argument based exclusively on Sacred Scripture. Some passages come a little close but nothing outright says "Thou shalt not commit abortion" but the Church can authoritatively admonish Catholics from having, enabling or participating in abortions based on authority given by Our Lord to the Church.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church. I recommend it even to non-Catholics because the theology contained therein is phenomenal.

Thanks I shall read them....

But why do we need them?

 

[n2thelight]

How did the Church,give us the Word when it did'nt allow anyone to have it...That just automatically seem wrong to be ..

Also the Church speaks on things as you said,what about the things that it has done wrong,and who can question the Church?

One is suppose to check what anyone says with scripture,how do we check the traditions?

 

[n2thelight]

Do you know the history on atrocities commited by the Catholic Church,and yet you say it's the one to be followed...How can something that evil be of God?

Not judging,just curious....

Scripture says by thier fruits ye shall know them,now anyone living through the horries of the Catholic Church would not be convinced that she was not of satan...

 

[thecolorsblend]

But why do we need them?

Where do you go in Sacred Scripture to find out about the morality (if any) of, for example, in vitro fertilization? Or abortion? Or any of a host of other subjects?

As a Catholic, I can point you to sources we hold to be authoritative. You're hard-pressed to be able to use scripture alone to answer those questions but the Church's Magisterium guides the faithful through moral minefields that face the world today.

How did the Church,give us the Word when it did'nt allow anyone to have it...That just automatically seem wrong to be ..

When exactly did the Church disallow people from owning Bibles? Cite specific examples, please.

Also the Church speaks on things as you said,what about the things that it has done wrong,

What about them?

and who can question the Church?

Anybody can question the Church. She has nothing to hide from sincere questions.

One is suppose to check what anyone says with scripture,how do we check the traditions?

Tradition cannot contradict Sacred Scripture.

Do you know the history on atrocities commited by the Catholic Church,and yet you say it's the one to be followed...How can something that evil be of God?

Israel committed child sacrifice at different times. And yet God clearly singled Israel out as the people through which His Son would come. How can something as evil as Israel was in those times be of God?

Scripture says by thier fruits ye shall know them,now anyone living through the horries of the Catholic Church would not be convinced that she was not of satan...

I'm not sure what you're asking about. Are you curious about the fact that education, medicine, the sciences, math, literacy and probably other things I'm forgetting would be at least 1,000 years behind where we are now except for the Church? Are you referring to the tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars that Catholic charities manage and distribute to the poor each year? Is this about the billions of people over the centuries who were fed and clothed by Catholic volunteers, missionaries, orders and other organizations? Are you speaking of the thousands upon thousands of children who have been placed into loving homes through Catholic adoption services?

I'll provide one example: http://www.ncregister.com/blog/pat-archbold/some-trads-walk-into-a-gay-bar

Basically some priests purchased a gay bar.

I know how I was back in my fire-breathing evangelical days. Had that been my old Southern Baptist congregation, I feel confident that my pastor would've bought that gay bar at top dollar when it was the height of its popularity, taken out a loan if necessary to do so, bought the place, shut it down and maybe transformed it into yet another "youth center" or something. Then we would've all done an end zone dance over how we'd stuck it to them (so to speak).

In reality my Southern Baptist congregation would've made the then current owner of the club rich(er) from his sinful lifestyle and then he could've either retired or else opened up a new bar elsewhere. Certainly no positive feelings regarding Our Lord would've come out of that enterprise. It would not have been a positive witness in my old SB congregation's hands.

But the Catholic priests simply bided their time and then the local real estate market naturally turned against the gay bar. Once the bar had gone out of business, they purchased the building for pennies on the dollar of what it used to be worth... and then they reopened it as an outreach center to help and minister to people struggling with same-sex attractions.

Instead of rubbing their faces in it, the priests chose to extend those poor souls the only mercy they may EVER receive in life (or in eternity). It's not about triumphalism with the Catholic Church; it's about saving souls. Reading that article was a punch in the gut for me because I realized how messed up my priorities had become over the years, how eager I and others had become to deny the "undesirables" the very mercy we'd received.

THAT is the Catholic Church, my friend.

 

[n2thelight]

@thecolorsblend

Thanks for your reply

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Where do you go in Sacred Scripture to find out about the morality (if any) of, for example, in vitro fertilization? Or abortion? Or any of a host of other subjects?

We go to the same place that the Magisterium goes.

As a Catholic, I can point you to sources we hold to be authoritative. You're hard-pressed to be able to use scripture alone to answer those questions but the Church's Magisterium guides the faithful through moral minefields that face the world today.

So what you are saying is that Catholics cannot think for themselves? They NEED someone to tell them what to believe and how to believe it?

 

[Goatee]

I am actually being very honest. These 9 examples are some of the reasons why I left the Roman Catholic Church. Do you really think I never tried to get an answer from other Catholics or the priest? Well I have, and every Catholic that ever graced me with their presence refused to give me a direct answer to anything. Yet you have such a pious view of yourself that reminds me of so many other Catholics I've met. Just remember, on that day when you are being judged before the thrown of God, this event is going to be discussed. The day where God gave you an opportunity to save a lost soul but you chose to reject that opportunity because you did not care.

You know what the difference between you and me? I do not believe catholics are going to hell. I believe they are Christians and are saved. It just really bothers me that yourself and many (not all) Catholics think so highly of themselves and their faith that they look down on any other denomination.

Why is the Roman Catholic Church loosing so many members at rates never before seen if it is the "one true church"? I am not exaggerating. Their membership is hemorrhaging at an alarming rate. Why is that? What is the Roman Catholic Church doing wrong? Well, when you make statements like I am going to hell and then not even try to confront the very issues that lead me astray, you answer that question.

Where have i said that other Christians are not saved and are going to hell? Where? I have never said that. Plus, i do not think highly of myself. Only of my faith and God! Why are there so many people leaving other denominations to come home to the Catholic church?

 

[Goatee]

We go to the same place that the Magisterium goes.



So what you are saying is that Catholics cannot think for themselves? They NEED someone to tell them what to believe and how to believe it?

Catholics believe in the Bible but also in Sacred Tradition where the Holy Spirit still guides the Church as Jesus states!

 

[Goatee]

Grow up! Deflecting by wryly pointing our a typo is juvenile...

'out'

Very Christian of you.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Where have i said that other Christians are not saved and are going to hell?

The Roman Catholic Church says so! Since you blindly believe everything the Roman Catholic Church has taught you without question, you believe it to. Unless you dont, then that means you are not in line with the Roman Catholic Church

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Catholics believe in the Bible but also in Sacred Tradition where the Holy Spirit still guides the Church as Jesus states!

And what is the origin of the Sacred Tradition?

 

[Goatee]

The Roman Catholic Church says so! Since you blindly believe everything the Roman Catholic Church has taught you without question, you believe it to. Unless you dont, then that means you are not in line with the Roman Catholic Church

Thats how narrow minded you can be.

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/salvation-outside-the-church

 

[Goatee]

And what is the origin of the Sacred Tradition?

Info for you on that as it explains it better than i ever could:

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/scripture-and-tradition

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Thats how narrow minded you can be.

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/salvation-outside-the-church

So are you saying that the Roman Catholic Church changed their minds and all these popes and saints had it wrong?

1) "The holy universal Church proclaims that God cannot truly be worshipped save within herself, and asserts that all they who are without her pale shall never be saved."

Pope Gregory the Great 540-604 A.D.

2) "The Church is like the Ark of Noah, outside of which nobody can be saved."

St. Thomas Aquinas 1224-1274 A.D.

3) "That there is one Holy Catholic and apostolic Church we are compelled to believe and to hold, prompted by divine faith, and we do believe this firmly and confess it simply, outside of which there can be no salvation, or remission of sins…."

Pope Boniface VIII 1235-1303 A.D., became Pope in 1294

4) "It is a sin to believe that there is salvation outside the Catholic Church."
Pope Pius IX 1792-1878 A.D., became Pope in 1846, convened the first Vatican Council in 1869, which enunciated the Catholic doctrine of papal infallibility.

5) "We believe the Church is necessary for salvation because Christ, who is the sole mediator and exclusive way of salvation, renders Himself present for us in His body which is the Church. We must always remember the unity of the mystical body, without which there can be no salvation, is open to no one outside the Catholic Church."

Pope Paul VI 1897-1978 A.D. became Pope in 1963

6) "For it is through Christ’s Catholic Church alone, which is the universal help towards salvation, that the fullness of the means of salvation can be obtained."

Vatican II 1965

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Thats how narrow minded you can be.

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/salvation-outside-the-church

What are your views on Pope Francis' stance on abortion? If the Pope is infallable in the "morals" department why is his moral views different from every pope before him?