It should be Murder?

[JoeP222w]

So, will you subject all women whose pregnancy is terminated to a compulsory examination?

I don't have an answer for that.

But that in no way justifies the existence of abortuaries or the legality of abortion.

But it really comes down to the fundamental problem of sin. Why are women desiring abortions? Often it is out of convenience, selfishness, coercion, fear and ignorance. The women are acting out of their inherent sinful nature. They are murderers at heart. And apart from the transforming work of God in their life, they will not seen the precious nature of all life, especially vulnerable life in the womb. They will not see the sinful risks of casual, promiscuous sexual encounters where they pursue only their selfish desires and lusts. They will not take responsibility for their actions.

 

[JoeP222w]

No, I am saying no such thing. You people are very keen to slip words into the mouth of another, aren't you?

Please answer the question. How will you 'sort out' those women who cause a miscarriage, as opposed to those who don't?

I did not say you said that, but that is what you are implying.

 

[SteveB28]

I don't have an answer for that.

But that in no way justifies the existence of abortuaries or the legality of abortion.

But it really comes down to the fundamental problem of sin. Why are women desiring abortions? Often it is out of convenience, selfishness, coercion, fear and ignorance. The women are acting out of their inherent sinful nature. They are murderers at heart. And apart from the transforming work of God in their life, they will not seen the precious nature of all life, especially vulnerable life in the womb. They will not see the sinful risks of casual, promiscuous sexual encounters where they pursue only their selfish desires and lusts. They will not take responsibility for their actions.

Oh no, you don't hate women at all....

No, not the slightest....

 

[JoeP222w]

No he isn't. You see, it's very easy to make unsubstantiated claims.



The only laws we have are those written by men.



Fortunately, those people are on the fringe. They are over there, next to the group who want to stone homosexuals.



Hatred and bigotry.

You choose to believe that God is unsubstantiated, because you love your sin and suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

As I wrote, God is the law giver, not man.

Nope, I don't want to stone homosexuals (although homosexuality is sin), and it is not an accurate assertion that those who are against the murder of children also want to stone homosexuals.

"hatred and bigotry", easily tossed out words to vilify those disagree with your worldview.

 

[SteveB28]

I did not say you said that, but that is what you are implying.

No, of course you didn't.....

Oversimplification and inaccurate. What you are basically saying is, because there are miscarriages, that justifies the murder of children through abortion?

 

[SteveB28]

You choose to believe that God is unsubstantiated, because you love your sin and suppress the truth in unrighteousness.

As I wrote, God is the law giver, not man.

Nope, I don't want to stone homosexuals (although homosexuality is sin), and it is not an accurate assertion that those who are against the murder of children also want to stone homosexuals.

"hatred and bigotry", easily tossed out words to vilify those disagree with your worldview.

"By their fruits shall Ye know them........."

 

[JoeP222w]

Oh no, you don't hate women at all....

No, not the slightest....

I sense sarcasm.

But if I hate women, why would I seek to protect and preserve their life, both in the womb and out of the womb?

About 50% of the children murdered in the womb are women. So those who support abortion claim that they are protecting women or a woman's "choice", have no concern for the woman in the womb or her choice.

Statistics have shown that mothers who have had abortions have a much higher risk of cervical and breast cancer, and are at a much higher risk of suicide. So how is it hatred of women to warn them of the risks of abortion, not only the murder of the child, but putting themselves at risk.

If you see this as hatred than you are opposed to the things of God.

 

[JoeP222w]

No, of course you didn't.....

"basically saying" is a known as a figure of speech, which can be understood as "implying".

 

[Uncle Siggy]

We are not discussing concepts when if comes to defining the beginning of a human being. It's scientific fact.

Do you believe the earth is undergoing climate change and if so is man contributing to it? If so what is the basis of your belief?

Don't be surprised if you get turned in again for flaming, bringing up "inconsistencies" in logic is a no no...

 

[Belk]

At what exact point in fetal development would you consider one becomes a person?

I don 't have an exact point. I follow along with neurologists who say sometime around 24 weeks.

 

[Belk]

I meant that a miscarriage is not something intentionally done by the mother. An abortion is a willful and purposeful choice by the mother to murder her child.

Again, you are incorrect. An abortion is a choice by the mother to not be pregnant. The death of the fetus is a result of that.

 

[Nic Samojluk]

Since we are dealing with law the relevant question is "Is the fetus a person"? My answer would be no. It does not have the requisite cognitive function to be a person.

Personhood was invented in order to marginalize certain groups of human beings and deprive them of their rights! It was used against slaves, women, and blacks. When an individual is temporarily unable to think and act, this does not mean that we are free to kill him/her. The inability of the unborn to use its brain power is temporary. This should not deprive the unborn of its right to life and nutrition.

 

[Nic Samojluk]

I don 't have an exact point. I follow along with neurologists who say sometime around 24 weeks.

Since you do not the exact point, you should err on the side of caution. If you are unable to see ahead with clarity, you should investigate first before shooting.

 

[Nic Samojluk]

An abortion is a choice by the mother to not be pregnant.

Once a woman is already pregnant, the choice to not be pregnant has evaporated!

 

[Nic Samojluk]

Legally that is correct.

What is legal does not mean that it is moral. When Hitler was in power, it was legal to kill the unproductive members of society. Before the emancipation of blacks, it was legal to mistreat blacks. Morality trumps legality.

 

[Nic Samojluk]

A foetus is not deemed to be a person. The woman's welfare takes primacy.

You are wrong! What you say might be true if the choice is between the life of the mother and the life of the unborn, but it is not true when the choice is between a few months of inconvenience and the permanent deprivation of life. Common sense should prevail here!

 

[Nic Samojluk]

Irrelevant to the discussion at hand. You will note that, in structuring this discussion, NO mention was made of any particular religious stance.

Wrong again! This is a Christian forum. Therefore, what is posted here should take into account the premise that we are the result of God's creative action.

 

[Belk]

Personhood was invented in order to marginalize certain groups of human beings and deprive them of their rights! It was used against slaves, women, and blacks.

No, person is the relevant legal term and your attempts to poison the well are irrelevant.

When an individual is temporarily unable to think and act, this does not mean that we are free to kill him/her.

If a human becomes brain dead we no no longer consider them a person. The law deals with what is now today, not what it could possibly be in the future.

The inability of the unborn to use its brain power is temporary. This should not deprive the unborn of its right to life and nutrition.

It doesn't. What it does do is make the rights of the mother to bodily integrity paramount. Have you even read the Roe V Wade decision? How do you expect to effectively argue against a position when you apparently do not know what that position is?

 

[Belk]

Since you do not the exact point, you should err on the side of caution. If you are unable to see ahead with clarity, you should investigate first before shooting.

The next time you are pregnant you can feel free to error on the side of caution. I prefer to error on the side that has a person.

 

[Belk]

Once a woman is already pregnant, the choice to not be pregnant has evaporated!

No, it has not. That is why we have legal abortion. You do not get to dictate what other people do with their bodies.