Why do people believe in a Rapture?

[Short Timer]

We don't agree all the time,but this I agree...However,how did you fit the rapture(saints) in this?...

Where else are they going to be????

Eight people survived Noah flood, but nobody, not one single person, can or would survive the trib, except.

the number who does survive is so small a child can write the number.

I see interpretation of the trib as if it's just another world war like all the others we had, two "worldly forces" with nations siding up against the other.

But the trib is when this "Spiritual war" becomes an "Open physical war" between God and Satan, a time such as never been before or ever will be again,

And people believe the Body of Christ/Holy Ghost is going to be left to fight in this war with the devil/AC given power/dominion to prevail over them and wiped them/church out right along with everyone else.

Do you think anyone who believes the devil or any of his demons can have power over "God in the flesh" and his "Spirit",

Really knows/understand anything whatsoever about the scriptures??????

 

[kingskid]

I was told more "Haint stories" growing up than you can imagine,

but hit haint the only daffynition of the word.

nowatimean, Vern???

So you are actually calling Jesus a haint? Please back that up with scripture. Where is it in the Bible?

 

[Short Timer]

Revelation 13:7-10 refers to the Antichrist, during his future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-10), being allowed to physically overcome Biblical Christians in every nation (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 14:12-13, Matthew 24:9-13), just as, for example, the Roman emperors and Satan were allowed to physically overcome some Biblical Christians in the 1st century AD (e.g. Revelation 2:10). There are no Biblical Christians outside of the church (Ephesians 4:4-6).

Where is the Roman empire today, gone???

Where is the church, still here???

Guess Roman didn't "prevail" after all.

But Revelation 13:7-10 doesn't mean that every person in the church will be overcome by the Antichrist. For some in the church will be in God-protected wilderness places (Revelation 12:6, Revelation 12:14-16), and so they will still be "alive and remain" on the earth at Jesus' 2nd coming to be raptured (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17), immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31, Mark 13:24-27; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6).

OK, scripture is wrong, some flesh would survive even if Jesus didn't return.

Are you saying that we are not saved unless we agree with everything you say?

I don't ask anyone to believe anything "I SAY", but "IF" it's the "Truth", and you have "Ears to hear", the "Spirit" will confirm it as being the "Truth".

Why is it you don't already know that???

Note that the harpazo won't happen until the parousia:

harpazo= a leaving, going away
parousia=a coming, returning

How strangly will the tools of a tryant pervert the plain meaning of words.
Samuel Adams 1723-1802 Letter to John Pitts Jan 21, 1776.

I see the "Carnal mind" quite often "pervert" the plain meaning of words to "justify" it's interpretation of scripture.

Ro 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God:

Also, Jesus' parousia (coming), his apocalypse (revelation), and his epiphany (appearing) all refer to the same thing: his 2nd coming.

By the time Jesus returns Satan would have had power over the "Body of Christ/Holy Ghost" and prevailed to "wipe them out" along with most everyone else.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit [pneuma] of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

With so few people revealing they have any knowledge of the working of the spirit, or scripture, I'd say the HG is crying his eyes out.

Also, note that even in the KJV, the Holy "Ghost" spoke in the Old Testament. For Hebrews 3:7-11 says that the Holy Ghost spoke Psalms 95:7b-11. And Hebrews 10:15-17 says that the Holy Ghost spoke Jeremiah 31:33-34. And Mark 12:36 says that the Holy Ghost spoke Psalms 110:1. And Acts 1:16,20 says that the Holy Ghost spoke Psalms 69:25. And Acts 28:25b-27 says that the Holy Ghost spoke Isaiah 6:9-10. See also 2 Peter 1:20-21.

Also Matthew 12:32, Matthew 28:19, Luke 3:22, and 2 Corinthians 13:14 are able to distinguish between Jesus and the Holy Ghost in some way.

Yes, God became Jesus, and Jesus is going to revert back to becoming God,

Jews didn't understand Jesus/church/Holy Ghost in context of the scripture and neither does many Christians understand God/Israel/Holy Spirit in context of scripture

Joh 14:11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me:
Joh 14:9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

The "last trump" (1 Corinthians 15:52) is the trumpet which will sound after the tribulation (Matthew 24:31).

Angels blowing on trumpets can't resurrect the dead, only the "Voice of Jesus" can call people from the grave.

All OT/Decease/Rapture/martyred Saints return with Jesus, unsaved dead stay dead, "NOBODY" is resurrected from a grave at the second coming.

Are you saying that if we disagree with anything you say, we are disagreeing with Jesus?

If you don't have ears to hear the spirit, how are you going to know what is truth and what is not truth??
Scripture is only revealed to those with "ears to hear".

Lu 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.

1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[kingskid]

Where else are they going to be????

Eight people survived Noah flood, but nobody, not one single person, can or would survive the trib, except.

the number who does survive is so small a child can write the number.

I see interpretation of the trib as if it's just another world war like all the others we had, two "worldly forces" with nations siding up against the other.

But the trib is when this "Spiritual war" becomes an "Open physical war" between God and Satan, a time such as never been before or ever will be again,

And people believe the Body of Christ/Holy Ghost is going to be left to fight in this war with the devil/AC given power/dominion to prevail over them and wiped them/church out right along with everyone else.

Do you think anyone who believes the devil or any of his demons can have power over "God in the flesh" and his "Spirit",

Really knows/understand anything whatsoever about the scriptures??????

I do understand the devil can not have spiritual dominion over the body of Christ.

 

[Short Timer]

So you are actually calling Jesus a haint? Please back that up with scripture. Where is it in the Bible?

Old timers slang for "Ghost spirits" was "Haints".

The Holy spirit was sent in Jesus's name, therefore it's called the "Ghost spirit of Jesus", not the "Spirit of God", even though it's the same spirit, just as Jesus is the "same God".

You'll have to divide the "trinity" into it's "parts", before you'll understand scripture,

Israel couldn't, and you see where it got them.

 

[Short Timer]

I do understand the devil can not have spiritual dominion over the body of Christ.

Really, that's all you need to know to "Know" the rapture is Pre trib.

God is not going to sent a "strong delusion" to fool the disciples of Jesus, he can't anyway, the Ghost would reveal that the strong delusion was a "lie", and God would be working against "HIMSELF".

The AC riding his white horse claiming to be the "messiah" is already expected to come by people who
love/know the truth, you can't fool them, why would God even try or tempt the "body of Christ", only the unbelievers who doesn't know the scripture would be fooled,

and there will be some Jews who disavow him, their Messiah is expected to comes with his feet landing on Mt Olives, entering Jerusalem through the "East Gate", which is walled up today through which no one can enter.

BTW, it's the same gate Jesus rode his donkey into Jerusalem.

The trib is God's wrath against "Flesh", all flesh, the cause of sin and an enemy of God, and the reason none would survive except God needing some to repopulate the earth during the MK, those resurrected don't marry/reproduce.

Christians who have been "Born again" have already "martyred/crucified the flesh", under Grace, it's a "Spiritual crucifixion", under the law during the trib, it will be a "literal death" of the "Body of sin" to be saved.

Jesus has already made "peace" between God and the church by the "Chastisement/stripes" in "His flesh".

People in the trib will have to make their "peace with God" by the chastisement/stripes in their own flesh.


The scapegoat dying by himself is not enough to saved the whole world or the whole world would already be saved,
People have to sacrifice their old "body of sin" or "Goat for the people" before "ATONEMENT" is complete.

We don't hear much of the "Foundation" on which the plan of salvation is based, preached today, and it's the major reason so many are easily lead astray.

 

[Bro.T]

I want you to try a scientific experiment.
1. Get an apple.
2. Eat half of the apple and put the other half in the refer until another day.
3. Another day: get the half an apple out, and cut it in half.
4. Do you have two halves left of the entire apple, or do you have two quarters left of the entire apple?

The point is, THERE MUST BE 7 YEARS together if this week of years is to be divided into two halves of 42 months each. You want to divide a half an apple and come up with two halves: WON'T WORK!

The truth is, this is exactly what John shows us in Revelation: the TRUMPETS will sound in the FIRST half, and the VIALS poured out in the SECOND half. Daniel mentioned the last half of the week twice, and John 5 times more.

Daniels is to deep for you to understand...sorry

 

[Bro.T]

It CLEARLY does not say He meets us in the air and comes to the earth either. You have to ADD that part. We add nothing. We have another verses that tells us WHERE: He will take us back to heaven to the places he has prepared.

Now, if you can find a verse somewhere that shows He came back to earth after the two angels said He is going to return somewhere, and He came back to earth to prepare homes or abodes for us HERE ON EARTH, then you might have a verse to back you up.

On the other hand, we have numerous verses telling us He went to be at the right hand of the FATHER. That is in HEAVEN. That is where He went to prepare homes for us. Get it? Got it? Can you find Jesus on the earth anywhere in REvelation chapters 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18? No, HE WILL BE IN HEAVEN and we will be WITH HIM.

You don't have the fruits to understand, your mind is blinded by the simplest verses and scriptures...its almost unbelievable to me, but then again I understand why!

 

[Bro.T]

Let's rehearse; You wrote: "Sorry...but the Lord already have a word that he use in this case or situation and thats the first Resurrection, and they are called the Saints. The Saints will meet the Lord in the clouds and come right back to earth. If you understand what you read and have some knowledge then you will know that all Saints are not going to be dead at the first resurrection. Again, this is for those who read this post, we already know what you think is going to happen."

So you are comparing First Resurrection with:
1 Thes. 4
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Let's look at Websters:
"the rising again to life of all the human dead before the final judgment"
The Free Dictionary: "a. The act of restoring a dead person, for example, to life."
Yourdictionary: "a rising from the dead, or coming back to life"

NONE of these fit what Paul wrote, that "we which are alive and remain shall be caught up." There is NOTHING in the text surrounding "the first resurrection" that mentions those alive being caught up. You WANT to compare these two because of your mistaken theory of making Paul's rapture happen at Jesus coming on a white horse, shown in Rev. 19. It will never work, because Paul himself told us that his rapture would come as the TRIGGER for the Day of the Lord. What did Paul tell us had to come FIRST? It was the "departing." The gathering and departing of the saints from earth to heaven is what triggers the start of the Day of the Lord.

Paul tells us it will begin with SUDDEN DESTRUCTION...which will be the start of God's wrath. (last verse of Rev. 6) Therefore Paul's sudden destruction is the earthquake of the 6th seal. Did you happen to notice the difference between 6 and 19? There are a lot of numbers inbetween, each a chapter with events that will take place BETWEEN the rapture of the church and Jesus coming on the white horse. Paul further told us that God would not make or set any appointments for us with the wrath of God. Why, I might ask, are you so determined to set your own appointment?

For further proof, those under the altar at the 5th seal are told they most wait for the last church age martyr. The church age ENDS at the rapture. The 6th seal is the beginning of the Day of the Lord.

The Saints will meet the Lord in the clouds and come right back to earth.
You cannot find any verse anywhere that even hints of the church returning to earth immediately after being "gathered."

By the way, when one KNOWS the answer, there is no need to ask, except maybe to find out what someone else knows. Indeed, I did not need to ask you, because I already knew from your answer that you simply don't know the truth. You are here on a public forum. Many will read your posts. Do you really want to teach fabrications here?

If you have a different spirit on you this would so simple for you to understand.

 

[Bro.T]

You're making a mistake in your definition of "Resurrection",

People are "Resurrected" from Hell at the GWT,

Resurrection does not mean strictly "From a grave".

In the "First Resurrection" all Rapture/deceased saints are "Resurrected"..."From Heaven", they come "With Jesus".

and all unsaved dead, stay dead,

"NOBODY" is resurrected "from a grave" in the "First Resurrection".

Resurrection means to be "back on the earth alive", after having left, dying or rapture.

Where you come from doesn't matter, Grave, Heaven or Hell.

I'm not making a mistake...you have to pay close attention and ask question, instead of assuming you know and I don't. I never said Resurrection strictly means coming from the grave, so now you begin to build up false allegations. Lets focus on a verse or two. Lets go to I Thessalonians (4:13) But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.(14) For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. (15) For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

These verses tells a lot, for those with understanding. Paul is telling us that those who are asleep (dead) in Jesus, this means those who kept the faith and the commandments of God (Jesus) which is the saints. Jesus will bring with him. Also those who are alive and remain will come with him (Jesus). Lets quickly go into Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Lets continue...(16) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

These verse also tells a lot, for those with understanding. Jesus himself is going to shout and descend, which means come down, and with the trump of God (which is the angel). Lets go into 1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

So Jesus will descend and shout, and the trumpet will sound and the dead in Christ will rise first. Not every body!

Lets continue...(17) Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Notice Paul say...then we which are alive and remain, cause some people (saints) will still be alive a the coming of Jesus. So...now, the dead and or the saints thats still alive and didn't die, will meet the Lord in the air, in the clouds. Didn't we read that the Lord will descend, which means the Lord is coming down. The dead is in the grave, so they coming from the earth. Lets go into Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Again...not everybody who dead is coming in the first Resurrection. These are the prophets, apostle, and those who keep the faith and the commandments of God. Lets go again into Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

I could of added much more, but I wanted to stick to the point. I understand most will not see this, because in this world people want to be more right then learning how to get salvation, to come up in the first resurrection...not be Rapture...First Resurrection.

 

[Bro.T]

Not return TO earth. Return to the air above earth for us. When He returns as the angel said to the apostles, it will be in like manner as He left. His feet will land on the mount of Olives at that time. That is not when we are taken up in the air.

he will land when He returns to rule. The dead in Christ and we who are alive will not be going into the air when He LANDS. There are two words for you to look up. Land...air. Now if we go (here's another word to look up) UP in the AIR to meet Him and GO to be where He is in heaven in the place He prepared for us, then we will not be raised to the mount of olives, and foot level!


In both cases He does that. In the Rapture He has to come down to get us but not all the way down.

It does say He is taking us UP to be with Him in the place He prepared. His Father's HOUSE! Elementary.
Impossible and patently absurd.

1 Thessalonians 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

 

[Short Timer]

Notice Paul say...then we which are alive and remain, cause some people (saints) will still be alive a the coming of Jesus. So...now, the dead and or the saints thats still alive and didn't die, will meet the Lord in the air, in the clouds. Didn't we read that the Lord will descend, which means the Lord is coming down. The dead is in the grave, so they coming from the earth.

That is the "Rapture", the "LEAVING" of the saints.

Re 14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud,(souls of saint) and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.(Rapture)

The souls of deceased saints come with Jesus in the rapture to receive their "Glorified Bodies", then the living is changed into Glorified bodies,

and all return to heaven.

Mt 24:38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

Lets go into Revelation 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

And that is the "Second "COMING" of Jesus, and the OT/deceased/church/martyred saints "ALL" come with him, he's not coming to rapture the church, the church is already with him.

Re 14:17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.
19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.(Trib period)

Ac 2:20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:

Mt 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Nobody will be sitting around eating/drinking/marrying/giving in marriage at the second coming, not "KNOWING" anything is about to happen.

The world will have gone through a times such as never been before or ever be again,

what few people are left will be looking/praying for the Lord to return.

best compare what the scripture say about each coming.

I could of added much more, but I wanted to stick to the point. I understand most will not see this, because in this world people want to be more right then learning how to get salvation, to come up in the first resurrection...not be Rapture...First Resurrection.

Best do some more reading/studying.

 

[dad]

1 Thessalonians 3:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

That refers to the time when He comes with His saints. First He comes for them.

 

[Riberra]

That is the "Rapture", the "LEAVING" of the saints.

Re 14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud,(souls of saint) and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.(Rapture)

Do you notice that what is written in Revelation 14 come AFTER that the MAN OF SIN /SATAN is throwing out of Heaven down to Earth mentioned in Revelation 12 and after that the Beast take full power on the Earth by implementing the mark and adoration of his person or his image mentioned in Revelation 13...in other words you are saying that your "rapture" if it have anything to do with the reaping will happen AFTER that the Man of Sin is revealed....

 

[Riberra]

That is the "Rapture", the "LEAVING" of the saints.

Wrong.
The Bible talk about a GATHERING and Caught up of the Saints to MEET Jesus in the air above the ground unto His only coming yet to come (The Parousia).... not a LEAVING of the Saints to somewhere else outside the atmosphere of the Earth, nor into another dimension of space and time ....nor to the Third Heaven where God reside.

 

[Short Timer]

Do you notice that what is written in Revelation 14 come AFTER that the MAN OF SIN /SATAN is throwing out of Heaven down to Earth mentioned in Revelation 12 and after that the Beast take full power on the Earth by implementing the mark and adoration of his person or his image mentioned in Revelation 13...in other words you are saying that your "rapture" if it have anything to do with the reaping will happen AFTER that the Man of Sin is revealed....

Revelation chapters are not in chronological order, but the only way you could know that is to know the timeline laid out in scripture.

Satan is cast out of heaven as soon as the church arrives, or after the "HE" is taken out of the way, after the fulness of the Gentiles.

Israel doesn't attend the "Son's marriage" to the mostly "Gentiles Church", the church going to that marriage is the rapture.

Mt 22:2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, (God) which made a marriage for his son,(Jesus)
3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.
Mt 22:8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
Mt 22:10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.
11 And when the king(God) came in to see the guests, (Rapture church) he saw there a man (Satan) which had not on a wedding garment:
Mt 22:13 Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness;

Re 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

Do you know what the "Symbols" of the "Sun', "Moon" "Flood" represent in Rev 12???

And why is the woman only protected for 1260 days, that is only half of the trib, what happens in the other half???

How can Satan persecute/make war with the woman if she is "protected"???

 

[Short Timer]

Wrong.
The Bible talk about a GATHERING and Caught up of the Saints to MEET Jesus in the air above the ground unto His only coming yet to come (The Parousia).... not a LEAVING of the Saints to somewhere else outside the atmosphere of the Earth, nor into another dimension of space and time ....nor to the Third Heaven where God reside.

Like Will Roger, who said he only knew what he read in the newspapers, I only know what I read in the scripture.

And scripture says when Jesus come to take the church to the son's wedding, that Israel refused the invitation, it will a time such as it's always been before, eating drinking marrying/giving in marriage, planning a future, nothing ab-normal occurring.

But at the second coming, the sun/moon won't be shining, and the world will have through a time such as never was before or every will be again, 99% of the world population dead from natural disaster and the devil/AC/demons killing all who won't bow to them.

And there are dozens of other differences between the two coming.

Either your reading comprehension isn't very good or you haven't read the scripture, cause I don't think any normal person could read what the scripture say and believe these conditions could exist at the same time.

 

[n2thelight]

Where else are they going to be????

Eight people survived Noah flood, but nobody, not one single person, can or would survive the trib, except.

the number who does survive is so small a child can write the number.

I see interpretation of the trib as if it's just another world war like all the others we had, two "worldly forces" with nations siding up against the other.

But the trib is when this "Spiritual war" becomes an "Open physical war" between God and Satan, a time such as never been before or ever will be again,

And people believe the Body of Christ/Holy Ghost is going to be left to fight in this war with the devil/AC given power/dominion to prevail over them and wiped them/church out right along with everyone else.

Do you think anyone who believes the devil or any of his demons can have power over "God in the flesh" and his "Spirit",

Really knows/understand anything whatsoever about the scriptures??????

I see we look at the trib as spiritual more so than physical,that I agree....I don't see it becoming physical,perse,as deception is mental rather than physical,and that's what I feel the trib is all about...

in light of Christ telling us to fear not those who can kill the body,Im not understanding where you see a need for a rapture...

It would'nt matter if all Christians wre killed during this time,they still return with Christ,and is that not at His 2nd coming...So like I said,I still cant see how you get a rapture....

I guess our difference is,I see those who die coming back with Christ because they died, yet you see them coming back with Him because they were raptured....

 

[n2thelight]

Where else are they going to be????

Eight people survived Noah flood, but nobody, not one single person, can or would survive the trib, except.

the number who does survive is so small a child can write the number.

I see interpretation of the trib as if it's just another world war like all the others we had, two "worldly forces" with nations siding up against the other.

But the trib is when this "Spiritual war" becomes an "Open physical war" between God and Satan, a time such as never been before or ever will be again,

And people believe the Body of Christ/Holy Ghost is going to be left to fight in this war with the devil/AC given power/dominion to prevail over them and wiped them/church out right along with everyone else.

Do you think anyone who believes the devil or any of his demons can have power over "God in the flesh" and his "Spirit",

Really knows/understand anything whatsoever about the scriptures??????

I see we look at the trib as spiritual more so than physical,that I agree....I don't see it becoming physical,perse,as deception is mental rather than physical,and that's what I feel the trib is all about...

in light of Christ telling us to fear not those who can kill the body,Im not understanding where you see a need for a rapture...

It would'nt matter if all Christians wre killed during this time,they still return with Christ,and is that not at His 2nd coming...So like I said,I still cant see how you get a rapture....

I guess our difference is,I see those who die coming back with Christ because they died, yet you see them coming back with Him because they were raptured....

 

[n2thelight]

DP