Why does Mormonism want to be Associated with Christianity?

[Rescued One]

I thought kokaubeam was a drink...

Okay, I'll behave...what is a kokaubeam? Honestly, it does sound like a drink, doesn't it?

It is referred to as "a cluster of stars." Kolob (some say is referring to Jesus) is the greatest.

I read, but haven't verified, that Joseph Smith was being privately tutored in Hebrew when he came up with these words and they are similar to some Hebrew words.

 

[Rescued One]

"Our scriptures say that God told Moses only about this planet," said LDS apostle Neal A. Maxwell in a recent television interview. "But we're not worshiping a one-planet God."
Salt Lake Tribune Aug 1996 Vol. 252 No. 118

"As yet we do not know where the planet Kolob is located, but it, as well as the throne of God, must be a tremendous distance from the earth. Any personage coming from the presence of God would need to travel a tremendous distance to reach earth."
~ Alvin R. Dyer, "BYU Speeches", April 7, 1964, pp. 14-15

I don't know if Mormon leaders have studied their own religion sufficiently or if stars and planets are the same thing to them. I think I've read about planets (this earth, for instance) becoming glass orbs and the sun being a planet and all kinds of strange things in Mormon writings. I'm not trying to offend --- apparently some Mormons thought these things were true.

 

[Norah63]

The risen Lord Jesus of Nazereth is coming again, we hope very soon.
Will he find us ( Christians) united in love?
or arguing what we hope or think someone else believes different than another.

 

[katerinah1947]

The risen Lord Jesus of Nazereth is coming again, we hope very soon.
Will he find us ( Christians) united in love?
or arguing what we hope or think someone else believes different than another.

Hi,
Dearheart, I hope you don't think that is all that is going on here. TFT, is very careful to be nice, TheBarrd occasionally puts her brilliance into a civilian blue collar way.
The issue now at hand, is for TFT and others to say, how it is, they think they can reconcile their expanded and improved version of Scripture, with The Bible and what has been proven and shown to be true, by God Himself to many of us, and to others He has shown them through The Word only that the words of The Bible are His Words.
That they may be able to do. If they can fine. I have seen ~All of Creation, from Jesus actually. It is the depths of his own Tenderness and mildness.~ and yest that was to accomplish a job of understanding if you will. God was going to do something, and if I did not understand at that level, Jesus, then what was to happen, could not happen. So, do not make the mistake, that I am wonderful, but rather the ~One who manufactured me.~ is the One who is wonderful.
Yes, I still have a mission for God to do on this earth, and I feel my part is rapidly coming to a close. I know to whom my job is passed off to. I acutually know how the next part and roughly when a major part of that is to be started. The man is in training now. He will be done in 7 years or so.
In order for God to do what He wants to do, in this world, a person was needed. It turns out, I was His choice. He chose me. The job though is not really me, as he merely used me, to do what it is, He wished to do for the world. I expect the job started in me, will be done in 142 years or so.
You and the whole world will love, or like in male terminology, what God is doing. You will.
I do not know much about the LDS, and maybe God will tell us all they are right, and maybe He is going to tell them, how to change. I don't know that yet. I don't think he will use me for that, as right now, my assignements within my assignments, approved by the Bishop actually, and some even higher than he is in God's world, (I think) is to tell others what I know about God. I will not tell you how I know that, unless you absolutely need to know that.
So, I was here, because I am Trinitarian, by teaching and by sight, and by what I had to know, in order for God to ask me something one day, and for the other two of God, who asked me to tell others about God. One said, too many people do not know God. Tell them. The other said, keep telling people about God.
TFT, is not fighting. Hopefully, he is trying to figure out if and how, what is not changeable, The Bible as it is presently written, and what I know of God, from several several direct contacts with Him, can be true, along with all that he has been told is true, from a possible mystic, and possibly a false mystic.
~By the way, the last false mystic I was working with accidentally. I missed all the clues, as I didn't in those days know how to tell one from the other. In telling the story the short way, the false mystic came to me one day, after he had been outed. He said lots of things and was worried. He was told, since he did not know, then he is totally not at fault, but to realize that he is a mystic, but made a mistake and listened to the bad guys. ~ Now God bailed him out one day. In another case, I missed all the signs ~God actually sent an angel down, in an amazing way, to tell me I had been fooled. I have since changed back.~
I hope the arguments are over. I don't know though. I sorry this hurts you, and it should if they are really being argumentative. TFT, is not, right now, and seems to have never been.
LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[TasteForTruth]

Hi,
Dearheart, I hope you don't think that is all that is going on here. TFT, is very careful to be nice, TheBarrd occasionally puts her brilliance into a civilian blue collar way.
The issue now at hand, is for TFT and others to say, how it is, they think they can reconcile their expanded and improved version of Scripture, with The Bible and what has been proven and shown to be true, by God Himself to many of us, and to others He has shown them through The Word only that the words of The Bible are His Words.
That they may be able to do. If they can fine. I have seen ~All of Creation, from Jesus actually. It is the depths of his own Tenderness and mildness.~ and yest that was to accomplish a job of understanding if you will. God was going to do something, and if I did not understand at that level, Jesus, then what was to happen, could not happen. So, do not make the mistake, that I am wonderful, but rather the ~One who manufactured me.~ is the One who is wonderful.
Yes, I still have a mission for God to do on this earth, and I feel my part is rapidly coming to a close. I know to whom my job is passed off to. I acutually know how the next part and roughly when a major part of that is to be started. The man is in training now. He will be done in 7 years or so.
In order for God to do what He wants to do, in this world, a person was needed. It turns out, I was His choice. He chose me. The job though is not really me, as he merely used me, to do what it is, He wished to do for the world. I expect the job started in me, will be done in 142 years or so.
You and the whole world will love, or like in male terminology, what God is doing. You will.
I do not know much about the LDS, and maybe God will tell us all they are right, and maybe He is going to tell them, how to change. I don't know that yet. I don't think he will use me for that, as right now, my assignements within my assignments, approved by the Bishop actually, and some even higher than he is in God's world, (I think) is to tell others what I know about God. I will not tell you how I know that, unless you absolutely need to know that.
So, I was here, because I am Trinitarian, by teaching and by sight, and by what I had to know, in order for God to ask me something one day, and for the other two of God, who asked me to tell others about God. One said, too many people do not know God. Tell them. The other said, keep telling people about God.
TFT, is not fighting. Hopefully, he is trying to figure out if and how, what is not changeable, The Bible as it is presently written, and what I know of God, from several several direct contacts with Him, can be true, along with all that he has been told is true, from a possible mystic, and possibly a false mystic.
~By the way, the last false mystic I was working with accidentally. I missed all the clues, as I didn't in those days know how to tell one from the other. In telling the story the short way, the false mystic came to me one day, after he had been outed. He said lots of things and was worried. He was told, since he did not know, then he is totally not at fault, but to realize that he is a mystic, but made a mistake and listened to the bad guys. ~ Now God bailed him out one day. In another case, I missed all the signs ~God actually sent an angel down, in an amazing way, to tell me I had been fooled. I have since changed back.~
I hope the arguments are over. I don't know though. I sorry this hurts you, and it should if they are really being argumentative. TFT, is not, right now, and seems to have never been.
LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

There is no Biblical reconciliation to be forced upon LDS doctrines. The reason they differ from mainstream Christian doctrines, though, is because they are founded in revelation. And revelation obliges us to maintain a position that is incompatible with mainstream Christianity on several points.

 

[Ran77]

The risen Lord Jesus of Nazereth is coming again, we hope very soon.
Will he find us ( Christians) united in love?
or arguing what we hope or think someone else believes different than another.

Amen, sister. Amen.

 

[katerinah1947]

There is no Biblical reconciliation to be forced upon LDS doctrines. The reason they differ from mainstream Christian doctrines, though, is because they are founded in revelation. And revelation obliges us to maintain a position that is incompatible with mainstream Christianity on several points.

Hi,

The reverse. The reverse. This thread reworded by me is: How can the LDS, merge with mainstream Christianity and why do they want to do that, when so far they have not shown us mainstreamers, how to do that, if they are right?

I am asking how you can force LDS doctrines on Christians. Actually that is what I asked. I am still asking that.

Also since others are here, if you cannot, even if you are right and all of us Christians are wrong, why are you trying to force us to accept you??? Is there something in your LDS doctrine, that tells you that you have to show us the error of our ways? If so fine. Go for it. I am asking that also here.

I can hypothetically accept that you are right, and look for how you are right, when I do that. Show me how, that can be done, is what I hoped that I said. Hypothetically, how can your superior religion, cause Chritians to see the errors of their ways, in cases like mine?

I am willing to follow God, to Hell if need be, if it is God, and if He is asking me to do that.

LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[Ironhold]

All we want is a seat at the table, so to speak.

 

[katerinah1947]

All we want is a seat at the table, so to speak.

Hi,
And you don't think you'll get that? Fat chance. Or, are you speaking of wanting to be at a metaphorical table within Maintstream Christianity, without doing the work required?
What do you mean?
To be clear, you have the same fate as all Christians. That is in our Bible somewhere. When you die, you and everyone else, will see Jesus, then the talk begins.
We Christians, who work for God and know so much, have been told that. What? We have been told not to grieve for even Pagans, as they are going to have the very same things happen to them when they die, as even people like me, who have seen God etc.
If you are just; If you are right; then when you and Jesus talk, you will be with all the others like you.
Which table are you referring to?
If you want to be called Christians, like I and like many people here are, show us how. Show us how your Superior Religion, as at least one person here has said by calling us conned, show us how we can join you, without throwing out what God, the Actual God, showed and told so many of us, is True.
The discrepancy, hypothetically, is not that we are wrong and you are all right, it is how can you show us the error of our ways, without having us violate, God, the Real God.?
LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[bbbbbbb]

All we want is a seat at the table, so to speak.

That is not at all impossible. As Jesus said, "You must be born again." That will definitely give you a seat at His table.

 

[TasteForTruth]

Hi,

The reverse. The reverse. This thread reworded by me is: How can the LDS, merge with mainstream Christianity and why do they want to do that, when so far they have not shown us mainstreamers, how to do that, if they are right?

We are not interested in merging our doctrine with mainstream Christianity's.

I am asking how you can force LDS doctrines on Christians. Actually that is what I asked. I am still asking that.

We don't want to force our doctrines on anyone.

Also since others are here, if you cannot, even if you are right and all of us Christians are wrong, why are you trying to force us to accept you???

We're not. Why do you think that we are? What have we done that looks, to you, like "forcing" Christians to accept us or our doctrine?

Is there something in your LDS doctrine, that tells you that you have to show us the error of our ways? If so fine. Go for it. I am asking that also here.

Yes, there is. But CF is not the place for it. We are not allowed to proselytize our religion here.

I can hypothetically accept that you are right, and look for how you are right, when I do that. Show me how, that can be done, is what I hoped that I said. Hypothetically, how can your superior religion, cause Chritians to see the errors of their ways, in cases like mine?

Preaching the Gospel is man's commission. Convincing a person of the truth of the Gospel is God's commission. But again, this is not the place for preaching the Gospel (Restored).

I am willing to follow God, to Hell if need be, if it is God, and if He is asking me to do that.

There is no need for melodramatics...God has not asked anyone to follow Him to hell. He simply says, "Come, follow me." The challenge we all face, is recognizing His voice among the many that claim to be His authorized agents.

 

[drstevej]

All we want is a seat at the table, so to speak.

That is not the message of the First Vision.

 

[katerinah1947]

Hi,

The reverse. The reverse. This thread reworded by me is: How can the LDS, merge with mainstream Christianity and why do they want to do that, when so far they have not shown us mainstreamers, how to do that, if they are right?

We are not interested in merging our doctrine with mainstream Christianity's.
We don't want to force our doctrines on anyone.
We're not. Why do you think that we are? What have we done that looks, to you, like "forcing" Christians to accept us or our doctrine?
Yes, there is. But CF is not the place for it. We are not allowed to proselytize our religion here.
Preaching the Gospel is man's commission. Convincing a person of the truth of the Gospel is God's commission. But again, this is not the place for preaching the Gospel (Restored).
There is no need for melodramatics...God has not asked anyone to follow Him to hell. He simply says, "Come, follow me." The challenge we all face, is recognizing His voice among the many that claim to be His authorized agents.

Hi,


Again,
Why do you want us to merge with you, when we have the restrictions on us that we have???

You are asking us. It is us that must change, hypothetically.

Again,
Since you want us to change, how can someone like me do that, and not violate what God has shown me to be true, and shown so many others here, that it is True?

How is it, you expect us, not you to merge, with God telling us otherwise.
How is it, you expect us to throw out anything that God has revealed, such as The Bible, as we have it now?

Your religion is claiming superiority. Show us how we can change, without violating God, The God.

LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[Rescued One]

That is not the message of the First Vision.

Very true. We were basically told that they OWN the table and we're not allowed to come until we are worthy and know the password.

 

[katerinah1947]

Hi,

That is not melodramatics. It is commitment. Hopefully you have no insinuations there.
LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[RevelationTestament]

Hi,

The reverse. The reverse. This thread reworded by me is: How can the LDS, merge with mainstream Christianity and why do they want to do that, when so far they have not shown us mainstreamers, how to do that, if they are right?

I for one do not believe LDS Christians will ever merge with "mainstream Christianity." You hit on a point: why would we "want to do that?" I left "orthodox Christianity" because I learned for myself it does not have the complete truth. So why would I want to merge back with it? I am horribly dismayed by the creeds now. I look upon them as creating the complete anti-thesis to all the true scriptural points on which LDS Christianity differs from orthodoxy. In my view the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS are the true Christians, and many protestant Teutons will come to learn this, and will come to the LDS church - not vice versa - for they will learn that the God of Israel is with this church.

I am asking how you can force LDS doctrines on Christians. Actually that is what I asked. I am still asking that.

Jesus nor the Holy Spirit convert through force - that is Satan's way.

Also since others are here, if you cannot, even if you are right and all of us Christians are wrong, why are you trying to force us to accept you??? Is there something in your LDS doctrine, that tells you that you have to show us the error of our ways? If so fine. Go for it. I am asking that also here.

As an LDS Christian, I have never felt "accepted" by "mainstream Christians." That's ok. I am willing to suffer that in order to have the privilege of holding the true priesthood and to gain my salvation as an heir of Christ.

I can hypothetically accept that you are right, and look for how you are right, when I do that. Show me how, that can be done, is what I hoped that I said. Hypothetically, how can your superior religion, cause Chritians to see the errors of their ways, in cases like mine?

You claim to have "experienced" God - So have many others. They believe they are modern day prophets and write books trying to convince people that their scriptural interpretations are true. Your claim to have experienced God seems no different from 100s of others. I say "where is the beef?" Why should I believe you rather than the myriads of other people who claim to have seen God? They are a dime a dozen. And guess what? their stories conflict - they can't all be right. To me that says Satan's minions have been busy spreading lies.

I am willing to follow God, to Hell if need be, if it is God, and if He is asking me to do that.

Revelation 20:4
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

LOVE,
...Katherina., ....

same

 

[Rescued One]

...He simply says, "Come, follow me." The challenge we all face, is recognizing His voice among the many that claim to be His authorized agents.

I don't think it's that difficult.

John 10
1 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. 2 But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. 3 To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out. 4 And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. 5 And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers. 6 This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.



I trust Him.

 

[katerinah1947]

I for one do not believe LDS Christians will ever merge with "mainstream Christianity." You hit on a point: why would we "want to do that?" I left "orthodox Christianity" because I learned for myself it does not have the complete truth. So why would I want to merge back with it? I am horribly dismayed by the creeds now. I look upon them as creating the complete anti-thesis to all the true scriptural points on which LDS Christianity differs from orthodoxy. In my view the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS are the true Christians, and many protestant Teutons will come to learn this, and will come to the LDS church - not vice versa - for they will learn that the God of Israel is with this church.

Jesus nor the Holy Spirit convert through force - that is Satan's way.

As an LDS Christian, I have never felt "accepted" by "mainstream Christians." That's ok. I am willing to suffer that in order to have the privilege of holding the true priesthood and to gain my salvation as an heir of Christ.

You claim to have "experienced" God - So have many others. They believe they are modern day prophets and write books trying to convince people that their scriptural interpretations are true. Your claim to have experienced God seems no different from 100s of others. I say "where is the beef?" Why should I believe you rather than the myriads of other people who claim to have seen God? They are a dime a dozen. And guess what? their stories conflict - they can't all be right. To me that says Satan's minions have been busy spreading lies.


Revelation 20:4
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

same

Hi,
Wow. I must have worded that wrong. My question is why do you want us to merge with you?
I never meant to imply that you are to merge with us, from your point of view. Never did I mean that.
Why do you want us to merge with you, and a religion that is supposedly more truthful and more accurate than my religion, with no help, on issues like the ones I have and others have?
How can we merge, when you have not shown us how, without violating God, in any way?

LOVE (By the way, this is meant by me, to love the Way God loves. Once He actually gave that to me. I learned from that. I put that in all capitals for me to remind myself to care for you and all others the way God does. I just do what I remember, and the best way I remember, how He, God acually loves us.) I do not mean that word as romantic, nor in any other way. You can say, the same, but know what you are saying the same to.

LOVE,
...Katherina., .... .

 

[TheBarrd]

All we want is a seat at the table, so to speak.

Katie asks a very reasonable question.
How can you force LDS doctrine on mainstream Christians?

Would there be a seat at the LDS table for one who refuses to accept Joseph Smith as a true prophet? If that one says that he is a phony, will he be welcome in your company?

To mainstream Christians the idea that God is nothing more than an "exalted" man, and that there are who-knows-how-many such "gods" is pure anathema. How can you expect to share a table with them?

 

[TheBarrd]

I can respect that Mormons have their own faith, and I can have a love for individual Mormons. But I can't see them as fellow-Christians since the god they worship is not the God of Christianity. The names they use in their worship might be similar, but are not the same God.
With the best will in the world, I can't see a bond there.

So, once again...how will you force LDS doctrine on believing Christians?