Hyper grace and the great lie

[lori milne]

OK. Forget about RCG. What about tetelestai?

What is tetelestai?

 

[lori milne]

OK. Forget about RCG. What about tetelestai?

Ok it is finished.
is his work is done

But how is that grace covers current sin without repentance ?
Ephesians talks about Gods work in us as well

 

[lori milne]

Ok it is finished. is his work is done But how is that grace covers current sin without repentance ? Ephesians talks about Gods work in us as well

Is works separate from repentance is My new question
Just curiouse

 

[BryanW92]

Ok it is finished.
is his work is done

But how is that grace covers current sin without repentance ?
Ephesians talks about Gods work in us as well

There's a lot more to it than just "his work is done" because our language does not convey what that really meant when he said it. No one is saying that you shouldn't repent for sins, but we are saying that we don't have to maintain a balance sheet where were can prove repentance for each and every sin committed after our instant of justification by grace.

You are searching for truth and answers. There is a lot of truth in tetelestai. It can help you to finally understand the freedom of being in Christ. From your posts, you don't get that right now. I had the same problem when I was an Arminian Christian.

 

[lori milne]

There's a lot more to it than just "his work is done" because our language does not convey what that really meant when he said it. No one is saying that you shouldn't repent for sins, but we are saying that we don't have to maintain a balance sheet where were can prove repentance for each and every sin committed after our instant of justification by grace. You are searching for truth and answers. There is a lot of truth in tetelestai. It can help you to finally understand the freedom of being in Christ. From your posts, you don't get that right now. I had the same problem when I was an Arminian Christian.

My true understanding is prayed for Daily it's hard to grasp it fully without exploring and meditating on the word
My brother said to me that you can sin and not repent and it is forgiven this confuses me the most. I will keep searching until its confirmed by the Word
Amen

 

[BryanW92]

My true understanding is prayed for Daily it's hard to grasp it fully without exploring and meditating on the word
My brother said to me that you can sin and not repent and it is forgiven this confuses me the most. I will keep searching until its confirmed by the Word
Amen

Sometimes people like your brother don't adequately explain what they are saying, especially on subjects like sin and repentence. The problem with praying for repentence daily is that if that was required, then you could die between a sin and your daily prayer and would not be perfect when arriving before the Father.

Also, if praying for repentance was enough, then you wouldn't need Jesus. But, a prayer is not enough, as evidenced by Jewish law. They had to make blood sacrifices as their atonement. Our daily prayers are hardly a sacrifice.
If you tie those daily prayers back to the sacrifice of Christ and call the sacrifice of Christ our sacrifice, then of what use are the prayers?

This is the problem with Arminian salvation. It turns into a circular argument and each time you go around the circle, it diminishes the work of Christ a little more.

 

[lori milne]

Sometimes people like your brother don't adequately explain what they are saying, especially on subjects like sin and repentence. The problem with praying for repentence daily is that if that was required, then you could die between a sin and your daily prayer and would not be perfect when arriving before the Father. Also, if praying for repentance was enough, then you wouldn't need Jesus. But, a prayer is not enough, as evidenced by Jewish law. They had to make blood sacrifices as their atonement. Our daily prayers are hardly a sacrifice. If you tie those daily prayers back to the sacrifice of Christ and call the sacrifice of Christ our sacrifice, then of what use are the prayers? This is the problem with Arminian salvation. It turns into a circular argument and each time you go around the circle, it diminishes the work of Christ a little more.

I have been searching for truth not through any theology
But the word.
Amen my search is continued because of versus and teachings in the word
This one is one !
Paul states that Grace is given through righteousness


That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord

Romans‬ [bless and do not curse]5‬:[bless and do not curse]21‬ KJV

David's used to explain righteousness to the people by Paul again

Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin
Romans‬ [bless and do not curse]4‬:[bless and do not curse]6-8‬ KJV
Forgiven sins with our works or sacrifice

Correct me But doesn't this implies
That
1 works and repenting aren't the same
2 righteousness is given for living sin free
3 your favored in gods eyes / in Gods grace After righteousness
4 through faith after believing the words of God
5 then u do works because u want to

 

[BryanW92]

If you want to find truth in the bible, stay away from prooftexting. If you are going to quote Romans 5:21, you really should read the whole chapter (as a minimum). Verses 12-21 help to explain why you misunderstand verse 21 so badly.

Same thing with Romans 4:6-8. Read all of chapter 4. You say you want truth, so search for it. All you are searching for right now is PROOF. Searching for PROOF is the result of PRIDE.

 

[lori milne]

If you want to find truth in the bible, stay away from prooftexting. If you are going to quote Romans 5:21, you really should read the whole chapter (as a minimum). Verses 12-21 help to explain why you misunderstand verse 21 so badly. Same thing with Romans 4:6-8. Read all of chapter 4. You say you want truth, so search for it. All you are searching for right now is PROOF. Searching for PROOF is the result of PRIDE.

I've been studying in just recently in Romans I was giving info to you on Ro 3:1-4:25
I'm still studying the entire book
It's the Jews actually having the same questions as me grace vs works /law ,why the Greeks received grace with no works .
I read for hours at a time, till my husband gets annoyed lol

 

[ToBeBlessed]

I've been studying in just recently in Romans I was giving info to you on Ro 3:1-4:25
I'm still studying the entire book
It's the Jews actually having the same questions as me grace vs works /law ,why the Greeks received grace with no works .
I read for hours at a time, till my husband gets annoyed lol

Part of the process of reading is to put the pieces together. No one would understand the bible if each verse stood alone.

You should also think after you have read "Do I have any questions?". How does this new information fit into what I already know. One builds knowledge upon other knowledge. There has to be a piece of understanding and relating it to your life or yourself or what is this trying to teach me? How does this effect my life and faith?

Seeking to understand.

 

[lori milne]

Sometimes people like your brother don't adequately explain what they are saying, especially on subjects like sin and repentence. The problem with praying for repentence daily is that if that was required, then you could die between a sin and your daily prayer and would not be perfect when arriving before the Father. Also, if praying for repentance was enough, then you wouldn't need Jesus. But, a prayer is not enough, as evidenced by Jewish law. They had to make blood sacrifices as their atonement. Our daily prayers are hardly a sacrifice. If you tie those daily prayers back to the sacrifice of Christ and call the sacrifice of Christ our sacrifice, then of what use are the prayers? This is the problem with Arminian salvation. It turns into a circular argument and each time you go around the circle, it diminishes the work of Christ a little more.

Just on a side note arminism was about free will vs predestination and not saved by grace I don't think anyways

 

[BryanW92]

Just on a side note arminism was about free will vs predestination and not saved by grace I don't think anyways

That's right. All serious Christian theologies understand that salvation is by grace. They all understand that we cannot be perfect enough to save ourselves. They understand that the work of Christ on the cross is the gift and grace is God's act (not our act) of giving it.

 

[BryanW92]

Part of the process of reading is to put the pieces together. No one would understand the bible if each verse stood alone.

I agree. Not everyone has the same gifts and no one has all the gifts, so this is why the church is so important in the life of each and every Christian. The "I read the bible and that is my church" types are withholding from themselves the full measure of Jesus. Everyone needs a church so they don't start to create a false gospel for themselves.

 

[lori milne]

That's right. All serious Christian theologies understand that salvation is by grace. They all understand that we cannot be perfect enough to save ourselves. They understand that the work of Christ on the cross is the gift and grace is God's act (not our act) of giving it.

Theology thats a theory of
The bible to me is factual thank God!
The steam of the running churches all steam from
One theology
Not multiple that's John Calvin's theory on Christianity
Again I don't know about the other free will would imply we have a choice to leave grace fall away so I can only "assume"

 

[lori milne]

I agree. Not everyone has the same gifts and no one has all the gifts, so this is why the church is so important in the life of each and every Christian. The "I read the bible and that is my church" types are withholding from themselves the full measure of Jesus. Everyone needs a church so they don't start to create a false gospel for themselves.

Well thank God i go to church and have for over 36 years

 

[hmw]

You being a scoffer aren't you,? :/

No, not a scoffer. Instead I'm just sharing the warnings in scripture that Christians should not tolerate any error doctrine that mixes works of the law, with grace. See 1Cor 5:1-13.

We are to purge out the old leaven/doctrine of righteousness by works of the law, as a little leaven leavens the whole lump.

The mixing of grace and law is clear what Paul was teaching
Works came because they were under Gods grace amen
They wanted to do it freely!
It didn't come first
IF YOU READ the whole letter not just the in between parts
He even brakes down the order of grace and law through faith and righteousness.
So we can see clearly how to obtain GODS Favor Which is what the Jews were complaining about to Paul.
Why did the Gentiles receive GODS favor with no works should we then not work?

And under grace we see that the works God requires of us is to believe on Jesus, John 6:29.

This is consistent with God's will that we believe on Jesus, John 6:40.

It's consistent with Christ's commandment that we believe on him, John 3:16.

It's consistent with how we overcome the world, which is by believing on Jesus, 1John 5:5.

But the error doctrine you follow contradicts what scripture says.

 

[BryanW92]

Well thank God i go to church and have for over 36 years

Amen to that!! Do you participate in bible study classes at your church? You seem to be searching for an answer that would be cleared up in an hour of bible study with some other Christians. The internet is the wrong place to find answers. We should always take our questions to our local church where people can look us in the eye as they hear our questions and we can see them as they help us find answers. If you've already tried the local church and "everyone there is wrong", then perhaps you need to re-examine your own findings.

 

[Dan61861]

God forbid that any of us should sin, when we do we have Christ.

I'm a new creature, born new in Christ. When I came to Jesus, I died. I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I that lives, but Christ that lives in me. Their is no condemnation in those that are in Christ, Jesus. None whatsoever!

Just as a woman is bound by her husband, when he dies she is free. My death in Christ has set me free from the works of the Law. I am no longer under the curse of the Law. I have liberty in Christ, to serve God. Within this liberty, a Christian should have no malicious intent. We are to serve God in love.

It is not my righteousness that I live in, it is Christ's righteouness. Mine is as filthy rags before God. We have put on Christ's righteouness, in him we are perfect like he is perfect.

I cannot sin because I am in Christ. I am no longer under the law, I'm under God's Grace. It doesn't say that I do not sin, because I do. I cannot because Blessed is the man whom the Lord does not impute sin. When we are in Christ, God does not charge us with sin.

We all know that each of us sin, we all fall short of the glory of God. The Law teaches us, it should humble us. Bringing each of us to the cross of Christ our Lord. Knowing this, loving one another comes easier, for we know Christ died for us all.

In Christ
Daniel

 

[Dan61861]

Mat 7 21-23 I never knew you.

There is no doubt these people were doing wonderful works, their down fall...they justified themselves. Let God be magnified!

Just as we look back, to the cross, righteous Abel looked forward to the cross. Cain was rejected because he offered his works to the Lord.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

What it seems to me and I have been following and commenting on three or four of Lori's threads is that she does not have a clear understanding of what certain words mean.

Examples of this may be grace, justification, sanctification, sin and how these words pertain back to salvation and what Jesus did for us on the cross. I believe that if she would seek to clarify and understand these things, that she would see that they do not take anything away from the finished work of Christ.

It seems she is defending against these words, mistakenly thinking that they take away from what Jesus did. I think that she compares each word to the finished work of Christ and then defends Christ, instead of seeing that the words are part of what we receive and part of what has been done for us. It is in a premise of defending against these other things that she views them, not understanding their meaning in a bigger picture.