What Would Evidence for God's Existence Be Like?

[cedric1200]

But He loves you!

This fearful post reminds me of this funny quote from the late George Carlin.

Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

But He loves you!

Thank you. It is hard to remember that sometimes.

 

[4x4toy]

The fact that God is revealed to those who seek Him and remain hid to the rest is my biggest proof .. At the judgement there will be no doubt the sheep from the goats and the wheat from the tares ..

 

[madaz]

But thenThey were willing to die for what they believed and to many this would seem a crazy act for what would be a lie.

Steve, why do you insist on using this sort of bizarre behavior as evidence of God?

It's just evidence of a crazy act, much like the events of 9/11.

Nothing more, nothing less.

And I thought Jesus died for reasons more important to Christians than making supposedly outrageous claims.

 

[cedric1200]

Ah Carl Sagan strikes again.

Tell me has your dragon left any physical evidence of his presence ?

Well, in the mind of a doubter. A dragon could leave evidence of his presence, but the evidence still may not be evidence enough that it was a dragon. For example, a dragon can breath fire into the dumbster, but for all we know it was a human that set the trash on fire. This reminds of me of big foot. People are claiming evidence all the time. But doubters always have an explaination for those evidence.

I don't think this world is evidence enough of God's existance for an atheist. Now, I can not say I know the mind of an atheist, but I am trying to understand them. For example, in their minds, the earth could have always been here just in different form, which I read from a poster on here. I've also read some of them think that it was an accident. I read what other scientist believed. But everything is just theories. They have explainations for everything that's not God. Proof could stare someone in the face, but it may not be enough proof for the doubter, unless they see God face to face. Scientist can come up with many different explainations about this or that as we well know.

Now, when Jesus stood before his accusers they said to him "if you are the Son of God, turn these stones into bread." Jesus just stood there. He was also asked "are you the Son of God?" Jesus said "it is as you say. And you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand throne of God." That's the burden of proof. It's in the future. This is what it's going to be like when God reveals himself to the world. We can't use human scientific reasoning to prove the existence of God. Jesus did not. Now neither can we.

 

[stevevw]

Steve, why do you insist on using this sort of bizarre behavior as evidence of God?

It's just evidence of a crazy act, much like the events of 9/11.

Nothing more, nothing less.

And I thought Jesus died for reasons more important to Christians than making supposedly outrageous claims.

The problem is the characters of those who died didn't come across as the type of persons to do those sort of things. They were wise and made a lot of sense in everything else they did and giving up their lives for a lie would go against their characters. If you look at the disciples of Jesus they all were everyday people. Not radical or impulsive or have the sort of talk that would indicate someone doing such an extreme act. Jesus was the same. They showed intelligence, integrity, awareness and honesty in their characters. The advice and teachings were not crazy and offered good ideas for living and dealing with life.

In fact history shows that many were inspired by these acts including even non believers in which some were inspired to become believers themselves. They seen something in the Christians that was genuine and respected what they stood for. There are other supports as well but I think this one is a testament to the courage and commitment of good people rather than the madness of deluded people.

 

[madaz]

The problem is the characters of those who died didn't come across as the type of persons to do those sort of things.
<snip>
There are other supports as well but I think this one is a testament to the courage and commitment of good people rather than the madness of deluded people.

I'm sure you will find family members of Islamic suicide bombers saying these sorts of things too Steve.

Regardless, this is only evidence of ones sincerity in their beliefs.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

The fact that God is revealed to those who seek Him and remain hid to the rest is my biggest proof .. At the judgement there will be no doubt the sheep from the goats and the wheat from the tares ..

What about all those who seek him but never find him, or those who seek him and find the God (or gods) of a religion different to yours?

 

[siralex172]

The sun and the moon are exactly in the right positions to be viewed as equal size in our sky.
Scientists estimate the chance to produce life is 1 in 10 to the power of 40,000

 

[Archaeopteryx]

The sun and the moon are exactly in the right positions to be viewed as equal size in our sky.
Scientists estimate the chance to produce life is 1 in 10 to the power of 40,000

The chance of any one individual winning the lottery is small, so that must mean that no one ever wins, right?

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Well, in the mind of a doubter. A dragon could leave evidence of his presence, but the evidence still may not be evidence enough that it was a dragon. For example, a dragon can breath fire into the dumbster, but for all we know it was a human that set the trash on fire. This reminds of me of big foot. People are claiming evidence all the time. But doubters always have an explaination for those evidence.

I don't think this world is evidence enough of God's existance for an atheist. Now, I can not say I know the mind of an atheist, but I am trying to understand them. For example, in their minds, the earth could have always been here just in different form, which I read from a poster on here. I've also read some of them think that it was an accident. I read what other scientist believed. But everything is just theories. They have explainations for everything that's not God. Proof could stare someone in the face, but it may not be enough proof for the doubter, unless they see God face to face. Scientist can come up with many different explainations about this or that as we well know.

Now, when Jesus stood before his accusers they said to him "if you are the Son of God, turn these stones into bread." Jesus just stood there. He was also asked "are you the Son of God?" Jesus said "it is as you say. And you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand throne of God." That's the burden of proof. It's in the future. This is what it's going to be like when God reveals himself to the world. We can't use human scientific reasoning to prove the existence of God. Jesus did not. Now neither can we.

I think you should be credited for conceding this, given that many believers are of the view that their beliefs can be justified in such a way that it would be unreasonable for others not to assent to them.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

The problem is the characters of those who died didn't come across as the type of persons to do those sort of things. They were wise and made a lot of sense in everything else they did and giving up their lives for a lie would go against their characters. If you look at the disciples of Jesus they all were everyday people. Not radical or impulsive or have the sort of talk that would indicate someone doing such an extreme act. Jesus was the same. They showed intelligence, integrity, awareness and honesty in their characters. The advice and teachings were not crazy and offered good ideas for living and dealing with life.

In fact history shows that many were inspired by these acts including even non believers in which some were inspired to become believers themselves. They seen something in the Christians that was genuine and respected what they stood for. There are other supports as well but I think this one is a testament to the courage and commitment of good people rather than the madness of deluded people.

An upstanding moral character does not entail that one cannot be mistaken in his beliefs. Intelligence is no guarantee either.

 

[4x4toy]

The chance of any one individual winning the lottery is small, so that must mean that no one ever wins, right?

Well , certainly not 1000 times in a row with the same numbers

 

[4x4toy]

What about all those who seek him but never find him, or those who seek him and find the God (or gods) of a religion different to yours?

Seek Him on your terms or His ?

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Seek Him on your terms or His ?

How would you tell the difference?

 

[bhsmte]

Thank you. It is hard to remember that sometimes.

For some, it becomes quite difficult to reconcile, that is why more and more people, do not believe a personal God exists.

 

[Davian]

Ah Carl Sagan strikes again.

Tell me has your dragon left any physical evidence of his presence ?

Would you expect any?

 

[Davian]

I agree with you.

And I also agree that I can't prove to you that God exists. No matter what logics we throw your way, we can't prove it to you. It may not be logical to you. I have already establish that.

As I posted earlier in this thread, I do not ask for proof. However, I would ask for something testable, however small, that could point towards the existence of deities like that described in the bible.

If we were discussing extraterrestrial aliens visiting Earth, I would not demand you walk one up to my front door. Start with some evidence that this sort of thing is even possible.

I only believe because of my experiences, and the testimonies of trusted witnesses. I believe the Bible because I have seen the Bible come to life; not just because mommy and daddy told me. Can I prove it? No. I will admit that. In the Bible, which I believe to be truth based on what I witnessed, only God can reveal himself to people. I believe because God revealed himself to me.

There are personal experiences by people abducted by extraterrestrial aliens that are large in number. Their testimonies, of people still alive in the present, are well documented.

"The precise number of alleged abductees is uncertain. One of the earliest studies of abductions found 1,700 claimants, while contested surveys argued that 5&#8211;6 percent of the general population might have been abducted."

Alien abduction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Do you live with the concern of being abducted by aliens? If no, why not?

 

[cedric1200]

I think you should be credited for conceding this, given that many believers are of the view that their beliefs can be justified in such a way that it would be unreasonable for others not to assent to them.

Thanks

I am starting to understand where you are coming from.

 

[cedric1200]

For some, it becomes quite difficult to reconcile, that is why more and more people, do not believe a personal God exists.

I understand.

 

[com7fy8]

What about all those who seek him but never find him, or those who seek him and find the God (or gods) of a religion different to yours?

Any of us can suppose we are seeking God, when we are not. How do you know they really were seeking Him? Do you know each of these people personally? You would need the capability to know their minds and hearts, which a number of Christians do not claim the ability to do since we believe we are not God.

But may be there are ones who think they are God all-knowing and so they know what is going on in other people.

I personally may be discovering that I don't know, really, what is going in in myself, never mind in anyone else ! !