The Sun Revolves Around The Earth: Scripture Cannot Lie

[JacobLaw]

Yikes.

I assure you we are very serious; and on the day of reckoning we will not be ashamed.

 

[sculleywr]

I assure you we are very serious; and on the day of reckoning we will not be ashamed.

Since a belief in cosmology is not necessary for salvation, neither will we. The only way that you will be ashamed is by making it a requirement, and thusly becoming a stumbling block to the weak. I believe that Christ had some interesting words for stumbling blocks. Something about millstones and necks.

That does not make you right. Geocentrism is an INTERPRETATION and not a plain teaching. Especially considering that the original language didn't use any rising or setting of the sun.

 

[FlameAlchemist]

I assure you we are very serious; and on the day of reckoning we will not be ashamed.

Are you claiming I will go to Hell for not believing the geocentric model?

 

[Sunshine Locket]

I was sent a link to a video today and started browsing that site. I found these and remembered this thread.
It may help in furthering the discussion.



Part 1: TRUTH! The Earth does not revolve around the Sun - The exposure of hiding - in April 2012. - YouTube


Part 2: www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCUhm63ioCU

 

[Sunshine Locket]

repeat post

 

[Sunshine Locket]

double post

 

[JacobLaw]

Are you claiming I will go to Hell for not believing the geocentric model?

And how would I know that? God is the judge not me, I was talking about me not being ashamed for believing what the bible says, hope you don't have a problem with that.
So please stop trying to pick a fight, I will ignore you from now on if you continue with accusing me of something I didn't say.
BTW
I am nearly certain Christian that thought the earth orbited the sun have gone to heaven and not hell.

 

[sculleywr]

And how would I know that? God is the judge not me, I was talking about me not being ashamed for believing what the bible says, hope you don't have a problem with that. So please stop trying to pick a fight, I will ignore you from now on if you continue with accusing me of something I didn't say. BTW I am nearly certain Christian that thought the earth orbited the sun have gone to heaven and not hell.

You claim someone doesn't believe the bible

 

[yeshuasavedme]

... the original language didn't use any rising or setting of the sun.

YHWH says the sun rises in the east, so that fact is "Thus saith YHWH", and is His POV.

Daybreak -dawn, is the light breaking forth.
The light breaking forth was called "day".
The sun was created and set in the heavens -in the firmament which you unwisely have claimed has collapsed and is no more, since the flood- to govern/rule the light by day.

The light circles the earth from the beginning, and breaks forth over each point of the globe breaking the day, while traveling in the circuit of the earth in its ordained course in the four seasons.

Num 2:1,3 And YHWH spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying...
And on the east side toward the rising of the sun shall they of the standard of the camp of Judah pitch throughout their armies: and Nahshon the son of Amminadab shall be captain of the children of Judah.

Psa 50:1 [[A Psalm of Asaph.]] The mighty God, even the LORD, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof.

Psa 113:3 From the rising of the sun unto the going down of the same the LORD'S name is to be praised.


Thus saith YHWH -in His language and from His POV:
Isa 41:25 I have raised up one from the north, and he shall come: from the rising of the sun shall he call upon my name: and he shall come upon princes as upon morter, and as the potter treadeth clay.

Thus saith YHWH -in His language and from His POV:
Isa 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

You claim someone doesn't believe the bible

On the point of the heavens/the firmament stretched out and named two waters/sha-mayim
circling the earth every day from the beginning of creation
and being stretched out between the divided in two waters of this globe on day 2, in stories/levels
and the sun rising in the east and setting in the west day by day,
you do not believe the plain, clear, literal Word of God.
No one has to accuse you of this unbelief on these points, for you are quite adamant in declaring your unbelief in the Word on these points and declaring -with pride, rather- your belief in fallible men with false doctrines that deny the Word of God.

 

[Krillin]

Might I suggest that, despite our technological advances to see how the universe operates, understanding how certain heavenly bodies move about could very well be a morally ambiguous topic?

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Might I suggest that, despite our technological advances to see how the universe operates, understanding how certain heavenly bodies move about could very well be a morally ambiguous topic?

Actually, because men have rejected the Word of God and the Wisdom of God, they will be given over to believe" the lie" in the end, during the great tribulation, which Enoch described and Paul remarked upon.
The earth will be moved out of her fixed place and jump about as a hunted roe and staggar as a drunken man, and be turned upside down and the seasons will be backwards, and the sun will shine so hot -and the moon- that if the LORD did not cut those days off from shining by one third of their parts [with roughly 16 hour days then, instead of 24] then no flesh on earth would survive the great heat, but for the sake of the elect [the seed of Jacob] He will cut off 1/3 of the days and 1/3 of the nights from shining.

Enoch the prophet, the seventh from Adam, wrote of the great tribulation as the second consummation of sin on earth: his book opens with the declaration that His book is for those who will be alive in the great tribulation and which Jude quotes from.

The Book of Enoch, Translated by Robert H. Charles, 1912
The Sin of Mankind Affects the Heavenly Bodies
Enoch chapter 80:
2And in the days of the sinners the years shall be shortened,
And their seed shall be tardy on their lands and fields,
And all things on the earth shall alter,
And shall not appear in their time:
And the rain shall be kept back
And the heaven shall withhold it.
3And in those times the fruits of the earth shall be backward,
And shall not grow in their time,
And the fruits of the trees shall be withheld in their time.
4And the moon shall alter her order,
And not appear at her time.
5And in those days the sun shall be seen and he shall journey in the evening on the extremity of the great chariot in the west
And shall shine more brightly than accords with the order of light.
6And many chiefs of the stars shall transgress the order prescribed.
And these shall alter their orbits and tasks,
And not appear at the seasons prescribed to them.
7And the whole order of the stars shall be concealed from the sinners,
And the thoughts of those on the earth shall err concerning them,
And they shall be altered from all their ways,
Yea, they shall err and take them to be gods.
8And evil shall be multiplied upon them,
And punishment shall come upon them
So as to destroy all."

 

[JacobLaw]

On the point of the heavens/the firmament stretched out and named two waters/sha-mayim
circling the earth every day from the beginning of creation
and being stretched out between the divided in two waters of this globe on day 2, in stories/levels
and the sun rising in the east and setting in the west day by day,
you do not believe the plain, clear, literal Word of God.
No one has to accuse you of this unbelief on these points, for you are quite adamant in declaring your unbelief in the Word on these points and declaring -with pride, rather- your belief in fallible men with false doctrines that deny the Word of God.

Remember who you are talk to, his sub title is "trouble-making crazy guy" I feel that has got to tell you something, anyway I feel he means something with it, it is a hard to tell because I feel he will report you for flaming or something when ever he thinks it imply something or not, but I sometime feel that stating the obvious can be a crime I suppose.
BTW: I feel you make a great point, but some people I feel like to read more into what the discussion is than what it really is, I think they call that trouble making, and really feel it is just crazy.
Basically I feel some people are stalking us because I feel like they hate us for our Christian beliefs.
But that is just my feelings, which I suppose I get to have.

 

[sculleywr]

On the point of the heavens/the firmament stretched out and named two waters/sha-mayim circling the earth every day from the beginning of creation and being stretched out between the divided in two waters of this globe on day 2, in stories/levels and the sun rising in the east and setting in the west day by day, you do not believe the plain, clear, literal Word of God. No one has to accuse you of this unbelief on these points, for you are quite adamant in declaring your unbelief in the Word on these points and declaring -with pride, rather- your belief in fallible men with false doctrines that deny the Word of God.

How about I skip your esoteric interpretations and stick with plain reading of scripture?

 

[sculleywr]

YHWH says the sun rises in the east, so that fact is "Thus saith YHWH", and is His POV. Daybreak -dawn, is the light breaking forth. The light breaking forth was called "day". The sun was created and set in the heavens -in the firmament which you unwisely have claimed has collapsed and is no more, since the flood- to govern/rule the light by day. The light circles the earth from the beginning, and breaks forth over each point of the globe breaking the day, while traveling in the circuit of the earth in its ordained course in the four seasons. Num 2:1,3 And YHWH spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying... And on the east side toward the rising of the sun shall they of the standard of the camp of Judah pitch throughout their armies: and Nahshon the son of Amminadab shall be captain of the children of Judah. Psa 50:1 [[A Psalm of Asaph.]] The mighty God, even the LORD, hath spoken, and called the earth from the rising of the sun unto the going down thereof. Psa 113:3 From the rising of the sun unto the going down of the same the LORD'S name is to be praised. Thus saith YHWH -in His language and from His POV: Isa 41:25 I have raised up one from the north, and he shall come: from the rising of the sun shall he call upon my name: and he shall come upon princes as upon morter, and as the potter treadeth clay. Thus saith YHWH -in His language and from His POV: Isa 59:19 So shall they fear the name of the LORD from the west, and his glory from the rising of the sun. When the enemy shall come in like a flood, the Spirit of the LORD shall lift up a standard against him.

That's in English. Not in either the Hebrew or the Greek

 

[sculleywr]

Remember who you are talk to, his sub title is "trouble-making crazy guy" I feel that has got to tell you something, anyway I feel he means something with it, it is a hard to tell because I feel he will report you for flaming or something when ever he thinks it imply something or not, but I sometime feel that stating the obvious can be a crime I suppose. BTW: I feel you make a great point, but some people I feel like to read more into what the discussion is than what it really is, I think they call that trouble making, and really feel it is just crazy. Basically I feel some people are stalking us because I feel like they hate us for our Christian beliefs. But that is just my feelings, which I suppose I get to have.

Classic ad hominem. You disparage my argument based on the person who gives it rather than on the merits of the fact that the person you speak of is simply aware enough of his own sinfulness to know he is not perfect.

Every scientific experiment ever run, like sending people into the vast emptiness of space to find it isn't really empty, has discovered one thing: man is not the center of creation. God is. If the sun is God's temple, as YSM would have us believe, then everything OUGHT to revolve around the temple of God. However, either way, we have been in space. We calculate according to the actual movement of the earth.

What we don't use with our satellites is the lie YSM would have us buy about the GPS satellites.

 

[JacobLaw]

Classic ad hominem. You disparage my argument based on the person who gives it rather than on the merits of the fact that the person you speak of is simply aware enough of his own sinfulness to know he is not perfect.

Every scientific experiment ever run, like sending people into the vast emptiness of space to find it isn't really empty, has discovered one thing: man is not the center of creation. God is. If the sun is God's temple, as YSM would have us believe, then everything OUGHT to revolve around the temple of God. However, either way, we have been in space. We calculate according to the actual movement of the earth.

What we don't use with our satellites is the lie YSM would have us buy about the GPS satellites.

I don't think YSM is lying, and I understand why you believe what you believe which you are free to try to convince others of your beliefs.
We believe what we believe because what the bible tells us; you see it different but you might want to give us our liberty to express our biblical beliefs without being constantly harassing and being accused of lying.
So let's try to cut down on the rhetoric and be civil please.
I don't like the trouble making or crazy actions, so pleassssse stop it.

 

[Gnarwhal]

How about I skip your esoteric interpretations and stick with plain reading of scripture?

Wise move my friend. YSM's use of spurious texts and her quack beliefs simply cannot contend with the true reality of God's cosmos - the Earth revolves around the sun, this solar system is in the Orion arm of the Milky Way galaxy which is part of the local group in the Virgo Supercluster.

That's the way it is, and if she wants to plug her fingers in her ears and shout "la-la-la", well she's welcome to live within that fantasy.

Classic ad hominem. You disparage my argument based on the person who gives it rather than on the merits of the fact that the person you speak of is simply aware enough of his own sinfulness to know he is not perfect.

Every scientific experiment ever run, like sending people into the vast emptiness of space to find it isn't really empty, has discovered one thing: man is not the center of creation. God is. If the sun is God's temple, as YSM would have us believe, then everything OUGHT to revolve around the temple of God. However, either way, we have been in space. We calculate according to the actual movement of the earth.

What we don't use with our satellites is the lie YSM would have us buy about the GPS satellites.

I think you ought to report him, bro. His insolence is going unchecked and is deserving of staff action.

I don't think YSM is lying, and I understand why you believe what you believe which you are free to try to convince others of your beliefs.
We believe what we believe because what the bible tells us; you see it different but you might want to give us our liberty to express our biblical beliefs without being constantly harassing and being accused of lying.
So let's try to cut down on the rhetoric and be civil please.
I don't like the trouble making or crazy actions, so pleassssse stop it.

As long as you recognize that our beliefs are biblical as well, then there's no problem. The issue arises when one party asserts that their beliefs are biblical while the others is not. It boils down to interpretation, individuals like sculley and myself see both sides as interpreting the same scriptures differently.

Our belief in the bible as a whole is no less than yours, we just understand that the scriptures are written in a variety of different literary forums like poetry, ballad, history, gospel and apocalyptic - none of these were meant to be read the same way that a person reads a grammar school text book. That would be like reading Whitman's Leaves of Grass as if it were a Chinese food menu. If you don't account for the nuances of poetry, the message is not going to get across.

 

[JacobLaw]

Wise move my friend. YSM's use of spurious texts and her quack beliefs simply cannot contend with the true reality of God's cosmos - the Earth revolves around the sun, this solar system is in the Orion arm of the Milky Way galaxy which is part of the local group in the Virgo Supercluster.

That's the way it is, and if she wants to plug her fingers in her ears and shout "la-la-la", well she's welcome to live within that fantasy.



I think you ought to report him, bro. His insolence is going unchecked and is deserving of staff action.



As long as you recognize that our beliefs are biblical as well, then there's no problem. The issue arises when one party asserts that their beliefs are biblical while the others is not. It boils down to interpretation, individuals like sculley and myself see both sides as interpreting the same scriptures differently.

Our belief in the bible as a whole is no less than yours, we just understand that the scriptures are written in a variety of different literary forums like poetry, ballad, history, gospel and apocalyptic - none of these were meant to be read the same way that a person reads a grammar school text book. That would be like reading Whitman's Leaves of Grass as if it were a Chinese food menu. If you don't account for the nuances of poetry, the message is not going to get across.

Obviously that is what the discussion is about, there is many many discussion of different biblical beliefs; one believes they are right and the others are wrong; except in this case it like it seems to be we are not allowed to believe you are wrong, why?
I don't like how the threat of being reported for what I feel is true, while it is perfectly all right for other to purposely cause trouble and harassed Geocentric Christians as being unchristian for our beliefs because it insinuates that others many not believe the bible.
Isn't that what the apologetics of discussing biblical positions is all about, one thinks what they believe is true the other thinks believe is true, obviously both are not always going to end up agreeing, but to constantly accuses us of what you are doing is trouble making, so lets leave it that we disagree, is that OK?
Peace and May God Bless You.

 

[yeshuasavedme]

On the point of the heavens/the firmament stretched out and named two waters/sha-mayim
circling the earth every day from the beginning of creation
and being stretched out between the divided in two waters of this globe on day 2, in stories/levels
and the sun rising in the east and setting in the west day by day,
you do not believe the plain, clear, literal Word of God.
No one has to accuse you of this unbelief on these points, for you are quite adamant in declaring your unbelief in the Word on these points and declaring -with pride, rather- your belief in fallible men with false doctrines that deny the Word of God.

This post is not attacking a person, but pointing out the facts of their belief system on this subject which is not Bible doctrine, and which they are very proud of, and and also which, BTW, they have never, ever, not even once, given Scripture for their position.

There
is
not
one
single
Scripture
used
to refute
the Scripture's
Geocentric
doctrine
from
the
beginning.

And that is the point of the thread.